Jason Rhoads October 22, 2013 Share October 22, 2013 Also, remember that Prime can detoxify Ammonia. If you see a big issue, throw some of that in there to save the fish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BowieReefer84 October 22, 2013 Share October 22, 2013 Also, remember that Prime can detoxify Ammonia. If you see a big issue, throw some of that in there to save the fish. http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1997077 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattiejay6 October 22, 2013 Share October 22, 2013 Awesome with the chevron... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roni October 22, 2013 Share October 22, 2013 Also, remember that Prime can detoxify Ammonia. If you see a big issue, throw some of that in there to save the fish. don't use prime with cupramine. increases toxicity. use the seachem ammonia badge and do a water change immediately when it starts to change color...and do larger ones if you don't have a well established biological filter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Rhoads October 22, 2013 Share October 22, 2013 Good catch on that one! No Prime! LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattiejay6 October 22, 2013 Share October 22, 2013 Don't use any chemicals while treating copper... Lol good rule of thumb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YHSublime October 22, 2013 Author Share October 22, 2013 All fish are successfully caught, and QT'd. They are all in a recommended seachem dose of 16 drops per 10.5 gallons. 1 Chevron Tang 1 Blue Eyed Kole Tang 1 Hippo Tang 1 Melanarus Wrasse 2 Clowns 4 Chromis, up for grab in the FS thread fo' free. And so begins my journey of an 8 week fallow tank, and my first time quarantining, with 6 fish, plus my 3 new additions soon to come. FML. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YHSublime October 22, 2013 Author Share October 22, 2013 (edited) Tagging along and hoping things turn out well... You have gotten alot of good advice. Sure have. Thanks for coming along, hope it doesn't disappoint! Good luck Issac, sorry to hear about all your problems the past couple weeks. Thanks, Frank. It looks like this one, if I play my cards right, will have an awesome outcome. Not without a lot of hard work though. Good catch on that one! No Prime! LOL Come on, Jason, I'm trying to keep things alive here, not the other way around! Don't use any chemicals while treating copper... Lol good rule of thumb Noted. So like I mentioned I've got all my fish in QT at the moment. Everything is in a 50 gallon rubbermaid. It looks like there is a lot of room, and I threw in some PVC for hiding, might pick up some bigger pieces for the chevron. I'm super worried about the 6 fish in the 25 gallons of water, I presume I'll be doing 10 gallon water changes a day, but I don't know yet. I'm making up 55 gallons of RO again, which I'll start mixing again tonight. This QT process is going to get expensive... and quick. I plan on adding another QT tank for the 3 tangs I'll be bringing in, and will probably do 30 gallons in that. Here's what I'm looking at About 60 gallons total water volume for QT: 20 gallon water changes a day (10 gallons each) Instant Ocean at $40 a box= 200 gallons 200 gallons/20 gallons a day is only a week and a half. It costs $40 in salt alone to QT for 1.5 weeks. $220 in salt= 8 weeks QT Not including the meds, tanks, electric, and copious amounts of time. I could use a different hobby right about now. Edited October 22, 2013 by YHSublime Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattiejay6 October 22, 2013 Share October 22, 2013 (edited) Why don't you set up a second tub and split some of the fish up to lessen that bioload? Less water changes would save you some money... Edited October 22, 2013 by Mattiejay6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattiejay6 October 22, 2013 Share October 22, 2013 What's your QT salinity btw? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanM October 22, 2013 Share October 22, 2013 Be glad you dont have kids or cats messing with your quarantine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YHSublime October 23, 2013 Author Share October 23, 2013 Why don't you set up a second tub and split some of the fish up to lessen that bioload? Less water changes would save you some money... Yep, great idea see below I plan on adding another QT tank for the 3 tangs I'll be bringing in, and will probably do 30 gallons in that. Here's what I'm looking at About 60 gallons total water volume for QT: 20 gallon water changes a day (10 gallons each) Instant Ocean at $40 a box= 200 gallons 200 gallons/20 gallons a day is only a week and a half. It costs $40 in salt alone to QT for 1.5 weeks. $220 in salt= 8 weeks QT Not including the meds, tanks, electric, and copious amounts of time. What's your QT salinity btw? 1.025 I don't want to have to worry about hypo and copper at the same time, the QT process is already enough. Be glad you dont have kids or cats messing with your quarantine. Alan, I am thanking the powers that be for not having either of those two at this stage in my life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Rhoads October 23, 2013 Share October 23, 2013 Be glad you dont have kids or cats messing with your quarantine. You hath spoken truth! The math around this hobby never makes sense, try not to think about how much this is going to cost..... Also, maybe don't change that much of the water, perhaps 5g each every 2 days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattiejay6 October 23, 2013 Share October 23, 2013 Oh no I would never do hypo with copper together.. But lowering that salinity will allow more oxygen into the water column. You can take it down to 1.015 to 1.018 and that will save some money in salt, but ultimately it is easier for the fish to breath too... Sorry I dunno how I missed your calculation of another tub lol! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kjamaya October 23, 2013 Share October 23, 2013 Well im glad it seems to be ich and MV. Just make aure you feed them with food drenched in garlie and aloe. Good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YHSublime October 23, 2013 Author Share October 23, 2013 You hath spoken truth! The math around this hobby never makes sense, try not to think about how much this is going to cost..... Also, maybe don't change that much of the water, perhaps 5g each every 2 days. Oh no I would never do hypo with copper together.. But lowering that salinity will allow more oxygen into the water column. You can take it down to 1.015 to 1.018 and that will save some money in salt, but ultimately it is easier for the fish to breath too... Sorry I dunno how I missed your calculation of another tub lol! That's a good idea, but I plan on treating with the copper for at least 4 weeks. That sounds about right? Well im glad it seems to be ich and MV. Just make aure you feed them with food drenched in garlie and aloe. Good luck Thanks! Although, the title of this thread says it all, this is an uphill battle. I'm really only on the first day of a 57 day treatment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion October 23, 2013 Share October 23, 2013 This sounds like a lot of time, effort, and cash you are using in an attempt to try and "save" a few fish. I sure as H-E-double hockey sticks don't have your motivation for such a huge endeavor. I wish you the best of luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kjamaya October 23, 2013 Share October 23, 2013 This sounds like a lot of time, effort, and cash you are using in an attempt to try and "save" a few fish. I sure as H-E-double hockey sticks don't have your motivation for such a huge endeavor. I wish you the best of luck! So do I.... I see ich I feed my fish heavily and it just goes away. Strange tho, when I added my hippo my purple immediately got ich. Maybe it's something to do with adding a new tang to a tank that has one already....I dont know but I was once told that ich is like strep or the flu. We have the strain in us waiting to be awoken..... I swear when he said that I saw him floating away hair blowing in the wind and such. Anyways good lucks again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattiejay6 October 23, 2013 Share October 23, 2013 4 weeks AFTER the last sign of ich on the fish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattiejay6 October 23, 2013 Share October 23, 2013 Fish that get stressed get ich easier. Adding anew fish to a tank isn't only stressful on the new inhabitant, but current population too.. Stress weakens their immune systen and reduces their slime coat allowing for the parasite to attach if present in the system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howaboutme October 23, 2013 Share October 23, 2013 Question on QTing at a LFS or a tank in another property.....since Isaac mentions this is how he does it. I understand that fish will get stressed during shipment/transport. I understand the need to proactively QT for those that do. The question is, how does QTing at a LFS or a friends tank elsewhere make sense? After the QT period, you are still transporting the fish (albeit not as far nor as long) and still going through the process of catching, then bagging or containering, transporting and then introduction to another foreign environment. Doesn't that in it of itself cause a certain amount of stress? Enough stress that may allow any ich present to show itself? This question may also be relevant for QTing at home but to an even lesser extent. (Just to be clear, I'm not referring to treating after the fact though the question is still relevant in that case too but the meds used (and their toxicity to inverts, etc far outweigh any concerns I have addressed here.) Opinions on this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattiejay6 October 23, 2013 Share October 23, 2013 Question on QTing at a LFS or a tank in another property.....since Isaac mentions this is how he does it. I understand that fish will get stressed during shipment/transport. I understand the need to proactively QT for those that do. The question is, how does QTing at a LFS or a friends tank elsewhere make sense? After the QT period, you are still transporting the fish (albeit not as far nor as long) and still going through the process of catching, then bagging or containering, transporting and then introduction to another foreign environment. Doesn't that in it of itself cause a certain amount of stress? Enough stress that may allow any ich present to show itself? This question may also be relevant for QTing at home but to an even lesser extent. (Just to be clear, I'm not referring to treating after the fact though the question is still relevant in that case too but the meds used (and their toxicity to inverts, etc far outweigh any concerns I have addressed here.) Opinions on this? Good Question..here is my 2 cents.. The reason that stress becomes a factor with ich is if the parasite is in your aquarium or on encysted on the fish. So when you first start up a fish tank with dry rock, sand etc.. and you throw a piece of feed rock in there.. that once piece of rock could possibly have the ich parasite encysted on it from where ever it came from. How ever once it hatches and goes through its life cycle with no fish to host on it will eventually die off from the tank completely. With the idea of having a sterile tank with out these or other parasites,worms etc.. is why we quarantine... We can introduce a recently QT'd fish to a hopefully sterile system and not go through the above type problems.. There is alot of gaps and holes in this to where someone can go wrong. Most healthy fish can fight off the parasite with their slime coat and ich cant bore into them.. thats where stress comes into play.. (Stress can play a big role into alot of things when it comes to getting a new fish..not just disease) There is no one set of a defintive pre treatment/QT protocol. Everyone has what they beleive is correct or their all in one treatment.. I do like the idea of pre medicated treatment how ever the other 2 big goals of QT is to just observe the fish for any signs of illness or parasites which would hopefully present themselves in the time you alot for QT.. atleast 4 weeks.. then if you discover something you can treat it appropriately.. another good reason for QT is acclimating fish to different food.. pellets, frozen(mysis, brine, roggers,larry,rods) etc... If you go to live aquarias website they lay it out perfect why QT is recommended and how they do it exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YHSublime October 23, 2013 Author Share October 23, 2013 This sounds like a lot of time, effort, and cash you are using in an attempt to try and "save" a few fish. I sure as H-E-double hockey sticks don't have your motivation for such a huge endeavor. I wish you the best of luck! Well, don't applaud me yet on it. I'm home sick today (yuck) but can't imagine what the next 8 weeks might begin to look like. I've already had my ammonia spike all while trying to mix 55 gallons of saltwater up. I started mixing at 5am, and just replaced 5 gallons at 11am, hopefully enough time to mix. The Chevron has lost all signs off any coating, or white spots, almost immediately. This is not a fools wishful thinking, as soon as he hit the copper bath, it was fairly amazing. Fish that get stressed get ich easier. Adding anew fish to a tank isn't only stressful on the new inhabitant, but current population too.. Stress weakens their immune systen and reduces their slime coat allowing for the parasite to attach if present in the system. Such as tangs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattiejay6 October 23, 2013 Share October 23, 2013 copper is amazing and dangerous all at the same time... chevrons are pretty hardy too.. yea you have some big fish in that container and it isnt really cycled so im sure your gonna have some ammonia problems.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sachabballi reef October 23, 2013 Share October 23, 2013 god my yellow belly gets a few spots if I go too long between feedings LOL...tangs are brutal ...they stress so easily...its like their automatic response to being stressed even if there is no new additions...as soon as my YB eats the spots literally go away...I wonder if most of the time its even anything like ich but we all assume it is....seems impossible to me that within an hour of eating its totally normal, i wonder if it is something else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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