monkiboy January 15, 2014 Author Share January 15, 2014 (edited) i've been taking some photos lately of other member's tanks practicing so thought i'd use the momentum to take some photos of some of the frags in quarantine. i haven't lost any and a few are growing nicely with new branches and corallites. thankfully haven't found any pests in qt yet either. i'm really trying to work on the quality of photos but i think my gear just gets me by and i need to read up on some of the great articles available on DoF and perhaps getting a new body or tips on lighting so these aren't too great but better than i could do with my phone's camera i think. any tips are welcome! Edited January 15, 2014 by monkiboy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkiboy January 15, 2014 Author Share January 15, 2014 (edited) also wanted to mention thanks to evan, scott, and dave for some of the healthy and beautiful recent additions to my frag rack! looking forward to this meeting to put a ton more frags in qt to take up some of the real estate in the frag tank Edited January 15, 2014 by monkiboy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howaboutme January 15, 2014 Share January 15, 2014 (edited) You're being to critical of yourself..nice shots. What camera are you using? Are you using a macro lens? The border is a nice detail. What post processing software are you using to apply that? By the way...glad you didn't neglect your r2r one..I'm staying on top of you! Edited January 15, 2014 by howaboutme Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YHSublime January 15, 2014 Share January 15, 2014 WOW. Nice looking stuff waiting around! The photos look phenomenal. What kind of lens are you using? For me It's really hard to get close shots in focus like what you're looking for without a macro lens. Either way, it looks like you've taken what you have and used it to the full potential!I've also seen some really nice up close shots with just point and shoots, so what do I know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami January 15, 2014 Share January 15, 2014 The depth of field is very narrow. You've got a small area in sharp focus but a whole lot up close and further back that's out of focus. Can you slow the shutter speed down and close down (increase) the aperture a bit? Be sure to shut circulation down so that things aren't moving so much at the slower speeds. Also, you'll want to use a tripod with the longer exposures. Color balance looks good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Der ABT January 15, 2014 Share January 15, 2014 Very nice pics, i too am a big fan of the border. Glad to see the frags doing good and now i have a little more space (too bad i need alot more) If you dont feel like buying a macro lense look into lense filters, i have a +4 that works suprisingly well and is VERY cheap. i know they make +10 that would probably be great. FOV isnt as good as a macro but its darn close for 1/10th the price. any updated shots of the fish...beyond jealous of your wrasses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkiboy January 15, 2014 Author Share January 15, 2014 You're being to critical of yourself..nice shots. What camera are you using? Are you using a macro lens? The border is a nice detail. What post processing software are you using to apply that? By the way...glad you didn't neglect your r2r one..I'm staying on top of you! i'm using a sony a100. yes, i'm using a macro lens - a tamron 90mm 1:1 which is pretty solid and popular macro lens. post processing, haha. i wish i knew all those fancy tips and tricks in those neat programs. i'm just using aviary through photobucket, haha. i do like the border a lot and use it on all my photos in white or black depending on what's in frame. as i posted up on there, i thought of you and thought "man, i better post up on R2R first otherwise i'm going to hear about it from jack!" haha. WOW. Nice looking stuff waiting around! The photos look phenomenal. What kind of lens are you using? For me It's really hard to get close shots in focus like what you're looking for without a macro lens. Either way, it looks like you've taken what you have and used it to the full potential! I've also seen some really nice up close shots with just point and shoots, so what do I know? i agree - the macro (info above) really helps a ton and i've tried magnification filters and all sorts of tricks but a proper macro lens (even an affordable one like i have) works so much better. the right tool for the right task. i doubt i'm using what i got to its full potential, haha. i'll definitely get better as i begin to read up on the subject. my biggest hurdle was white/color balance and i finally figured that out with the setup i have. now i need to work on depth of field. this stuff just gets so confusing with all the bells and whistles these cameras come with. for some reason it seemed so much easier when i had my darkroom and shot with medium frame and small frame pentaxs on 35mm. losing hundred of photos of a trip due to overexposure sure wasn't fun but it was a lot more organic and true embodiment of art to me. The depth of field is very narrow. You've got a small area in sharp focus but a whole lot up close and further back that's out of focus. Can you slow the shutter speed down and close down (increase) the aperture a bit? Be sure to shut circulation down so that things aren't moving so much at the slower speeds. Also, you'll want to use a tripod with the longer exposures. Color balance looks good. yes! that is indeed my issue at present. i'm sure i can and will try your tips. i have no idea how to improve and plan to do a heck of a lot of reading and will try your suggestions to see if it improves the photos i take. i'll break out the tripod too. will probably help with straining over the tanks, too! Very nice pics, i too am a big fan of the border. Glad to see the frags doing good and now i have a little more space (too bad i need alot more) If you dont feel like buying a macro lense look into lense filters, i have a +4 that works suprisingly well and is VERY cheap. i know they make +10 that would probably be great. FOV isnt as good as a macro but its darn close for 1/10th the price. any updated shots of the fish...beyond jealous of your wrasses. i'm going to take a look through your FS post once it's up and i'm sure i'll grab a few more. you have a pretty nice collection and glad to have parts of it in mine, now! i'm barely making it with things that are stationary. you're going to have to give me some time to figure out how to take proper photos of the fish! videos might be better for that fun stuff anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howaboutme January 15, 2014 Share January 15, 2014 Glad you like the Tamrom 90mm. I have that on my list of options for a macro but for a nikon mount. I've heard good things about it. What aperture are you shooting the shots at? Or are you shooting in P or auto mode? I tried to look for the EXIF info but it's scrubbed clean. If you want to get more in focus, the aperture number is larger. For example, landscape photographers are shooting w/ their apertures at around 22 but you don't want to go that high. So once you figure out what you're aperture is, shoot in aperture priority and adjust that number higher by a stop or two and then experiment. Keep in mind that when you shoot in aperture priority, the camera automatically adjusts your shutter speed to compensate for your aperture in order to get a correct exposure. This is an issue because you may have slow shutter speeds and will need a tripod....If you don't have a tripod, you can set a higher ISO to help compensate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkiboy January 15, 2014 Author Share January 15, 2014 thanks for the further guidance jack. i'm shooting in auto and only have fiddled with the white balance for these photos. aperture is at 3 for all those shots and average 1/125 exposure time. what aperture do you think is a good place to be at for this kind of photography? i do have a tripod so i'll break that out and try what you and tom recommend in closing(increasing) aperture with longer shutter times. is there a reason to go aperture priority and not focus on increasing shutter speed and let the camera control the aperture instead? - simply curious or is it best to just go full manual and set all my settings once i've fiddled enough with it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howaboutme January 15, 2014 Share January 15, 2014 Start at an aperture of 5 (or 5.6) then play with it from there. You want to use aperture priority because your goal is to play with what is in focus or not (depth of field). Shutter priority is mostly used for when you want to freeze an object like sports photography or animals like birds, etc. You can also use shutter priority to create the "moving" effect of water. If you are shooting fish like your wrasses, you may want to try shutter priority. I wouldn't go fully manual because then you have to worry about both and since when you shoot corals, you don't need to worry about doing anything creative in regards to motion (especially if you turn off flow for lps or nems that move), it's way overkill. You can use the metering guide inside the viewfinder to help guide you to the correct exposure but it's just another thing to worry about. When you use aperture priority, your camera will set the shutter speed to give you accurate exposure. Of course, sometimes that's not the case and you'll have to adjust the exposure later in post processing but it's a good start. Similarly, if you use shutter priority, your camera will set your aperture to get the right exposure. The way exposure works is that when the aperture is small (in number), the lens opening is larger allowing more light. This then allows faster shutters speeds. As you increase your aperture (higher numbers), that opening in the lends gets smaller, allowing less light. In order for the camera to get a good exposure with the necessary amount of light, it has to have a slower shutter speed to keep the lens open. So as you get higher in aperture, take note of shutter speed. Anything slower than 1/60 may cause camera shake and would require a tripod. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkiboy January 15, 2014 Author Share January 15, 2014 thanks for the detail in your reply. makes complete sense and a very solid base to go from for capturing more of the frame in focus/wider DoF. thank you again, sir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ridetheducati January 15, 2014 Share January 15, 2014 Start at an aperture of 5 (or 5.6) then play with it from there. You want to use aperture priority because your goal is to play with what is in focus or not (depth of field). +1. This is key and will soften the learning curve. Can you shoot in RAW? You laugh now, but post processing is your next step. There are thousands of processing actions available, but you will use maybe five. Get GIMP its free. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkiboy January 15, 2014 Author Share January 15, 2014 +1. This is key and will soften the learning curve. Can you shoot in RAW? You laugh now, but post processing is your next step. There are thousands of processing actions available, but you will use maybe five. Get GIMP its free. yes, i can. raw and raw&jpeg at the time i guess are options. why do you ask and what do you suggest? it is easier in post processing to use RAW for some reason? i remember GIMP but it's been a while. i'll download it. great suggestions and eager to see the results. i'll post up here later tonight when i have time to play. thanks boys! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ridetheducati January 15, 2014 Share January 15, 2014 With RAW you do not lose any quality. It is like a negative, the image data. JPEG is processed prior to being written to the memory card, thus losing some quality. The down side to shooting in RAW is you have to fine tune the image, white balance, etc in post processing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howaboutme January 15, 2014 Share January 15, 2014 (edited) If you shoot in RAW, you can post process w/o degrading the photograph. You have more flexibility because the photograph is "not set", for lack of a better word. You will always work against yourself if you post process jpegs. If you do choose to do RAW, you should post process because all RAW photographs tend to be flat as they are meant to be post processed (like in a dark rook in the old film days) so you'll have to add some contrast, etc to the photos besides adjusting the color. I use Adobe Lightroom but have Photoshop, though Photoshop is overkill. Edit..Oh wow..we posted at the same time and essentially the same thing....double post, i guess. Edited January 15, 2014 by howaboutme Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkey18 January 16, 2014 Share January 16, 2014 Awesome. Some day soon I hope I will have frags as nice as that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkiboy January 16, 2014 Author Share January 16, 2014 so unfortunately my sony dslr produces .ARW RAW files. it's a pain in the butt as gimp does not open ARM files even with the latest plug-ins. i tried using rawtherapee to open and convert but it's not an efficient interface at all and then to work with it was quite annoying and slow. i'm going to try to get photoshop as i'm told it handles ARW files fine and then take an online course or a community college course in it so i can use it with some sort of proficiency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkiboy January 16, 2014 Author Share January 16, 2014 Awesome. Some day soon I hope I will have frags as nice as that. laura, come on now. you really don't give yourself enough credit. you got some real beauties in that tank of yours as if your fish room wasn't awesome enough already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BubbleHead January 16, 2014 Share January 16, 2014 Photo's look great. I can't shoot tank photo's worth a crap with a digital camera. Give me an old Canon F-1 and I can create awesome images. But pixels are cheaper than film and processing, so I'll keep working on it. The key to depth of field besides the obvious smaller aperture opening (higher f-stop) is focusing. This is hard to explain here but your depth of field will be 1/3 in front of the point you fucus on and 2/3's behind. So if your depth of field is 15 inches. Everything 5 inches in front of and 10 inches behind the point you focus on should be in acceptably sharp focus. Of course this changes with what the depth of field is and the f'stop. Hope this make sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishie January 16, 2014 Share January 16, 2014 great setup...awesome pics...and awesome choatis! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howaboutme January 16, 2014 Share January 16, 2014 so unfortunately my sony dslr produces .ARW RAW files. it's a pain in the butt as gimp does not open ARM files even with the latest plug-ins. i tried using rawtherapee to open and convert but it's not an efficient interface at all and then to work with it was quite annoying and slow. i'm going to try to get photoshop as i'm told it handles ARW files fine and then take an online course or a community college course in it so i can use it with some sort of proficiency. Every camera manufacturer has their own proprietary RAW file format. For example, Nikon is .NEF. As a result, and to prevent their customers to have to buy other software, they provide free of charge a software when you buy the camera. You should have a CD-ROM somewhere w/ that post processing software. Install that and you can convert RAW to JPEG and do post processing stuff. Just found it for you, assuming you have the "alpha" series cameras: http://support.d-imaging.sony.co.jp/www/disoft/int/idc/index.html?fm=na Don't buy Photoshop (it's actually a plugin, Adobe Camera RAW that reads RAW images, not stand alone Photoshop), it's overkill for your purposes. Get Lightroom instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkiboy January 16, 2014 Author Share January 16, 2014 Photo's look great. I can't shoot tank photo's worth a crap with a digital camera. Give me an old Canon F-1 and I can create awesome images. But pixels are cheaper than film and processing, so I'll keep working on it. The key to depth of field besides the obvious smaller aperture opening (higher f-stop) is focusing. This is hard to explain here but your depth of field will be 1/3 in front of the point you fucus on and 2/3's behind. So if your depth of field is 15 inches. Everything 5 inches in front of and 10 inches behind the point you focus on should be in acceptably sharp focus. Of course this changes with what the depth of field is and the f'stop. Hope this make sense. yes that makes sense. thank you for describing how my focus point affects my depth of field. i will use that in taking more photos. great setup...awesome pics...and awesome choatis! thanks for the comment and for following along! Every camera manufacturer has their own proprietary RAW file format. For example, Nikon is .NEF. As a result, and to prevent their customers to have to buy other software, they provide free of charge a software when you buy the camera. You should have a CD-ROM somewhere w/ that post processing software. Install that and you can convert RAW to JPEG and do post processing stuff. Just found it for you, assuming you have the "alpha" series cameras: http://support.d-imaging.sony.co.jp/www/disoft/int/idc/index.html?fm=na Don't buy Photoshop (it's actually a plugin, Adobe Camera RAW that reads RAW images, not stand alone Photoshop), it's overkill for your purposes. Get Lightroom instead. thanks jack - that worked! i don't really see the point of GIMP now though. that imagine converter software seems pretty robust. it does everything but crop my images for me. so now i was able to open my ARW (sony RAW) image files make edits to white/color balance, contrast, sharpness, etc. then output to JPEG. load up in pbucket, crop, and add frame and share. thanks a ton! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkiboy January 16, 2014 Author Share January 16, 2014 (edited) so thanks to the advice given i started experimenting and here are the results from one example. i tried to use a multi-branching frag so as to have more depth to capture and keep in focus. the results indicate an awesome success. i found working with the tripod over a tank really difficult. how is this achieved normally without putting a plank across the tank and using a miniature tripod to access anything wider (away from you) than the first 6" of the tank? thankfully my shutter speed didn't have to drop too slow as i got pretty good results at f9 (in aperture priority) which put me at 1/15 second shutter speed for the given shot below. i tried to edit the photos identically to make it easy to tell the change in depth of field. given what bubblehead shared about how my focus point changes the area of depth of field and how the f9 photo came out while focusing on the center of the acro, i know i can take the focus point and move it the point closer to me of the acro and very well get the entire colony in focus. you can see the epoxy on the bottom of the frag plug even starts to become in focus so moving the focus meter closer to me while taking the shot will keep the entire frag in focus at f9 it appears. here's the first shot at f5: here's the second shot at f9: Edited January 16, 2014 by monkiboy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howaboutme January 16, 2014 Share January 16, 2014 Looking good! I prefer the illusion of distance so I lean closer to f/5, but maybe it's something in between 5 and 9. Also experiment with focus area modes (not focus mode). Each manufacturer calls it differently so check your manual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GaryL January 16, 2014 Share January 16, 2014 it took me a few hours on and off to read this thread... well worth it!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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