rtsusc83 August 29, 2013 Share August 29, 2013 So I have finally started cycling my second tank (120p ADA/67gal) and it has been a couple of years since my first cycle on my first tank so memory from that experience is limited. Time flies. I have some questions and seeking comments/advice from you all What I have done: 1. I have a sand bed with a combination of aragonite bagged sand and live or dead sand from my first tank which had been sitting in a bucket for two weeks after rinsing it once I got it off the tank. And boy does it stink? 2. About 30 gallons of SW from my first tank. It took about one day to clear up the tank created old sand. 3. About 40 lbs of cured (2 months cooking in my garage) 4. Running a skimmer Questions: 1. Should the cycle be shorter? 2. Should I run the skimmer? Does this have an effect on the cycle time? 3. Do I feed the tank as if fish are in the tank? Appreciate any help! I will post a build thread soon. Have never done it but will try anyway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YHSublime August 29, 2013 Share August 29, 2013 You probably have enough in your old sandbed to get your cycle started. I would let it ride, just my opinion, someone who knows better will chime in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YHSublime August 29, 2013 Share August 29, 2013 Also, I wouldn't run the skimmer, again, jmo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattiejay6 August 29, 2013 Share August 29, 2013 Doesn't tony Vargas recommend running the skimmer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami August 29, 2013 Share August 29, 2013 Doesn't tony Vargas recommend running the skimmer?Yes. And he recommends lights out during the ammonia cycling part, too. Sent from my phone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smallreef August 29, 2013 Share August 29, 2013 If you have tested and you already nitrates or any ammonia you do not really need to ghost feed, but if there isn't any...you need to start the ammonia cycle so feed until you have nitrates or ammonia... Also, cooked rock or live rock? You said cured but then cooked in a tub? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zygote2k August 29, 2013 Share August 29, 2013 throw it all in the tank, stir vigorously, run lights and skimmer, wait 3 months for bacterial cycle to complete. do it right the first time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rtsusc83 August 29, 2013 Author Share August 29, 2013 Cooked or cured? What I did was let it sit in a tub with just a pump recirculating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rtsusc83 August 29, 2013 Author Share August 29, 2013 What is the rationale for no lights during the ammonia cycle? Any link to Tony Vargas? I have not tested for ammonia, nitrites or nitrates. Waiting for my ammonia test kit to come in tomorrow. And three months is a long time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami August 29, 2013 Share August 29, 2013 What is the rationale for no lights during the ammonia cycle? Any link to Tony Vargas? I have not tested for ammonia, nitrites or nitrates. Waiting for my ammonia test kit to come in tomorrow. And three months is a long time!Bacteria don't need the light. I'm also assuming that it can fuel competing algae in the early stages. No sense in doing that. Source is Tony's book which, right now is next to my sink and going to Florida with me today. Since I'll probably see Tony there, I may get him to sign it or something. Tony also told us this when he spoke to the club earlier this year. Sent from my phone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rtsusc83 August 29, 2013 Author Share August 29, 2013 Thanks. I missed that meet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaltLife August 29, 2013 Share August 29, 2013 (edited) Lucky! I bought his book after the meet. Great read even for more experianced people and very nice pictures as well. In the begining he goes through all considerations of starting a new tank. Bacteria don't need the light. I'm also assuming that it can fuel competing algae in the early stages. No sense in doing that. Source is Tony's book which, right now is next to my sink and going to Florida with me today. Since I'll probably see Tony there, I may get him to sign it or something. Tony also told us this when he spoke to the club earlier this year. Sent from my phone Edited August 29, 2013 by SaltLife Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami August 29, 2013 Share August 29, 2013 Thanks. I missed that meet. No problem. I summarized the relevant part in a PM recently and may have even posted the following to another thread. Anyway, I'll do so again: Here are a few excerpts from page 57 of "The Coral Reef Aquarium" by Tony Vargas. Under the heading, "Cycling a Reef Aquarium," it says: Cycling can be handled by using the display tank to cycle/cure the rock or by curing it in a separate container. For best results, it is advisable to run your circulation pump, protein skimmer and activated carbon, and to keep the lights off during this process. If you use the display tank to cure your rocks, replace half of the water with fresh sea water or synthetic sea water once the cycle is complete. Generally this process will take 4-6 weeks. Odor can be kept under control with activated carbon. Many micro- and macro-fauna reside in live rock. (He assumes, it seems that the you've seeded the cycled tank with some "grunge" from another hobbyist or, more likely, from the bottom of the live rock bin at your LFS.) These organisms should be given the opportunity to develop without the addition of fish, corals or light, as they help with the natural balance of the aquarium. Follow the 90 days or more rule, which allows the aquarium to create a natural balance within 90-180 days. Allowing these organisms to prosper will also assist with nutrient control. Stock gradually thereafter to allow the biofilter to adapt to the increased bioload. This process is often difficult with the new or enthusiastic hobbyist. So, basically he's saying cycle the rock and sand in a new tank to build up the bacterial population. This takes about 6 weeks. If it's not already there, add some "grunge" (my term) to the tank after the nitrogen cycle has completed. This grunge is often full of pods, micro brittles, worms, and such and can be found in the debris that is found at the bottom of your LFS's live rock bin. Allow at least another 6 weeks for this micro & macro fauna to develop. (It may be important to feed the tank just a little bit to encourage rapid reproduction. Just watch how much you feed the tank. You should not see an appreciable increase in nitrates if you're doing this right.) When at least 90 days has passed (or as many as 180 days), you can begin stocking, albeit gradually. Except for the addition of micro and macro-fauna and "predator-free" period following cycling, the process is typical. I can see how this extra bit of patience can pay off in the long run and provide the aquarist with a mature tank faster than if adding fish began after the nitrogen cycle had completed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rtsusc83 August 29, 2013 Author Share August 29, 2013 Tom, Thanks for the help! This is a lot of great info and my challenge is to stick to it and not fall into the temptation of stocking too early. Anyone else out there following this regimen? Maybe start a stocking too early anonymous club..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YHSublime August 29, 2013 Share August 29, 2013 Tom, Thanks for the help! This is a lot of great info and my challenge is to stick to it and not fall into the temptation of stocking too early. Anyone else out there following this regimen? Maybe start a stocking too early anonymous club..... I'm trying it, going fallow for 90 days There is a group that's betting against me (cough Jenn cough cough Kim cough) October 31st will be my 81 days mark. I used live rock from my current up and running tank, and there are pods a plenty at the moment. The life that has survived the ammonia and nitrite/nitrate spikes is crazy. I saw a snail on my glass the other day. I have spent some money on some nice sps pieces I would rather not lose due to a quick transfer that doesn't need to be quick. It is giving me the time to slowly focus on things like my apex, light schedule, and fish stock list. There is no hard and fast rule that says you have to go 90 days, but you have already read about the benifits of doing so, and if you can, it wont hurt! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rtsusc83 August 29, 2013 Author Share August 29, 2013 Thanks Isaac. You will be inspiration for the 90 day ride! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YHSublime August 29, 2013 Share August 29, 2013 Thanks Isaac. You will be inspiration for the 90 day ride! I don't think of it as giving inspiration, I see it more as misery loves company Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattiejay6 August 29, 2013 Share August 29, 2013 I'm about to start this regimen... I'm gonna add a bottle of Dr Tim's to the setup as well... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YHSublime August 29, 2013 Share August 29, 2013 I'm about to start this regimen... I'm gonna add a bottle of Dr Tim's to the setup as well... Thought about this, but I'd rather put that money towards some pods to boost that population. Dr. Tim's, from my understanding, is paying for what will happen naturally, with the suggestion of speeding up a cycle. I'd actually be interested in some thoughts on this maybe in another thread? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rtsusc83 August 29, 2013 Author Share August 29, 2013 I don't think of it as giving inspiration, I see it more as misery loves company I did not want to say but that what was really on my mind. Lol! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanM August 29, 2013 Share August 29, 2013 Im in the same boat, but starting with nearly totally dry rock instead of live rock like yhsublime. I did add dr tims because of this. Also, I am a month ahead of yhsublime July 23. Trying to not add fish until about the same time as him, though. Got three snails and three conch, but may give two of the conch out to folks. They are cool, but seem hungry to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattiejay6 August 29, 2013 Share August 29, 2013 Well sublime the reason I figured I'd go with adding dr Tim's is because he has a good rap sheet as far as who has who used it.. Not necessarily trying to speed up the process and I realize it happens naturally but just kind of an extra measure that I would like to add :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattiejay6 August 29, 2013 Share August 29, 2013 Im in the same boat, but starting with nearly totally dry rock instead of live rock like yhsublime. I did add dr tims because of this. Also, I am a month ahead of yhsublime July 23. Trying to not add fish until about the same time as him, though. Got three snails and three conch, but may give two of the conch out to folks. They are cool, but seem hungry to me. +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rtsusc83 August 29, 2013 Author Share August 29, 2013 Where can you get Dr. Tim's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattiejay6 August 29, 2013 Share August 29, 2013 http://www.drtimsaquatics.com/treat-aquarium-nitrite-ammonia-levels Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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