Fish stocking/Wishlist help!

[YHSublime]

Hey WAMAS!

 

I'm putting together my fish list, and acquiring my fish list at the same time. When I put everything into my display tank (all at the same time), I'm hoping to be done (are we ever really done?) Part of the reason is I'll have two notoriously aggressive angels, an Imperator Angelfish and a Blueface Angelfish. The tank in question is about 180 gallons, 5' wide and 3' deep. 

 

Here's what I currently have:

A Goldflake Angel pair (2)

A Blueface Angel (1)

A Imperator Angelfish (1)

 

What I have, but might not add into the new build:

A Powder Brown Tang (1)

A Maroon Clown (1)

 

What I'd like to add and don't have:

Yellow Tangs (3)

A ton of shoaling fish, I'm hoping to get fish that wont pick each other off (like Chromis) and aren't incredibly aggressive, thoughts? 

[menglish]

What about anthias for you shoaling fish? I am liking bartlett or bimarcs. As i am sure you know, chromis tend to pick one another off. I started my 180 with 9.  I ended up with one a few months later. Now i have none.

[YHSublime]

What about anthias for you shoaling fish? I am liking bartlett or bimarcs. As i am sure you know, chromis tend to pick one another off. I started my 180 with 9.  I ended up with one a few months later. Now i have none.

I like anthias. I was hoping to keep around 8-11 of whatever fish to provide movement.

[menglish]

6 minutes ago, YHSublime said:

I like anthias. I was hoping to keep around 8-11 of whatever fish to provide movement.

I think that many anthias would be awesome to look at, especially with one super male. They are expensive though, about $60 each.

[cpu933k]

I have 5 bimac in my 125g FOWLR and 5 bartletts in my 75g mixed reef. I prefer the bimacs. The colors are more vibrant. In both cases, they don't really shoal.

[YHSublime]

I have 5 bimac in my 125g FOWLR and 5 bartletts in my 75g mixed reef. I prefer the bimacs. The colors are more vibrant. In both cases, they don't really shoal.

I think in this size tank, any kind of shoaling is a pipe dream.

[smokythemattman@gmail.com]

You could do a group chalk basslets. They seem to play well in groups. Not sure if they would really shoal or school as much as anthias or chromis but just a different option for a group of fish than anthias or chromis. 

[YHSublime]

You could do a group chalk basslets. They seem to play well in groups. Not sure if they would really shoal or school as much as anthias or chromis but just a different option for a group of fish than anthias or chromis. 

True, good option.

I’m not seeing a ton of fish being stocked these days, I think Covid-19 is going to affect this for quite some time.

[KingOfAll_Tyrants]

Long time ago I was curious about schooling/shoaling fish.  Here are some options I remember:

 

1. PJ cardinals can sort of shoal in a large enough tank

2. blue streak cardinals do so much more reliably than Banggai, PJs, etc.   In fact, they are found with Banggais in the wild, so you could have a shoal of Blue streaks and add a pair of Banggai long term

3. Margarita cardinals "prefer to assemble in schools that dart around the open areas of reef tanks, similar to how freshwater tetras behave in planted aquaria" (ORA) and is "Often seen in small groups, in pools among seagrasses and coral rubble" (wild singapre)

4. Yellow Cardinalfish (Ostorinchus luteus) "Aggregates under ledges, in holes, or even among spines of sea urchins" (fishbase)

5. Masked Govies "school near large coral columns and heads". 

 

ORA says they breed all of the above, though you may have to ask your dealer as to availability (ORA-liveaquaria only lists the PJs and Bangais).   KP aquatics, a good collector in FL, often has the masked goby.

 

And honestly, on a tank that large with the larger fish you have, I'd guess many of these fish would definitely shoal, and I might even try like 11 of the most peaceful chromis species you could find.   

 

I'd be very interested to see your experience with whatever you decide to go with.

Edited April 15, 2020 by KingOfAll_Tyrants

[YHSublime]

Long time ago I was curious about schooling/shoaling fish.  Here are some options I remember:
 
1. PJ cardinals can sort of shoal in a large enough tank
2. blue streak cardinals do so much more reliably than Banggai, PJs, etc.   In fact, they are found with Banggais in the wild, so you could have a shoal of Blue streaks and add a pair of Banggai long term
3. Margarita cardinals "prefer to assemble in schools that dart around the open areas of reef tanks, similar to how freshwater tetras behave in planted aquaria" (ORA) and is "Often seen in small groups, in pools among seagrasses and coral rubble" (wild singapre)
4. Yellow Cardinalfish (Ostorinchus luteus) "Aggregates under ledges, in holes, or even among spines of sea urchins" (fishbase)
5. Masked Govies "school near large coral columns and heads". 
 
ORA says they breed all of the above, though you may have to ask your dealer as to availability (ORA-liveaquaria only lists the PJs and Bangais).   KP aquatics, a good collector in FL, often has the masked goby.
 
And honestly, on a tank that large with the larger fish you have, I'd guess many of these fish would definitely shoal, and I might even try like 11 of the most peaceful chromis species you could find.   
 
I'd be very interested to see your experience with whatever you decide to go with.

All great ideas, thanks for chiming in! What I’d like to do is get them all in observation for a month or so, and then release all at once. So far observation and heavy feeding is really doing the current fish well.

The powdered brown has started thrashing the algae growing on the side of the walls by tearing down the water line on the tub. It then turns around and gobbles up its reward. It gets a sheet of nori daily that it demolishes in less than 30 minutes, so it’s not starving, maybe bored.

All the fish have gotten remarkably fat during qt (just like me!) and since I’ve been at home even before everything, feed exclusively frozen, which is adding up a lot faster than the nano.

[lowsingle]

The best schooling fish I had was blue-eyed cardinal fish.  They school really tight when scared or at night, but would venture out from the school during the day.

 

Darren

[KingOfAll_Tyrants]

36 minutes ago, lowsingle said:

The best schooling fish I had was blue-eyed cardinal fish.  They school really tight when scared or at night, but would venture out from the school during the day.

 

Darren

 

 

this?

 

http://sustainableaquatics.com/sustainable-islands-fish/cardinals/blue-eyed-cardinal/

 

very cool. I’ve heard good things about them, as mentioned in the previous post. I think it’s funny that ORA gives them a different name than SA, though.  i’d be interested in Hearing more about your experience with them.

 

Maybe I will get some someday.  

 

https://www.orafarm.com/product/blue-streak-cardinal/

[YHSublime]

 
 
this?
 
http://sustainableaquatics.com/sustainable-islands-fish/cardinals/blue-eyed-cardinal/
 
very cool. I’ve heard good things about them, as mentioned in the previous post. I think it’s funny that ORA gives them a different name than SA, though.  i’d be interested in Hearing more about your experience with them.
 
Maybe I will get some someday.  
 
https://www.orafarm.com/product/blue-streak-cardinal/

Can’t find any in stock for now


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[ImGoingCoastal]

https://www.petesaquariums.com/shop/saltwater-aquarium-fish/cardinalfish/longspine-cardinalfish-or-threadfin-cardinalfish/

This place supposedly has some in stock. Never used them though.

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[lowsingle]

I got all of my blue eyed cardinals from Ben at supreme reefs.  They were far better than my attempt at blue chromis.  The chromis slowly killed each other off until I had one big one and one small one, though they did school when they were small.  The cardinals are friendly and easy to care for.  Also, the silver color was a nice contrast from all of the bright colored reef fish.  I would highly recommend them.  I traded them in to capital reef when I downsized from my 150DD to a custom 40 breeder.  If I get another big tank someday I would get like 10-20 of them.  They would look awesome with a bunch of yellow tangs!

 

Darren

 

[KingOfAll_Tyrants]

9 minutes ago, lowsingle said:

I got all of my blue eyed cardinals from Ben at supreme reefs.  They were far better than my attempt at blue chromis.  The chromis slowly killed each other off until I had one big one and one small one, though they did school when they were small.  The cardinals are friendly and easy to care for.  Also, the silver color was a nice contrast from all of the bright colored reef fish.  I would highly recommend them.  I traded them in to capital reef when I downsized from my 150DD to a custom 40 breeder.  If I get another big tank someday I would get like 10-20 of them.  They would look awesome with a bunch of yellow tangs!

 

Darren

 

 

 

This.  If Supereme Reef is to far for folks, ask a closer SA or ORA stocking LFS to get a group.

 

Again, supposedly banggai cardinals will shoal with them peacefully throughout the banggai's lives, so one could theoretically get a small pair and place them among the bluestreaks.

[elbowdeep88]

What about Blue Reef Chromis (not regular Blue Chromis)?

https://m.liveaquaria.com/product/113/?pcatid=113

[KingOfAll_Tyrants]

Interesting. KP aquatics' writeup suggest they are actually peaceful.  

 

https://www.kpaquatics.com/product/blue-chromis/

 

Quote

 

Blue Chromis, Chromis cyanea, are a common damselfish found throughout South Florida and the Caribbean.  Chromis are popular damselfish because they are not aggressive and territorial like many of the other damselfish found throughout the Caribbean (and world for that matter).  When they are small they are often found in large schools hovering around a favorite rock or coral head, often mixed in with some of the other chromis species.  As they get bigger they tend to wander away from the school more, and eventually seek mates and lay eggs in the sand.  They are somewhat seasonal, and like many of the smaller fish I suspect that they don’t live much more than a year or two in the wild.

Chromis feed on plankton in the wild so they are easy to keep in an aquarium and don’t have any special dietary needs other than a good quality marine food.  We feed them small pellets and they gobble them up, but they will also eat flake food and frozen foods.  They don’t pick at any corals or invertebrates, so they are one of the more reef safe fish we sell.  They also don’t get real big, maybe 3′ max, so they are suitable for most small to mid sized reef tanks, or for fish only tanks.
 

 

 

I think the second point of their first paragraph is a key point: it seems a lot of fish (at least in the marine ornamental fish market) shoal/school when they're small, but then when they get older they pair off and drive others away (well beyond the confines of our average tank).   

 

ETA: forgot about this, if you want to be bold in your big tank with Royal Grammas or orchid, indigo, or sankey dottybacks:

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2564212

 

Or:

 

Quote

 

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?p=25600308&highlight=deep#post25600308

The big concern [with orchid dottybacks] is aggression, as they can be pretty mean to each other. I attempted a pair, years ago, and it didn't go so well, even in a 180. As ThRoewer pointed out, it helps if one is already bigger, so they don't have to fight it out to see who gets to be 'Big Daddy'. I saw a lot of that with my Gramma harem. There was constant bickering until one finally emerged as the king. Then harmony was achieved and breeding began.
 

 

 

I also remember a scientific survey of Royal Grammas which said the same thing: they live in caves and under rocks in groups with a Big Man in charge, and the lower you are in the group the worse spot in the cave you get.  

Edited April 17, 2020 by KingOfAll_Tyrants

[YHSublime]

I really like the Blue Eyed Cardinals, I think they would make an awesome addition. 

[dipg]

On 4/15/2020 at 2:46 PM, YHSublime said:

I like anthias. I was hoping to keep around 8-11 of whatever fish to provide movement.

Just make sure you have an automatic feeder to feed couple times a day else they will pick on one another. I have 6 of them and they are absolute joy to watch. 
 

3 yelllow tangs would be nice if introduced all at once. 
 

I also love damselfish. After seeing some in John Coppolinos tank I had get some. Despite the bad reputation if you get the ones from genus chrysiptera, the are not aggressive and absolutely stunning. I have few Starckis and they steal the show. 
 

love the other fish in your list.