Tank emergency

[Bmax]

I recently added a sump to my nano cube. Since then over the last few days everything has turned terrible. All of my corals LPS look like they're dying and my Bristlestar's his legs are deteriorating. All of my water parameters are good. Is it possible that the primer and PVC cement that I used for my PVC pipes is poisoning my tank? The fish are the only thing that appear normal.

[wade]

Yes, it is wholly possible.

 

I recommend a big water change (50% if you can swing it) and run activated carbon. (EDIT: A couple of big water changes over a couple of days... 30-50% is best. If you have good water at the proper temp and well mixed, you can even go bigger, but its risky.)

 

The best way to tell if the solvents are gone (it can take a while) is by putting your nose to a joint and sniffing. Your nose is a very good indicator of solvent presence.

 

FWIW I helped a public aquarium that was having problems losing fish. Turns out they used an epoxy sealer that was "safe" - what they didn't do was wait long enough for it to fully cure.  It can and does happen.

Edited December 18, 2013 by wade

[seantadez]

That doesn't sound good, I would do a lot of water changes to get ride any possible poison

 

 

SEANTADEZ

[Bmax]

That's what I was thinking too. I did a 5% water change last night; and, my anemone looked a little bit better this morning. Also,I started enough water yesterday for a 40% water change, that should be ready when I get home today. I was hesitant to add the PVC because I could still smell that odor. But, because it said it was "safe" I went against my better judgement. CRAP!

[sachabballi reef]

let us know where you are and if you need anyone to assist ....

[Shoelace]

How long did you wait on the PVC?

[Bmax]

Thanks Sachabballi reef. I'll have a better assessment later today.

 

Shoelace- I waited about two days to add the plumbing.

[Der ABT]

get a poly pad in there make sure the sump wasnt used for copper or something (it will turn colors depending on what its pulling out)

[bqq100]

Thanks Sachabballi reef. I'll have a better assessment later today.

 

Shoelace- I waited about two days to add the plumbing.

 

Sounds like more than enough time for the PVC primer and cement to cure.  What about baffles?  Did you add them recently?  If so was there enough time for the silicone to cure?  What type of silicone?

[wade]

Sounds like more than enough time for the PVC primer and cement to cure.  

 

This is very dependent on temperature, airflow, and humidity.  If cold, it is certainly not enough.  Again - the best bet is to smell the joints. Any sign of solvent left and its not safe.

[trockafella]

What kind of PVC glue and Cement did you use.? Ive used the kind in the red/silver can , let it sit for a very short time and used it with no issues.. Seems to me there is something more to the mystery..

[AlanM]

I ran water through my PVC when I replumbed my sump and pump going to the upstairs from the basement after like 10 minutes as soon as the glue was set. Nothing seemed to care about the PVC solvent. 

 

I'm going to be the contrarian here and say that whatever is happening isn't because of the PVC solvent.  The water shouldn't really be touching much solvent anyway, the solvent goes between the two pieces that are being welded together. 

 

I didn't use primer on my joints because they're not carrying hardly any pressure, would it really kill the tank?

[Shoelace]

I agree.  Strange things are afoot.  I've run cemented PVC after 24 hours (low pressure) without problems.  But like Wade said, conditions can vary.  Then again, if it smells...  But I still think there is something else.

[TheyCallMeMr.703]

What kind of PVC glue and Cement did you use.? Ive used the kind in the red/silver can , let it sit for a very short time and used it with no issues.. Seems to me there is something more to the mystery..

I agree, there could be other FoulPlay at hand...

  Next time, Give it more time, And Don't use so much for a Nano, There is like No Pressure really being produced., so Minimal Applications, Would typically work for a small Nano.   Live And Learn.lol

 

 Best of Luck, Hope all goes well. Keep us posted.   GL

Edited December 18, 2013 by TheyCallMeMr.703

[Shoelace]

I've also always been worried about where the PVC at HomeDepot/Lowes has sat and what it's been exposed to - like sitting next to the fertilizer on the truck, etc.  There always seems to be a powdery residue at the local HD and not the Lowes.  I usually do a tap water leak test to flush things just in case.

[Der ABT]

again id say add a poly pad.

 

where did the sump come from, previous use/meds/copper etc. what was it cleaned with. same goes for piping if new from hd should be an issue but

 

 

what return pump are you using, grouding probe??? possible stray voltage

[trockafella]

Definitely try a poly pad and see what color it produces. Anymore information would be helpful. How much new volume of water was added.? What else is in the sump.? Any other changes.?

[BowieReefer84]

You're not using distilled are you?

[YHSublime]

I think there is a lot of jumping to conclusions about it being the plumbing or the solvent because you pointed there. Der ABT brings up some good points. You've added water volume, and I presume you're mixing your own water? Your using a refractometer, is it calibrated? Your water temp is ok and not swinging with more volume now?

[wade]

Using glued plastics depends on how much you use, the volume it goes into, turnover (gas exchange) in the tank, etc etc etc.

 

This rabbithole is getting deep! :p

 

Occum said it well... the most obvious/simplest answer is the right answer (usually).

 

I can't imagine much in the way of metals or a sealed can of pvc cement being near something else (if it were gas permeable, the solvent would turn into a brick)...etc.

 

In the end, big water changes and activated carbon (and possibly, a poly pad, tho I wouldn't bother) will be your solution.

[monkiboy]

 And Don't use so much for a Nano, There is like No Pressure really being produced., so Minimal Applications, Would typically work for a small Nano.

mason, i don't know if i understand you correctly. how is adhering a joint together and the amount of solvent required for same sized pipe for a proper seal any different given the tank size? i dont want some plumbing or reefing noob having leaks or plumbing woes after reading and taking your advice as it seems to be written.

[Bmax]

The sump is a DIY 20 gallon aquarium that I purchased. I just had some glass cut to create my partitions for the refugium and baffles (for this I used the GE brand of clear silicone--in the white and gold tube). The sump was completed a week before I started the plumbing. I don’t have the cans for the primer and pvc cement with me at this time; but, the primer was in a silver and purple can and the cement was in a silver and gold can. The pvc came from my local Home Depot, which I cleaned with water before starting the process. The only other thing that I did that day was to start running GFO and ROX carbon in my reactors. The reason that I think it was the pvc cement is because of what Wade said about using your nose. I could still clearly smell the fumes, even after running water through the pipes, several times over the course of two days. I can’t smell it so much now, but I have a feeling that the contaminants are still in the tank.

[trockafella]

How about your corals took a hit bc they probably got burned. Adding GFO and carbon both clean the water, allowing for better light penetration and a shift in water chemistry. IMO I see this as more reason than the PVC solvent.

[Bmax]

But I wouldn't think that would cause my Bristlestar's legs to deteriorate all at once.

[Shoelace]

Which GE silicone exactly?

 

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2069256

 

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2199544