What causes SPS to fade?

[Orion]

In my effort to continue learning I ask the membership -

 

What causes certain SPS corals to fade, and not darken up?

 

Is it too much or too little light?  Overuse of Carbon and/or GFO (aka not enough nutrients)? Not enough flow, or too much?

 

I have a couple of SPS corals (pink tip sarmentosa, and a superman montipora to be exact) that I know can look much better.  The superman monti is under 250 PAR, and the pink tip sarmentosa is under 350 PAR.  Both are growing and encrusting along but look faded/washed out.  Most of my other SPS look good (at least to me).

 

57 Gallon Rimless (36 x 18 x 21)

I use half the amount of GFO that BRS recommends for my tank, and the full amount of Carbon they recommend.  The clean up crew takes care of any algae, and I have no issues.

Flow is provided by a Vortech MP40, and a Jebao WP25.  

Lighting is provided by an ATI 6 bulb 36" T5 Sunpower. (4 blue plus, 1 coral plus, 1 purple plus).

Skimmer is an Avast CS1

 

Parameters -

 

Temp 78

Alk 8.0

Salinity 1.025

Calcium 400-450

Phosphates (Hanna Checker) - Close to zero

Nitrates <5ppm

Magnesium 1350

[YHSublime]

I've found that my colors come from what most reefers consider through the roof phosphates.

[Rob A]

I know that low light will cause them to fade. A couple years ago I had MH bulbs and bought my first sps frags and put them on the bottom since I thought the MH was a lot of light. I found out it was only 50 PAR. They lost most of their color. In my first (temporary) frag tank I saw intense colors with high nitrates (40 or so) in birds nest, chalice and bonsai frags that I had under 200 PAR fluorescent. Probably had high phosphates at that time too.

[Orion]

I've found that my colors come from what most reefers consider through the roof phosphates.

I think what I am going to do is cut the carbon use in half and take the GFO offline completely for 3 months and see what happens. I'll leave everything else the same and see what happens.

[YHSublime]

I think what I am going to do is cut the carbon use in half and take the GFO offline completely for 3 months and see what happens. I'll leave everything else the same and see what happens.

Why not just cut Gfo in half? All at once seems heavy handed to color up a few pieces of sps, especially if it all looks good otherwise. My trade off is cyano, and frequent water changes. In the next 6 months I will be trying my hand at both carbon and Gfo. Keep In mind I'm suggesting what has worked for me, I can only speculate it's phosphates.

[Orion]

Why not just cut Gfo in half? All at once seems heavy handed to color up a few pieces of sps, especially if it all looks good otherwise. My trade off is cyano, and frequent water changes. In the next 6 months I will be trying my hand at both carbon and Gfo. Keep In mind I'm suggesting what has worked for me, I can only speculate it's phosphates.

True.

 

The BRS calculator calls for 1 cup in my tank. I currently use half a cup. I can try a 1/4 cup for a couple months and see what happens.

 

I use a 1/2 cup of carbon now, and I can cut that in half as well.

 

Curious what others think it might be as well before I make any changes.

[davelin315]

That's a tricky question as a single condition can cause varying degrees of both fading and darkening.

 

Think of it like this - color is driven by the presence of zooxanthellae. Zooxanthellae can be present in different colors and the specific color of each coral is dictated by the ratio of colors to each other. In a balanced system that has nothing in excessive amounts, the "true" color of the coral will come through. As specific conditions present themselves as excessive or deficient, e zooxanthellae can react by overproducing certain colors or expelling them. This results in darkening or fading.

 

For example, let's take a brown coral. The brown could be the result of shipping stress or poor conditions during holding (could simply be a brown coral, too). This is kind of protective mode for the coral. If you improve the lighting it receives (and that is a bit of a misstatement as we present the corals with "unnatural" lighting at times that doesn't mimic the sun1 but produces prettier colors in captive corals) the color could shift to a different lighter color, let's say it turns blue. As the coral builds up the blue, it will most likely get darker and then lighter as the ratio that produced the brown goes more to a ratio that produces blue. As the blue starts to grown more, you'll see some lightening of the color as the brown fades out and then it will darken up again as the coral basically recesses the browns. Let's say, though, that you then starve the coral of nutrients which can cause it to lighten up a bit. The blue won't necessarily disappear, but the number of zooxanthellae might decrease because of lack of nutrients to sustain them. If you react by tossing on more light, you could bleach the coral or, in some circumstances, cause the coral to protect itself by producing different color zooxanthellae.

 

Confused yet? Long story short, there's a ton of different factors going on at the same time that influence the coloration and lightness or darkness of that coloration. The ratio of the conditions and parameters, from nutrients to lighting, can all impact this to differing degrees but if you have a definitive pattern in your tank, say everything is turning green, it's pretty easy to point to plenty of light but excessive nutrients in the water. If everything is turning brown, it is probably due to light being plentiful, but not necessarily in a "good" spectrum.

 

Essentially, there are some generalities that can be drawn, but there are also a lot of factors that prevent a general rule of thumb from being the correct explanation.

[Orion]

Thanks for the insight Dave! After some more research it looks like the tank might be low on nutrients. So my plan is to cut both carbon and GFO usage in half. Wait two months, and see what happens.

[BowieReefer84]

Try some amino acid dosing perhaps.

[Neto]

Try some amino acid dosing perhaps.

+1

 

And if you do it, dont change anything in your process, just does the amino's and monitor your corals to see if the dosing makes a difference. I have used Aquavitro Fuel and Zeovit XTRA special with good success.

[sen5241b]

It should be mentioned that too much light can be a factor.

[mling]

It should be mentioned that too much light can be a factor.

Too much light for SPS ?  I thought they always need as much light as they can get.... maybe that's why some of mine are fading, I've been putting the as close to the top as possible.

[pizzaguy]

People cook sps all the time. Not all sps needs blasted with light. I'm guilty of that myself. Bleached coral

[morgan175]

I have been trying to have sps there is no learning curve in my tank. I have some bleached and others brown. If it was easy and the answers were easy we all would have something else in our tanks. Just confused.

 

 

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[sen5241b]

People cook sps all the time. Not all sps needs blasted with light. I'm guilty of that myself. Bleached coral

 

It does happen.

[BowieReefer84]

I have been trying to have sps there is no learning curve in my tank. I have some bleached and others brown. If it was easy and the answers were easy we all would have something else in our tanks. Just confused.

 

 

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Story of my life, and one reason I don't have any sticks in my tank.

[miggs76]

I have some acros under 100 par and some under 400 par...it really all depends.

[zygote2k]

what have been your test results from the past 3 months? what have you changed in the last 3 months?

[Der ABT]

Gonna agree with robs line of questioning.

But also want to ask how old/long have the corals been in your system

 

you have algea so your not too clean.

 

 

Stability is everything....pick yuor alk and stay there....

KEEP UP WITH WATER CHANGES...get that on a schedule and things will look alot better.

 

any new additions? corals or cleaners (gfo carbon etc) ....

how old are the lights..

what the RODI readings etc...how old are filters..what salt

 

If all things are looking great except a couple corals...and you have added any new corals...CHECK FOR PESTS....do a dip, take a magnifying glass to it etc..

 

if your RODI water is not the greatest ive found that does not help at all.

 

alot more questions than anwsers but if there are just a couple corals that look bad i usually check for pests...if no pests..how old are they/how long have then been in that spot....some corals literally take a few months to get happy, then one day they blow up with color

 

Fragging tips can also help to speed up the process...frag and the new growth will show the best color

[sen5241b]

... CHECK FOR PESTS....do a dip, take a magnifying glass to it etc..

 

1+ !    There is so much emphasis on dipping alone with iodine, Bayer pesticide, hydrogen peroxide, etc but I take a magnifying glass to that new coral and really inspect it.

[Orion]

Pest free.  All corals QT'd and dipped prior to going in the display (I buy from ERC/Marco).  Corals are all growing/encrusting, a few just look faded.

 

No changes in the last 3 months.

 

Dosing is automated and tested twice each week in the morning around the same time.  Alk has been between 8-9, Calcium between 400-450, and Magnesium 1300-1400.

 

Bulbs are 5 months old.  PAR readings were taken last month.

 

No Algae issues except for a little bubble algae, tank is fairly clean, and sand is very white.

 

Water change every 7 days.

 

Reef Crystals Salt.

 

Carbon and GFO changed out every two weeks (I have them both mixed in a single reactor).

 

Hope that helps...

Edited July 16, 2014 by Orion

[morgan175]

One thing I'm starting to notice is the bigger the colony the better the chance of survival. Does anyone agree with that.

 

 

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[Orion]

One thing I'm starting to notice is the bigger the colony the better the chance of survival. Does anyone agree with that.

 

 

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I definitely have noticed that if you get a frag that has started to encrust a bit, it has a much better chance of survival.  I am done with getting freshly cut frags.

[Orion]

By the way, this is a great discussion.  I appreciate what everyone has said so far.

 

Not sure if this has anything to do with the SPS fading in color, but I also have very little to no coralline algae growth.  I am actually fine with that though, as I hated scraping it in my old tank.

Edited July 16, 2014 by Orion

[Der ABT]

even if Qtd, id strongly suggest dipping one of them as long as it still looks healthy (polyp extension etc) redbugs generally cause browning more than AEFW and can be hard to see with the naked eye (remember they are yellow with a red head----basically a ginger) certain pests seem to prefer certain types of acro's (ex is redbugs and any tricolors or valedia's for that matter sarmentosa/granulosa's as well from what ive seen)

 

Personally i would much rather have a fresh cut frag...lowers the chance of pests (algea or animal) but to each his own...you can always just frag the encrusted coral and chuck the base/plug or just dry it out.....most pests hide at the base and or the plug.

 

 

So how long have you had the corals? were they crazy colorful when you got them and then faded or have you had them for year or more and then suddenly faded.

 

If the corals have only been in there a month or three i wouldnt worry.....they need time to adjust to light/spectrum/water quality/ alk etc etc etc.....if they are encrusting...many corals will encrust like crazy to get a good hold/get comfy and then suddenly one day it shoots off the most colorful branch known to man....again this is where i feel fraggin a small piece helps to speed this process up. 

 

did you test the water they came from? if you go from a alk of 12 down to 7, or a alk of 7 up to 12 its gonna shock the crap outta the coral...which is why i think alot of people have issues with fresh cuts dieing, if the params are close i NEVER have issues with fresh cuts.

 

 

or try skipping the GFO for a couple weeks may not do anything but who knows.