TrueTricia April 1, 2014 Share April 1, 2014 So I've started this thread to document my tank build and to solicit advice from all of you guys! So with that being said, let me set the scene. I've got a 90g tank & stand. The 90g tank is pre-drilled with 3/4" fittings. Below the tank will be my sump. Right now it's a 40B tank with 2 compartments. I'll be putting in my skimmer and a phos/reactor. And a return pump. I won't have a fish room, so I have to plumb this so I don't need to access it to do the basics. I would prefer to use flex-pvc to reduce the noise. But if not, I also put together a hard PVC plumbing plan. So here's my hard PVC plan. II plan to put a Durso drain on one pipe. After the 90 street union/durso drain, I'm going to put a union coupling so if I ever need to change things, I can take it apart without sawing off the bulkheads. Then run the pipe down until 2 x 45 elbows, running the pipe to the center to meet up with a tee coupling. I'll run the pipe down until it sits below the stand lip. Then I'll connect it to a gate union for flow control. And then finally the remainder of the pipe will run down to the sump. Here's my Flex PVC plan. It's basically the same as the hard PVC but just a few less turning connectors. Additionally, I'm hoping someone can identify my pump for me! I got it when I bought my 40g tank. Can anyone tell me what kind this is? That will help me figure out what the flow rate is for the return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zygote2k April 1, 2014 Share April 1, 2014 I can plumb it for you if you buy the fittings. You'll also need to have some sort of bubble trap to eliminate the gurgle associated with submerged drains in sumps. I even have a ready made 'drain box' that takes care of this. You just silicone it into the sump. Generally speaking when 2 pipes go into a T, then the subsequent pipe will be bigger to handle the flow from 2 smaller pipes. No need for a union on the drain. PVC is cheap- cut it and buy new. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rrbigdog April 1, 2014 Share April 1, 2014 The pump looks like the Mag Model 2. See specs. 250gph http://www.pondpumpdepot.com/subcat270.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott_LM April 1, 2014 Share April 1, 2014 Your pump is a Mag drive 2. 200 GPH. You will want to get something larger for a 90. I recommend against the Tee. Run two separate returns to your sump and 2 dursos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuffyGeos April 1, 2014 Share April 1, 2014 Tricia- I think that pump is a Danner Mag-Drive Supreme 2 -250 GPH Water Pump....but I could be wrong. It is definitely a Mag drive. If that is your return pump you may want something larger. At 4' of head it will only put out about 130gph +/-. Depending on what turnover you want (let an expert- not me- chime in) 8-10 times? You will need a bigger pump (Mag 12?) part of that depends on what you are going to keep in the tank. I like the plan, way to go getting it started! I have your sand! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YHSublime April 1, 2014 Share April 1, 2014 Yeah, that's a mag 2 pump, save that for mixing your water. You'll want to invest in something a bit larger, I would say DuffyGeos got it about right with a mag 12, if those are the pumps you want to go with. I would also take Zygote2K up on his offer. Nice start planning it out, that's the hardest part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueTricia April 1, 2014 Author Share April 1, 2014 Tricia- I think that pump is a Danner Mag-Drive Supreme 2 -250 GPH Water Pump....but I could be wrong. It is definitely a Mag drive. If that is your return pump you may want something larger. At 4' of head it will only put out about 130gph +/-. Depending on what turnover you want (let an expert- not me- chime in) 8-10 times? You will need a bigger pump (Mag 12?) part of that depends on what you are going to keep in the tank. I like the plan, way to go getting it started! I have your sand! I think I read on Reefkeeper.com that you want 3-5x your total gallons in flow, which according to that formula, would make mine in need of at least a 270 gph. And I made a plan because all of you convinced me this was the way to go. I'm stubborn, but I do listen! lol Yeah, that's a mag 2 pump, save that for mixing your water. You'll want to invest in something a bit larger, I would say DuffyGeos got it about right with a mag 12, if those are the pumps you want to go with. I would also take Zygote2K up on his offer. Nice start planning it out, that's the hardest part. What do you guys think about the Enheim Compact 2000 adjustable flow? And yes, I already PM'd Rob!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave w April 1, 2014 Share April 1, 2014 Rob's the best when it comes to plumbing a sump, he can probably do one with his eyes closed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davelin315 April 1, 2014 Share April 1, 2014 Durso standpipes run off the concept that the line is reduced at one point in the drain. This is one part of why they are so quiet. Dual drains may achieve this but could also cause some issues with it. The gate valve could remedy this, but I have never been a fan of restricting flow in a drain. I would simply use a couple of upturned 90s. The 90 you saw at my house used dual drains (1.5") and I think a Mag 5 or 7 and it is dialed back a bit. Turnover is a good starting point but looking at how it works in the actual set up is more important. I personally go with the most flow that is practical for the inhabitants and disperse it with variable returns and different return nozzles as you saw on the 300. Look at what your aqua scape calls for and choose a pump based on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Der ABT April 1, 2014 Share April 1, 2014 Glad you started this, man that stand is just BEAUTIFUL when i ran it i had two inputs into the sump. i used a mag 9.5 but had to throttle it back with a ball valve so a mag 7 or so would probably be plenty...if you drill it out to 1 in pipe (which is easy i just didnt have time when i set it up a while back) it would handle more flow just fine. id use a sanitary T off the back of the tank (i actually may still have mine, if i find them they are yours) that went and used 1 in piping anyways..did pretty good noise wise. otherwise keep the updates coming Rob is good with plumbing and many other things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueTricia April 1, 2014 Author Share April 1, 2014 (edited) It's a beautiful stand! I just haven't taken any pictures of it yet! Evan was kind enough to sell me his stand (which he has a build thread for somewhere) and his 90 g tank. The tank needed some TLC but it's great for me. So here are the before and after pictures... Dave also gave me a bunch of rocks from his collection. Since I live in an apt with a roommate (who loves my fish but not the space being taken over), I didn't have room to cure the rocks in large tubs, and I needed to be able to work on the tank itself. I also had already dedicated my 2 tubs to other things. One is a qt tank for some fish, and the other I needed to move water around from one place to the other. So I threw them in my bathtub, covered them with some water, and just showered at work. Not the perfect curing method I know, but they'll get in the tank and some saltwater soon enough! Half of them are currently in the 90g tank as of yesterday! Edited April 1, 2014 by truetricia2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YHSublime April 1, 2014 Share April 1, 2014 I'm so glad you got Evans tank as well, that will be a lot safer than the other one your were mentioning. Also, sweet cheetah towel! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuffyGeos April 1, 2014 Share April 1, 2014 It's a beautiful stand! I just haven't taken any pictures of it yet! Evan was kind enough to sell me his stand (which he has a build thread for somewhere) and his 90 g tank. The tank needed some TLC but it's great for me. So here are the before and after pictures... Dave also gave me a bunch of rocks from his collection. Since I live in an apt with a roommate (who loves my fish but not the space being taken over), I didn't have room to cure the rocks in large tubs, and I needed to be able to work on the tank itself. I also had already dedicated my 2 tubs to other things. One is a qt tank for some fish, and the other I needed to move water around from one place to the other. So I threw them in my bathtub, covered them with some water, and just showered at work. Not the perfect curing method I know, but they'll get in the tank and some saltwater soon enough! Half of them are currently in the 90g tank as of yesterday! Now that is dedication! Giving up your shower at home to keep your rock!! I like it! Can I get a Oorah!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattiejay6 April 1, 2014 Share April 1, 2014 I love the rock in the shower! :-) keep up the good work Tricia! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkiboy April 1, 2014 Share April 1, 2014 glad to see a build thread and yes, much happier you got evan's tank than one riddled with potential issues down the road. rob's offer is a great one and hopefully you two can make that happen as he'll set you up proper. keep us updated! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueTricia April 2, 2014 Author Share April 2, 2014 (edited) Ok. Since you guys are great at giving advice, I thought I'd ask for some! I'm looking to buy a return pump. I want to keep between 300-500 gph on the flow rate for my tank. I wasn't planning on building anything fancy for my return plumbing, other than possibly a recirculation arm if needed to manage flow. I'd read that putting a gate valve on your return flow can seriously overwork your pump's motor, lead to heat build up, and just generally not be as good as buying the right pump for your set up. So that being said, I plan on running the skimmer and a phos reactor(with pump) in my sump. I had originally planned on just doing the phos reactor as a hob of the sump style. I guess I could pipe it in, but I really want to keep my plumbing neat (again, no fish room). So my question(s) to you guys. I'm debating between different pumps. Which one, taking into account the above information, would you recommend? 1. Eheim 2000 with adjustable flow (or 3000 if plumbing in the phos reactor) 2. Mag 5 or 7 3. Jebao DC6000 (which has crazy high flow on its max, but I'm not sure what the minimum is) 4. The random pump that you're going to tell me is better than these (and hopefully have a spare used one that you'll sell me) Edited April 2, 2014 by truetricia2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smallreef April 2, 2014 Share April 2, 2014 eheims are okay...but if you are staying in this hobby...you will probably upgrade the size of your tank in the future...id got with a DC pump... i love my waveline 12k on my 150g tank...you can turn them all down really low..and even with it up higher, you can cut the need for additional powerheads down...i have 2 in my tank...where in the last 150g i had 4 powerheads with a lesser powered pump... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rrbigdog April 2, 2014 Share April 2, 2014 I think you will end up wanting more flow than you are anticipating. I have a Mag 9.5 on my 65g but I ordered a DC6000 to replace it. I find the Mag just introduces too much heat in the tank. The specs on the Jebao says low is 475gph so it gives you room to crank it up if you need more flow. My Jebao DC6000 will be delivered today....can't wait to test it out... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YHSublime April 2, 2014 Share April 2, 2014 I run the dc6000 on full. IMO it would be a good choice for your 90, with controller for speed you can dial it up or down. A mag 8-12 will be the cheaper option though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LanksTank April 2, 2014 Share April 2, 2014 (edited) I've always heard that the general rule of thumb for flow is that you want 10x your total volume. 3-5x your flow seem way too low to me. On my 90 gal I was using a MagDrive 18, which I had running in my sump under my tank. If noise is a concern I wouldn't go with a MagDrive though because they hum alot even when I had Styrofoam under mine. You need to consider the loss of flow due to your plumbing as well. For about every foot (height) of water pumped, you lose about 100 gph of flow. A MagDrive 2 would barely pump water the height of your tank. Plus you lose flow for every fitting you place. If you only have two 3/4 inch gravity drains going from your tank to your sump, the maximum flow you could have would only be around 800 gph before you were pumping more water than you could drain. In my opinion it is always better to get a slightly bigger pump than you need cause you can always add a valve to tune down the flow, but if you buy a smaller pump then there's not much you can do (I learned the hard way). Check out this website on plumbing basics: http://www.reefaquarium.com/2012/aquarium-plumbing-basics/ Edited April 2, 2014 by LanksTank Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami April 2, 2014 Share April 2, 2014 I like a sump turnover rate of 3-6x. This allows contact time for filtration and settlement time for particulate debris. You can go higher, but it depends in part on what equipment you have in the sump and the sump volume and design. You don't want a rushing river there. I've had as high as 10x. Flow inside the tank should be higher and is normally accommodated using power heads. A DC pump would be my suggestion as you can dial it back electronically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami April 2, 2014 Share April 2, 2014 BTW, Coral Magazine's Daniel Knop wrote in the March/April 2012 edition on flow through filter tanks (aka sumps). His advice was as little as 1x was sufficient but offered more advice in the article. I believe that I have that edition at home. I can probably copy the article. Will you be at the meeting? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueTricia April 3, 2014 Author Share April 3, 2014 BTW, Coral Magazine's Daniel Knop wrote in the March/April 2012 edition on flow through filter tanks (aka sumps). His advice was as little as 1x was sufficient but offered more advice in the article. I believe that I have that edition at home. I can probably copy the article. Will you be at the meeting? I will be at the meeting, and I would love to read that article! Thank you! I may not be able to swing the DC pump now, but at the very least, I can plan ahead for the future. Thank you all for the advice! You guys are the best!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueTricia April 3, 2014 Author Share April 3, 2014 This is as much for me as for anything... Equipment to pick up at meeting: 1. 40B Sump - Marco 2. ASM GS2 Skimmer - Dave S 3. Hydor Centrifugal 720gph Pump - Cliff 4. T5 Lights - Bill 5. Phos Reactor - Greg 6. Sand & Crushed Coral - Ken Other: 1. Koralia 1400 - Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motti April 3, 2014 Share April 3, 2014 My .02$ on the dc6000, i am using that pump in my mixing station, and to pump water from the water storage to the sump. The cool thing about that pump is that you can control the intensity of the pump, it has several levels. Currently i run it at full speed and it's completely silent! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now