Roni's 270 gallon upgrade

[roni]

This will likely be sporadically updated as it's probably about 2 months away from being a reality but since I sent in my order for the tank, figured I'd start.

 

Hardware:

 

Tank 72 x 36 W x 24 T Miracles rimless tank. I'm doing 2 internal overflows, offset about 1 ft from each end. Thought about an external overflow but the space we're putting the tank would make the tank jut out a little too much. The stand will be built by one of the master carpenters on here, YBNormal. He's already at work with some awesome ideas.

 

Lighting I debated LEDs and LED/T5 combos for a while. I would have gotten an LED/T5 combo if I could have but will instead do a 10 x 80 Powermodule as I've found the best color under LEDs. I will miss the shimmer from LEDs and metal halide but the expensive/heat respectively made T5 the best choice for me.

 

Filtration Protein skimming will be accomplished with an SRO 5000 XP cone skimmer with the Bubbleblaster 5000 pump. This thing is huge and has gotten great reviews from everyone that uses it. I'll also be using an SMR1 media reactor for biopellets and running carbon within a Avast reactor as needed. I'm debating running bacteria such as MB7 or microlift in addition to the pellets, as most people with long term success seem to do that. The problem is that I'd like to run UV as well, which is problematic. For now, I'll likely plumb both in line and only run UV if/when there is a disease outbreak

 

Water Motion I'm a big fan of lots of varying types of water motion. For the return, I'm going with a Reeflo Hammerhead Gold which will feed the reactors, frag tank, fuge, and 2 1" returns. I expect about 2000 GPH to the main tank. I'm also going with 2 6105 Tunzes in the front corners, and MP60 on random on one end, and a Tunze Wavebox along the backwall. I plan on cycling the Tunzes with an Apex controller and letting the MP60 just stay on reef crest mode or nutrient export mode. I love the up and down water motion that the wavebox provides and with it oriented along the width of the tank, expect a 1" wave at most, which will help with the rimless tank. I had originally looked at doing the Bean Animal overflow with a single external but have settled on 2 1.5" Dursos with an extra 1.5" standpipe in each overflow as a failsafe. If the flow is a little too much, I'll likely dial back the Hammerhead.

 

Controller Apex with 1 EB8 and 1 DC8

 

Support Most of the guts of the system will be in a fishroom I recently had built. 2 sumps totalling about 100 gallons will be tied in with a 60 gallon frag tank. Additionally, I'll have 2 30 gallon quarantine tanks as well as a 90 gallon coral quarantine/extra tank. The frag tank will be lit with a 4 bulb Tek 4 ft fixture and the 90 gallon coral qtank with another one. The 90 gallon will likely end up housing a puffer or lionfish once the initial task of quarantining the majority of the fish/corals is over. My plan is to quarantine the fish in the smaller tanks initially so I can do water changes/medicate. The coral quarantine will be to avoid bringing any coral borne diseases and for observation. I've been negligent about quarantining in the past and am trying to do better this time. I have a 160 gallon salt water reservoir and a 50 gallon brute freshwater reservoir in the room. Water will be produced by a 150 GPD RO/DI.

 

Additives RO water topoff will be via a Spectrapure LM3. I have an Ebay 3 part doser for dosing 2 part and then will manually dose bacteria if I go that route. I'm also planning on small water changes with the Genesis water change setup. I'll plan on about 10 gallons a week to start. I'll also likely dose Lugol's and TM pro coral.

 

I think that's basically it for now. Any thoughts, concerns, suggestions?

[YBeNormal]

Sounds like this is going to be a very nice setup Roni. I especially like that you have incorporated quarantine tanks in your plans. I look forward to seeing the setup once it is installed and operational!

[Reefoholic]

Sounds like a great setup Roni. I am excited to see it happen...

[Ryan S]

Sounds like a great setup Roni. I am excited to see it happen...

 

Ditto!

[Chad]

deja vu?

 

 

I am looking forward to seeing it too, Roni. Miracles makes beautiful tanks! I think when I upgrade next (~18 months and counting), I will probably purchase one myself. Congrats!

[roni]

Sounds like this is going to be a very nice setup Roni. I especially like that you have incorporated quarantine tanks in your plans. I look forward to seeing the setup once it is installed and operational!

 

Thanks, special thanks have to go to Bob and Kevin Garrison for some of the woodwork and for Jon and Maureen for a lot of the design ideas.

 

Sounds like a great setup Roni. I am excited to see it happen...

 

Ditto!

 

thanks guys. I've got the light, return pump, skimmer, and sumps now. Still need to pick up 1 mp60, get the stands for the sumps put in the fishroom, and wait on the tank. Still not quite sure how I'm going to get the tank in place since it occupies the same spot as my current 70, which I'd like to keep up and running until the new display is running well. Have some more rock and sand cycling in the basement.

 

Here are a couple pics from the stand build for now, courtesy of Bob:

 

 

[Der ABT]

OOOOOOOOO

subscribed

 

 

cant wait to see me....just ask for help

 

 

the only problem i see is with a tank that size you can only fit like 1 fish...if you add another 1000 gallons it should be good...just have the tank go to the ceiling

[Alieu07]

wow its going be a great set up. Roni very well planned. Will tag along. Like to see more pics of the process.

[Alieu07]

What fish are you going to stock this big boy? Alot of tangs?

[MLazar]

I am so excited for you Roni! This is going to be amazing and if Bob is building your stand you will not be disappointed, he has great talent.

 

When Jon and I were thinking about putting a larger tank in the same real estate as the current tank we brain-stormed on how to execute the transition. Lots and lots of large plastic tubs seemed to be one constant in the solution. You'll have to transfer everything out, keep it aerated, remove the current tank, place new tank, and then re-populate. Since you are way smarter than me about salt water, you have probably already figured all of this out!!!! Take lots of pictures if you want to create similar rock work to what you already have.

 

You know we're happy to help on execution day!

 

Keep up this post and pictures!

 

M

[Jon Lazar]

I had originally looked at doing the Bean Animal overflow with a single external but have settled on 2 1.5" Dursos with an extra 1.5" standpipe in each overflow as a failsafe.

 

Roni,

 

Is the Bean Animal the 3-hole setup? You could still do that with an internal overflow, instead of the Durso. If space is an issue, you could put two bulkheads in the bottom of the overflow, and one in the back wall of the overflow. I haven't seen one in person, but everyone swears that overflows with a constant siphon are much quieter than the Durso. Just a point to consider since your tank is in your livng space.

 

We're excited to watch your progress...keep the updates coming.

 

Jon

[Incredible Corals]

Roni,

 

Is the Bean Animal the 3-hole setup? You could still do that with an internal overflow, instead of the Durso. If space is an issue, you could put two bulkheads in the bottom of the overflow, and one in the back wall of the overflow. I haven't seen one in person, but everyone swears that overflows with a constant siphon are much quieter than the Durso. Just a point to consider since your tank is in your livng space.

 

We're excited to watch your progress...keep the updates coming.

 

Jon

 

Why dont you use the herbie overflow design. Would work perfect with the amount of drains you have.

 

Also where did the build come from? Am I the only person that didn't see this coming?

[YBeNormal]

Here's a drawing of the plans for the frame design. I'm learning how to use Sketchup and will add drawings with the top and bottom panels, face frames and doors later.

 

[John]

I would add the vertical brace in the rear as you have in the front...even load/stress front to back...

[BowieReefer84]

Awesome build. Looks like nothing but top quality. Tagging along.

[YBeNormal]

I would add the vertical brace in the rear as you have in the front...even load/stress front to back...

 

The back will be a solid piece of plywood recessed into the frame so it is flush on the back, so the back will be able to support the load easily.

 

Edit: See the first post in this thread to see how the back panel will be mounted. Roni's stand will have cutouts for the pipes and cables, so the back will not be split like it was in Mohsin's stand.

Edited September 10, 2011 by YBeNormal

[roni]

OOOOOOOOO

subscribed

 

 

cant wait to see me....just ask for help

 

 

the only problem i see is with a tank that size you can only fit like 1 fish...if you add another 1000 gallons it should be good...just have the tank go to the ceiling

 

lol. Don't worry, I'll definitely be asking for help. You may regret your offer

 

 

wow its going be a great set up. Roni very well planned. Will tag along. Like to see more pics of the process.

 

What fish are you going to stock this big boy? Alot of tangs?

 

Thanks, need to put up some pics of the fishroom so far and equipment.

 

The tentative stocking list is:

 

Yellow tang

PBT

Purple tang

Regal Tang

Tonimi tang/Convict tang

 

3 flame wrasses

solarensis wrasse

sixline

 

p. fridmani

2 true percs

2 bluejaw triggers

3 pyramid butterflies

a few assorted gobies and wrasses TBD

 

 

 

 

I am so excited for you Roni! This is going to be amazing and if Bob is building your stand you will not be disappointed, he has great talent.

 

When Jon and I were thinking about putting a larger tank in the same real estate as the current tank we brain-stormed on how to execute the transition. Lots and lots of large plastic tubs seemed to be one constant in the solution. You'll have to transfer everything out, keep it aerated, remove the current tank, place new tank, and then re-populate. Since you are way smarter than me about salt water, you have probably already figured all of this out!!!! Take lots of pictures if you want to create similar rock work to what you already have.

 

You know we're happy to help on execution day!

 

Keep up this post and pictures!

 

M

 

A lot of the planning happened over dinner that one day My plan is what your saying....Will have to work out all details as we get closer.

 

 

Roni,

 

Is the Bean Animal the 3-hole setup? You could still do that with an internal overflow, instead of the Durso. If space is an issue, you could put two bulkheads in the bottom of the overflow, and one in the back wall of the overflow. I haven't seen one in person, but everyone swears that overflows with a constant siphon are much quieter than the Durso. Just a point to consider since your tank is in your livng space.

 

We're excited to watch your progress...keep the updates coming.

 

Jon

 

Jon, the problem is that they may have to temper the back panel if I drill it, which jumps the price up. I think with 2 1.5" dursos and the ability to dial back flow, I should be able to get it pretty quiet.

 

 

Why dont you use the herbie overflow design. Would work perfect with the amount of drains you have.

 

Also where did the build come from? Am I the only person that didn't see this coming?

 

I need to look at that again. I always get those 2 confused. How does the herbie work again? My wife will tell you that I'm always fiddling around with these things...this is supposed to be the final tank, with other tanks/projects relegated to the fishroom BTW, I should probably give out a special thanks to my wife, who is almost too understanding and supportive.

 

 

Awesome build. Looks like nothing but top quality. Tagging along.

 

thanks!

 

The back will be a solid piece of plywood recessed into the frame so it is flush on the back, so the back will be able to support the load easily.

 

Edit: See the first post in this thread to see how the back panel will be mounted. Roni's stand will have cutouts for the pipes and cables, so the back will not be split like it was in Mohsin's stand.

 

Bob and I talked a little about the design and have decided to increase support along the sides but I'll let him chime in how. Also, Bob, if you can screencap the tank specs and post it, I would appreciate it.

[YBeNormal]

As I mentioned in the previous post, the plan is to have a solid back on the stand, made of plywood and recessed into the frame for added support and stability. The sides and front of the stand will be clad with mahogany face framing, firmly glued and attached with hardware to the interior frame, and 15-ply cherry panels for the left and right sides and front doors. We had discussed making the side panels removable for ease of access and I'm very confident that the stand would be sturdy and stable enough to support the weight even with removable side panels. However, Roni and I decided to forgo that option and make the side panels the same as the back panel--recessed into the frame and fixed in place for additional support and stability. The added peace of mind outweighed the minor convenience of having access through removable side panels. All of this will be easier to picture when I complete and post the next layer in the Sketchup drawing.

 

Here are the tank specs:

 

 

72"x36" and ~270 gallons didn't really register on me at first--until I set out the boards for the base of the stand. This is going to be a monster of a tank!

[roni]

Thanks for posting that. I couldn't find my screen cap program. Couple little things I incorporated into the design are some glass ledges to rest the screen tops on (one of my concerns with a rimless tank was how to cover the top without taking away from the rimless look). The ledges will sit to where the screen tops are flush with the top of the tank glass and not jutting out.

 

Also trying to figure out the background. The room isn't conducive to painting the back wall (my original thought stolen from sunnyx's tank). I may just go with a vinyl background but would really like to fade from dark blue to light blue up. Anyone know a screenshop that can do that?

[roni]

The other thing I'm not sure about is whether to go with 2 overflows or a single one in the center.

 

Found this pic of the herbie overflow.

 

 

I think my current setup would be well suited for this. Can anyone explain what the advantage of the bean animal overflow over the herbie overflow is?

[ridetheducati]

BeanAnimal info.

 

http://www.beananimal.com/projects/silent-and-fail-safe-aquarium-overflow-system.aspx

[Jon Lazar]

The other thing I'm not sure about is whether to go with 2 overflows or a single one in the center.

 

Roni,

 

Both approaches have their pros and cons. A single overflow takes up less space in the tank. It's also less of a visual distraction to have a black overflow in front of your blue background.

 

The dual overflow offers better surface skimming and extra redundancy in case one of the overflows becomes partially blocked. But it takes up twice as much space and is twice the eyesore.

 

 

Can anyone explain what the advantage of the bean animal overflow over the herbie overflow is?

 

 

I think the bean overflow has a third hole as an emergency backup in case something clogs one of the other two holes. That's always sounded important to me, until I compared it to my current tank with a single durso standpipe. I have plans to add a second bulkhead as a backup, but it's not a high priority. In your case maybe you would want a third pipe if you went with a single overflow, but could do without it if you hve two overflows.

[BowieReefer84]

If you go with bean or herbie use a gate valve on the full siphon, and NOT a ball valve. I visited someone with a 240gal running a beananimal a few weeks back, and it was SILENT.

[roni]

BeanAnimal info.

 

http://www.beananimal.com/projects/silent-and-fail-safe-aquarium-overflow-system.aspx

 

 

Roni,

 

Both approaches have their pros and cons. A single overflow takes up less space in the tank. It's also less of a visual distraction to have a black overflow in front of your blue background.

 

The dual overflow offers better surface skimming and extra redundancy in case one of the overflows becomes partially blocked. But it takes up twice as much space and is twice the eyesore.

 

 

I think the bean overflow has a third hole as an emergency backup in case something clogs one of the other two holes. That's always sounded important to me, until I compared it to my current tank with a single durso standpipe. I have plans to add a second bulkhead as a backup, but it's not a high priority. In your case maybe you would want a third pipe if you went with a single overflow, but could do without it if you hve two overflows.

 

If you go with bean or herbie use a gate valve on the full siphon, and NOT a ball valve. I visited someone with a 240gal running a beananimal a few weeks back, and it was SILENT.

 

Thanks all! I read through that page and some of the reefcentral threads for both topics. What I couldn't find is anyone with a Herbie who had had a problem with the 1% hole not accomodating if the primary drain siphon clogs, including one person that kept trying to force flooding episodes. It seems that with the BeanAnimal, however, you have to do less adjustment as the main drain is continuous with the sump and has some room for auto adjustment. Given that my wavemaking may cause about a 1-1.5" variation in the surface water height, I wonder if the BeanAnimal would be better able to deal with the variation.

 

My ideal ovreflow would be on either end without any disruption in the back and a continuous blue background, like this tank.

 

http://www.rimlessreef.com/rimless-reef-2.html.

 

However, the room doesn't lend itself to that or option 2, which is a completely external overflow (that would add 6" to the depth of the tank, which is a wife no-no). However, given that a BeanAnimal in 2 overflows is a little more difficult to implement, I think I may go with a single central. It will take up 30" of length of the tank, which may be a greater visual disturbance, but if I go with a more central rock structure, that will allow "see-thru" of the 21" on each side. I assume 3 1.5" siphons should easily handle 2000 GPH of flow, as the original design had 1" bulkheads with 1.5" plumbing and handled 1000-3000 GPH without incident. I also think that a 1.5-2" wave should be okay with this design.

 

Any thoughts?

[BowieReefer84]

Why not go coast to coast, which would give you a flat background. Also, the plumbing would go straight down, and not require wall clearance issues? By coast to coast I mean from the bottom to the top all the way across the back maybe 5" off the "actual" back wall. You lose some tank space, but won't require any wall clearance. Your plumbing will not be able to be seen at all, which to me is a major benefit.

 

Just an idea.

Edited September 11, 2011 by BowieReefer84