Reef Rescue 911

[DuffyGeos]

Should WAMAS have a Public Forum for Emergencies?  The purpose of the forum would be if someone is having an "event" like I did  today and think that they might screw up their entire system, or really not sure what is the best solution. You could post it a thread if you really had a problem.

 

My problem today was " Nem just got sucked into Vortech"

 

I had a response in 8 min (thanks Ben), and 14 min (thanks Isaac). That could be the difference between a tank crashing, and a rescue. We should call it Reef Rescue 911.

 

So if someone posted, they could get instant help

 

"10:00p and my tank just cracked, anyone willing to help with extra tanks/ containers, and water"

 

Then people could sign up to follow the topic, if they were willing to help online or in person.

 

It seems like it could help a lot of people in a tough situation. You could only post in it if you were really worried about a major problem vs. had a question or were curious. This would allow people to sign up to follow, without the fear of getting pinged every couple hours on a general discussion.

 

What do you think?

[Kevnjeep]

I like it

[Squishie89]

I think that sounds brilliant.

[gmerek2]

WAMAS doesn't like change. There are all sorts of good ideas for new forums but there would get to be too many. Good idea!

[Cheshireboxers]

Great idea how and who do you need to talk to to get this implemented and maybe you could get a pettition of people to back your proposal to possible bring up at next meeting and have it implemented I would first send to all the board members example President and go down from there and see how that goes and if you don't get a good result see how it could be on the agenda for the next meeting. Hope this helps.

[PK3]

While it sounds like a great idea, think about how each of you view the forums on a daily basis. There are some that you frequent often, and others that you haven't clicked in weeks (if ever). I would venture to guess that the two most popular forums are the "for sale" and "general discussion" forums. If you really had an emergency, wouldn't you want to post in the forum that would be exposed to the most number of people/views? If so, then post in the "general discussion" forum. Emergencies don't occur that frequently, so the forum would result in infrequent new threads and be generally unused outside of a flurry of posts whenever an emergency does arise. This lack of new activity would cause people not to check in on the forum frequently, thereby defeating the purpose of getting the thread in front of the most number of people possible to help out. Just my opinion.

[davelin315]

WAMAS doesn't like change. There are all sorts of good ideas for new forums but there would get to be too many. Good idea!

That's an unfair assertion. WAMAS is open to many changes and does this all the time, but all proposed changes need to be vetted. Many of the proposals have come up or been implemented before, but we often find that these do not work out as planned. We work very hard to balance the interests of our ever expanding club and try and implement changes that bring value to the community. If you look at our track record over the past 10 years you'll see a variety of changes and a balanced approach to them. It is what has allowed us to grow and prosper and give back to the community.

 

In terms of too many forums, you are right, we get a lot of complaints about how many forums we have and general members don't even see half of them. We consider the merits of each forum and also of pinning threads and try and do so with ease of use in mind.

[davelin315]

By the way, if you look in the Welcome Forum there is an emergency supply list thread from 2004 that was pinned at some point and then unpinned because no one used it. There's also threads in this forum that have been pinned about what to do in emergencies.

 

I am not saying this idea is a bad one, just that there have been similar attempts before and things like this do exist already. A separate for, as mentioned, might not give the best exposure as evidenced by how pinned threads get overlooked all the time.

[HgrReefs]

While it sounds like a great idea, think about how each of you view the forums on a daily basis. There are some that you frequent often, and others that you haven't clicked in weeks (if ever). I would venture to guess that the two most popular forums are the "for sale" and "general discussion" forums. If you really had an emergency, wouldn't you want to post in the forum that would be exposed to the most number of people/views? If so, then post in the "general discussion" forum. Emergencies don't occur that frequently, so the forum would result in infrequent new threads and be generally unused outside of a flurry of posts whenever an emergency does arise. This lack of new activity would cause people not to check in on the forum frequently, thereby defeating the purpose of getting the thread in front of the most number of people possible to help out. Just my opinion.

Wait, people still use computers to access forums? JK

 

Personally, I think the idea is great. I only utilize a mobile device when using club forums like this and take advantage of Tapatalk's timeline feature. Makes life so much easier than sorting through the categorized forums. In my case, a tank emergency forum would be kind of nice, as I check the timeline quite frequently.

[dbartco]

I too mainly use the timeline on mobile  or "new posts" on the laptop, as do many (most?) others. I am probably old school and say we have too many forums already to sort through, so I just use the filter to get the latest discussions in one listing. Really doesn't matter to me the forum thread is posted in, just that it shows up . If I see a thread title with a title like:

 

!!!!EMERGENCY HELP NEEDED!!!! Tank Crash....

 

 

I am going to go to it no matter what forum it is under knowing someone needs help. If you feel we need new forums, fine, but I personally don't think it would solve problems faster than a post in general. Honestly, if I need help asap, I would post in FS where so many subscribe, and would immediately see it. Then take my reminder for posting in the wrong section and plead ignorance to the moderation.  By that time, hopefully emergency averted.

[DuffyGeos]

I like it

Thank you, I was greatful for the help I received today and thought this would be a good idea.

 

I think that sounds brilliant.

 

Thanks!

WAMAS doesn't like change. There are all sorts of good ideas for new forums but there would get to be too many. Good idea!

 

Change is hard for a lot of people, but I think this is something that might help many in their time of need. (me yesterday)

[DuffyGeos]

Great idea how and who do you need to talk to to get this implemented and maybe you could get a pettition of people to back your proposal to possible bring up at next meeting and have it implemented I would first send to all the board members example President and go down from there and see how that goes and if you don't get a good result see how it could be on the agenda for the next meeting. Hope this helps.

 

Ok

 

While it sounds like a great idea, think about how each of you view the forums on a daily basis. There are some that you frequent often, and others that you haven't clicked in weeks (if ever). I would venture to guess that the two most popular forums are the "for sale" and "general discussion" forums. If you really had an emergency, wouldn't you want to post in the forum that would be exposed to the most number of people/views? If so, then post in the "general discussion" forum. Emergencies don't occur that frequently, so the forum would result in infrequent new threads and be generally unused outside of a flurry of posts whenever an emergency does arise. This lack of new activity would cause people not to check in on the forum frequently, thereby defeating the purpose of getting the thread in front of the most number of people possible to help out. Just my opinion.

 

This is why you would have to follow the Forum if you were willing to help with knowledge or physical help. If you got pinged from the 911 forum you know someone is having a big problem and not "why is my nitrate high" issue. This is not suppose to be a "high volume" forum, I don't follow the General Disussion Forum since I don't want to get pinged all the time. I go there when I have free time  or just want to read about different topics.

[DuffyGeos]

By the way, if you look in the Welcome Forum there is an emergency supply list thread from 2004 that was pinned at some point and then unpinned because no one used it. There's also threads in this forum that have been pinned about what to do in emergencies.

 

I am not saying this idea is a bad one, just that there have been similar attempts before and things like this do exist already. A separate for, as mentioned, might not give the best exposure as evidenced by how pinned threads get overlooked all the time.

 

I probably saw the emergency list earlier and that is why I had the Ammonium Alert on hand. Along with having saltwater and freshwater mixed and on hand. I don't know how many people know about the list, or how everyone else spends their time looking in the forums, but since I feel I am still learning a lot getting set up I would definitely pay attention to a 911 Forum knowing that maybe I have 30-100 members signed up and are wiling to help or give advice when I am freaking out. There are 35 members signed up for General Discussion, I would think that 30-100 would sign up if it was brought up and attention was paid to it. New members would be told about it and how to use it just like a 911 call, you don't use it unless you think you might lose your tank or a large part of it.

 

Wait, people still use computers to access forums? JK

 

Personally, I think the idea is great. I only utilize a mobile device when using club forums like this and take advantage of Tapatalk's timeline feature. Makes life so much easier than sorting through the categorized forums. In my case, a tank emergency forum would be kind of nice, as I check the timeline quite frequently.

 

The 911 Forum would only be helpful if we can get people to sign up to follow. If you are just browsing it probably would be too late for most "events" , not that you couldn't

[DuffyGeos]

I too mainly use the timeline on mobile  or "new posts" on the laptop, as do many (most?) others. I am probably old school and say we have too many forums already to sort through, so I just use the filter to get the latest discussions in one listing. Really doesn't matter to me the forum thread is posted in, just that it shows up . If I see a thread title with a title like:

 

!!!!EMERGENCY HELP NEEDED!!!! Tank Crash....

 

 

I am going to go to it no matter what forum it is under knowing someone needs help. If you feel we need new forums, fine, but I personally don't think it would solve problems faster than a post in general. Honestly, if I need help asap, I would post in FS where so many subscribe, and would immediately see it. Then take my reminder for posting in the wrong section and plead ignorance to the moderation.  By that time, hopefully emergency averted.

OK, so the next time I have something like this I will just post in General Discussion, TOTM, For Sale, and SWAP- "Help" and ask for forgiveness later and say " Doug our past pres. told me to do it"

[YHSublime]

It's also helpful to know some of your local reefers. Get the numbers of people you know you can count on in an emergency, and vice versa. Plus a random cry for help is often answered quickly already, jmo. Look at your experience.

[dbartco]

No, I said plead ignorance! No blaming me! You get my point, most (I think) that you probably be looking for help from (those with eyes constantly on the boards), don't use the forums in that way (poking through individual forums). Putting up new forums is easy, hitting the correct and timely audience for your emergency is slightly different. If FS and Gen Discussion are the most popular read and watched forums, I'd want it there.  

 

Would I subscribe if it were out there? Probably, as long as it wasn't too much crying wolf (and not saying it would not be an emergency to the poster, but what defines and emergency to the reader?)) 

 

So I guess you'd you'd say I'm indifferent, but think there are just as easy ways to reach out.

[Orion]

Odds are that if you have an emergency, someone has probably had a similar experience before and posted about it.

One quick way to do a search is through google. In the search bar type in -

 

Anemone sucked into powerhead site:wamas.org

 

I find using "site:wamas.org" or "site:reefcentral.com" to do searches turns up more accurate results.

[Origami]

I'm always willing to listen to suggestions and to give them fair consideration. Or, at least I try. That's how we got things like the LFS map on the site, sponsor auctions, and sponsor group buys.

 

Adding forums is not always the best way to approach something, though, as it does clutter up the main page. That's a "cost" and would have to be balanced against both "benefit" and "frequency of use" in my way of thinking. It also leaves an awful lot to the person making the original post to accurately identify and characterize what is their emergency. (For example, as you might have gleaned from my response to your situation where the anemone was sucked into a powerhead, it might not have been the kind of emergency on par with a tank meltdown (I say this having had the same thing happen to one of my BTA's in the past).) A benefit of this kind of forum, though, would be to concentrate these concerning and befuddling situations in a manner that makes it easier for people to find, research, and learn about what they should be concerned about and what they might do to either avoid or prepare their own situations for a proper response in the event that it happens to them.

 

I'll be the first to admit that our site is not the best organized to move into the future given the number of posts that we have and get, and the spectrum of topics that we routinely discuss. I promise that we'll take a look at that more closely in the future, even though it potentially means a lot of work. It may not be tomorrow, or the day after, but we'll look at it. This idea has merit and might be considered either separately or as part of a potentially larger reorganization.

[DuffyGeos]

I'm always willing to listen to suggestions and to give them fair consideration. Or, at least I try. That's how we got things like the LFS map on the site, sponsor auctions, and sponsor group buys.

 

Adding forums is not always the best way to approach something, though, as it does clutter up the main page. That's a "cost" and would have to be balanced against both "benefit" and "frequency of use" in my way of thinking. It also leaves an awful lot to the person making the original post to accurately identify and characterize what is their emergency. (For example, as you might have gleaned from my response to your situation where the anemone was sucked into a powerhead, it might not have been the kind of emergency on par with a tank meltdown (I say this having had the same thing happen to one of my BTA's in the past).) A benefit of this kind of forum, though, would be to concentrate these concerning and befuddling situations in a manner that makes it easier for people to find, research, and learn about what they should be concerned about and what they might do to either avoid or prepare their own situations for a proper response in the event that it happens to them.

 

I'll be the first to admit that our site is not the best organized to move into the future given the number of posts that we have and get, and the spectrum of topics that we routinely discuss. I promise that we'll take a look at that more closely in the future, even though it potentially means a lot of work. It may not be tomorrow, or the day after, but we'll look at it. This idea has merit and might be considered either separately or as part of a potentially larger reorganization.

 

thanks Tom- I guess if there was a know pinned section for emergencies then I would have gone to it and looked up "Nem in Powerhead" and would have followed the instructions.

 

Such as;

 

1- remove nem and pieces of nem.

2- make sure you have saltwater mixed and ready for a 25% water change, and more ion the next couple days.

3- start running carbon

4- install an ammonium Alert, or check ammonium every 12 hours.

5- test all parameters

6- find a bottle of Amquel or Prime (you should have these on hand in general for emergencies)

7- monitor fish and corals for any changes

8- shot of vodka (this was from DCReefer1964. I don't know what me taking a shot of vodka would do for the tank, but it did steady my nerves). Yes I know it was for the tank, but I did not know how much for my tank.

 

I received all of these tips from members in the last 24 hours.

[lnevo]

As an outsider looking in, it would seem to me that your emergency needs were met just fine with the forum layout as is. You were able to get help within 8 minutes as you said. That's quicker than most tech support calls. Just saying that it seems the WAMAS task force was there and ready and problem was solved. What benefit would a dedicated forum serve except for after the fact research and archiving?

[Origami]

^^ Yeah, you can do all that, but do you really need to? An anemone has very little actual biomass. It's not at all like a fish of comparable size which has a lot of material that can decay. My BTA, when it wandered into a pump was probably a good 6-7 inches across. Coming out of the pump, it was about the size of a quarter. That's not because it was shredded and dumped across the tank. No, it was just that that was about as much biomass as there was once the thing had deflated nearly completely. My incident occurred in a 180-gallon tank with about 250+ gallons in-system (because of the extra tanks that I had running behind the scenes). What I'm trying to say is that it's the (non-water) mass of the creature that's important (as well as the volume of water that you have in the system and the maturity of the biological filter) when considering how much of an effect it can have on your tank's chemistry. It's great to have all that on hand and to do all of that, but it might have been just as valid to wait, observe, and react as the situation demanded.

 

Each situation is unique, but may have parallels to other battles that we've all, collectively, fought. My situation involved a BTA and a mature system. Looking back on it, my risk seemed minimal and the reaction was minimal, too: Isolation, observation, and preparation. Other people's situations might involve some other species whose risks are different. I don't know. In those cases, the response may be different. I'm not saying that an aggressive response isn't called for. I'm just saying that it's not always called for. And, in those times that we do react aggressively, we often do so because the risk of disrupting an otherwise-stable system outweighs the risks of riding it out. Sometimes, and possibly even counter-intuitively, riding it out is the best course of action. It's this balance that each aquarist is called to assess in many situations that defies a checklist approach.

 

Carbon, by the way, is almost always a good idea if there's a risk of some organic toxin in the water.

[AlanM]

For my 2 cents... I try to post in the correct forum when I put something up, but honestly, when I read I have no idea what forum it's posted in.  I only read via the "View New Content" link on the page.  Then I can limit what new content I see from the selections on the left.  I can't stand tapatalk or the mobile view, so I do what I can to not use those, even on mobile browsers.  So even if there were 100 forums I wouldn't know or care too much about what went where.

[howaboutme]

.....I'm just saying that it's not always called for. And, in those times that we do react aggressively, we often do so because the risk of disrupting an otherwise-stable system outweighs the risks of riding it out. Sometimes, and possibly even counter-intuitively, riding it out is the best course of action. It's this balance that each aquarist is called to assess in many situations that defies a checklist approach.

 

Nice write up, Tom, in particular the quoted text. I am a firm believer of this. I think overreaction is one of the biggest pitfalls. When I read any "help" type of thread on any forum, it often includes a sentence that is similar to this, "My tank is (this or that), so I did (this or that) and as a result my tank crashed!"

 

It only takes a few of these situations to make a lot of us in the hobby believe that particular situation is the absolute resultant of any action.

 

I also agree that for those that follow the forums regularly, it doesn't matter where you post, it'll be seen. It's more about who's available to see it at any given time.

[YHSublime]

I also agree that for those that follow the forums regularly, it doesn't matter where you post, it'll be seen. It's more about who's available to see it at any given time.

This is what it comes down to

[JR-Tanked150]

I think if its in the general forum and the title states "Help or Emergency and the time" they a lot of members would still see it and read it.