mrcoral.com April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 Thanks for the Pm's guys letting me know about the post. You have to trust your suppliers. I assumed they are Japanese corals because this is what I'm told. I guess I really don't know unless I pull the corals myself from the ocean. I don't pull permits so I would have no idea how something get's in the country. If it has to go to Africa and back not sure all I know is it was on my invoice should I dump it? To bring anything in the country it has to have a permit so if it was allowed in what does that mean? I have seen and heard how many corals are pulled off people shipments when it comes into the country because of permits. I assume they had the paperwork to bring it in. If you don't like it or think I'm liar I would not come in. I'm not forcing anyone of course to buy it. Again, to get anything in the country it has to pass threw customs and have the proper paperwork. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 So my favorite General Tso is really not a general? Just a plain ole Tso? He's a Colonel at best ... That's alright, Colonel Sanders wasn't a Colonel either. Besides, I prefer Bojangle's chicken and enven though they have a cajun sounding name, they're from Charlotte, NC. But I digress, my objection to selling something that is labeled as "Japanese Zoos" is that peopel might get the wrong idea about the ethics of the LFS. I believe that I might label them something like "Demestically propogated Japanese Zoos". This would convey the message that not only is the animal something exotic, but also environmentally responsible (which is something that we should all strive for). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 Does anyone know the facts on the subject? I've been trying to research this topic (based on this thread) and can't find anything authoritative and clear on the matter. It would appear that Japan is a very large importer of coral (for jewelry). It also seems to have used a lot of it's natural coral resources in the production of that same jewelry. While it also has laws protecting its reefs, it also appears that it exports some of it's corals to certain countries but that other trade routes may be illegal (though it's unclear whose law it is in those cases). Trying to find facts and to separate it from the hearsay, I'm coming up with a dead end. Can somebody find a link to a news article, a policy paper, or something substantive (and current) on this matter? By the way, my avatar shows a whale shark that I was near while diving off of the island of Okinawa, which is one of Japan's islands blessed with coral reefs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 I ran into the same thing Tom. I figure that it's just safer and more responsible to buy propigated stuff, like what Justin sells. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noobalicious April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 I ran into the same thing Tom. I figure that it's just safer and more responsible to buy propigated stuff, like what Justin sells. Which is a good point, and good conservation effort. But did you notice, that without any ability to offer the laws and regulations, some people were quite quick to make some comments aimed at the character of another person. I think some people get too bored and need a witch hunt to keep them occupied Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 I ran into the same thing Tom. I figure that it's just safer and more responsible to buy propigated stuff, like what Justin sells. That's a great point, Charlie. My question, though, is aimed at trying to understand the truth behind the controversy that's been drawn out here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Hind April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 nooby, When a site like MASNA posted an article that says Japanese corals are illegal people asked questions as to where the corals a local vendor is selling came from and why they are labeled as they are. You posted that they can be imported legally yet you showed no evidence of that, only proof that Japan is an importer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 David, was there a MASNA article on the subject? On this site, I see that they've linked to the Glass-Box post. Is there original material to be found at MASNA? (I've not looked hard.) http://www.masna.org/IntheNews/tabid/400/ID/925/5-Reasons-NOT-to-Buy-Japanese-Corals.aspx A Google search for "japan coral site:masna.org" comes up kind of empty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 (edited) Which is a good point, and good conservation effort. But did you notice, that without any ability to offer the laws and regulations, some people were quite quick to make some comments aimed at the character of another person. I think some people get too bored and need a witch hunt to keep them occupied Noob, I don't need a law to tell me that I should recycle my soda cans or wear my seatbelt, even though many places have laws to that effect (which I don't support at all). My choices are to do the right thing and I prefer not to buy wild caught corals or fish. I chose to use cultured live rock. I may be pretty Libertarian, but I CHOOSE to do the right thing, even if there are people in the world that either don't care or don't see a problem. One of my favorite foods in the world is Weiner Schnitzel, but I don't eat it anymore because made a commitment not to support the veal industry. Edited April 30, 2010 by Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Ward April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 Let's keep it civil guys. Avoid the veiled attacks. State facts where there are facts and your opinion, where applicable. The glass boxes article doesn't have any citations, so I can't determine the veracity of the claims. Something direct from MASNA, CITES, the WTO, etc. would be helpful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incredible Corals April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 I can Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 Let's keep it civil guys. Avoid the veiled attacks. State facts where there are facts and your opinion, where applicable. The glass boxes article doesn't have any citations, so I can't determine the veracity of the claims. Something direct from MASNA, CITES, the WTO, etc. would be helpful. Agreed on all counts. Let's not get personal. My questions are only to try to find something that I can believe. "Illegal" is the claim - not unethical. I'm trying to find clarity because I care about the question of legality that's been brought up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flowerseller April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 For the next officers meeting I want Colonel Tso. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trockafella April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 I can't wait to stare at my illegal Japanese acans and zoas while smoking a Cuban and resting my feet on a stool made of white rhino tusks. Also, if my feet get cold I'll wrap them in my baby seal skin blanket and if I get bored I'll let my bald eagle out of its cage. But on a serious note, who wants to go white tiger hunting this weekend? LMAO... Very distasteful, but I love it..!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zygote2k April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 I like how easily people start to say someone is lying. How many people are in the chain before the store gets them? If everyone in the supply chain calls them Japanese, then it would be natural that the end person calls them Japanese too. Also, he did not say that they were from Japan,he used the name that many suppliers are using for that group of zoanthids. All those lying U.S. based Irish wolfhound breeders...cause none of them are being born in Ireland. I guess evey Mexican restaurant is lying about it's food, cause none of it was flown in from Mexico. Who cares if the name doesn't match the origin as long as the product is good. And he isn't charging high prices for the name. The frag pack advertised on this site was way cheeper than any zoanthids I have seen in other LFS. I don't think that $2 per zoo is someone making big money on false advertising. I never said anyone was lying- I was simply stating that I saw someone here selling something that several people/places/sites said was illegal to sell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amay121 April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 Someone make this easy on everyone else. Just call Wildlife Enforcement, ask them, end of this whole debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 So my favorite General Tso is really not a general? Just a plain ole Tso? LOL. Rest assured, he was real. He may have had nothing to do with the dish, but he was real: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zuo_Zongtang Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mogurnda April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 For the next officers meeting I want Colonel Tso. I find him tiresome. You try to plan an event, and all he wants to do is invade Mongolia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noobalicious April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 nooby, When a site like MASNA posted an article that says Japanese corals are illegal people asked questions as to where the corals a local vendor is selling came from and why they are labeled as they are. You posted that they can be imported legally yet you showed no evidence of that, only proof that Japan is an importer. You're quoting the wrong person...i never posted anything about legal importation. I do however work for a government agency that deals with the importation of good into the U.S. I will bite the bullet and try to call someone and see what kind of answer I can get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Novi April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 I can Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Hind April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 You're quoting the wrong person...i never posted anything about legal importation. Your right, it was novi, sorry about that. I have been searching and I can't find anything other then what was posted on Glassbox and what "SuperUserAccount" posted on MASNA. Has anyone else found anything? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angel not fish April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 With the selection of stunning corals availible legally and through propigation, I fail to see a good reason to break anybody's laws to add something cool or interesting to our tanks. Furthermore, if having that ONE coral in our tank is that important, I'm sure that there are places that sell legal specimens that either come from near by islands or from frags before the ban. +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdah0414 April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 I love it. Let the requisite monthly Sonny bashing begin. Maybe we should add that to our mission statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phisigs79 April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 (edited) If you cannot legaly import a coral from Japan to the USA why would anyone think its ok to get a coral from Japan because someone bent the rules which is legal? Its like going to a massage palor and paying for a massage and getting something extra when you expect it. Well if you didnt necessary pay for the extra "massage" does it make it legal? No its not and you would go to jail if you caught. Edited April 30, 2010 by phisigs79 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trockafella April 30, 2010 Share April 30, 2010 On the other side of this legal/illegal duel, are the zooanthids even japanese, has anyone found that out yet.. Bc if there not, then its simply mislabeled and should be sold for much cheaper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts