Deluxe ATO not working when run from timer

[AlanM]

I would like to have the Deluxe ATO powered by a timer, so it would only run from 10-11am when I am not at home to hear it. The few times I have tested it, though, it seems to not work.

 

The water level is very low, so the sensor is exposed completely. I turn the power on, and nothing happens. Then I push the sensor way down in the water and hear the switch click open. Then I pull the sensor back out to the original position and the switch closes, and the pump will start running.

 

Any suggestion for why the pump would not turn on when power is supplied even though the switch is closed?

[Djplus1]

I was involved in a thread a little while back at basically states the opposite problem if you will. Occasionally, when doing a water change and the sensor was fully submerged, it would not allow the switch to turn on or off unless I pulled the switch out of the water completely. Basically, the ato kept pumping water in, even though it was above the line. I am curious, since your problem would leave your sump dry and mine would result in a flooded floor and neither are particularly explainable with a Non mechanical switch.

[howaboutme]

I don't know exactly why..but sometimes when I do a wc (which exposes the sensor completely), I have to reset it after I bring the water line back up to the target level after turning the ATO back on. It will not remember the sensor location so I just pull it up and down to reset it. I have the height location ingrained into my head as a result. It's not a huge deal for me since it takes an extra 2 seconds but that could be the reason you're getting what you're experiencing.

[matt]

I was originally annoyed by my ato's sound too. The sound of water falling from near the top of the sump was really making my wife hate my tank.

 

Not to answer the timer question, but my solution to the noise was to put my pump output (aqualifter -> airline tubing) pointed onto the top of my ato sensor mount. The water hits a hard surface and finds it's way down to the water below while adhering to the surface of the sensor mount. I never hear it now...unless my top-off reservoir runs dry and then the aqualifter gurgles loudly to remind me it needs a refill.

[AlanM]

I don't mind the water sound, but the Deluxe ATO has a peristaltic pump on it that is kind of loud when it runs.  My sump is in the basement which should be quiet enough, except for the fact that previous owners installed a laundry chute in the master bedroom which drops right into the washing machine.  It's cute that it works like that, but the ATO sound kind of travels up the laundry chute.

 

I haven't opened up the Deluxe ATO to see what's in there, but there must be a bit more logic than just the pressure switch, because when the switch is closed (out of the water) and the power is supplied it doesn't turn on until I open and close the switch again.

[Djplus1]

I don't mind the water sound, but the Deluxe ATO has a peristaltic pump on it that is kind of loud when it runs.  My sump is in the basement which should be quiet enough, except for the fact that previous owners installed a laundry chute in the master bedroom which drops right into the washing machine.  It's cute that it works like that, but the ATO sound kind of travels up the laundry chute.

 

I haven't opened up the Deluxe ATO to see what's in there, but there must be a bit more logic than just the pressure switch, because when the switch is closed (out of the water) and the power is supplied it doesn't turn on until I open and close the switch again.

You're not kidding. I drilled a hole in my floor to run my ATO in my basement because that persitaltic pump is so loud. It would be one thing if it was faster, but it pumps for minutes at a time since it delivers such a small volume of water.

[Origami]

I have the one on my ATO reservoir (used to automatically refill the reservoir from a larger reservoir) on a timer and it works fine. I tied it to the timer through a really short extension cord, though, because the timer's outlet was on the side. Could it be that maybe the electrical outlet prongs are not making good contact in the timer outlet?

[AlanM]

It has really good contact to outlet 8 on the EB8.  I never unplug it.  I just move the sensor down and up to get it to work again.  The issue isn't with electrical supply.

 

Maybe I should take a video or something to show the ATO not running with the sensor completely out of the water.

[Origami]

Interesting. Outlet #8 is one of the relay-controlled outlets, isn't it? Does it behave the same on a triac-controlled outlet (like #7)? Like I said, I have one that's been running successfully on a timer for a couple of years, but not one connected to an Apex EB8 outlet.

[AlanM]

Yes, it's a relay controlled one.  Supposedly the very low draw devices like peristaltic pumps and Swabbie are supposed to go on the relay ones and not the triac ones.  I haven't tried it on a triac yet.

[AlanM]

So it does the same thing if I pull the wall wart that powers it off and plug it back in. If I do that it will never activate unless I submerge the sensor and then pull it back out. Making a video now.

[Origami]

So it does the same thing if I pull the wall wart that powers it off and plug it back in. If I do that it will never activate unless I submerge the sensor and then pull it back out. Making a video now.

Alan, do you have the controller version of the product (for the Apex)? Mine are just the original type - not a controller version. It doesn't use a wall wart but just plugs into the wall. This may be at the root of our different experiences. I don't know exactly how the controller version is built.

[AlanM]

Here is what it does. You can see that it is running, I pull the plug, it stops, I put the plug back in without moving the sensor, it stays off, I push the sensor down until something clicks and pull it back to the same spot, and then it runs.

 

Maybe I will open a support ticket with them from their website cause I dont think they read these board that often.

 

[howaboutme]

Alan,

 

Keep this thread updated if you do follow up w/ Avast. Like my post above, this happens to me every time when I do wc's (I unplug the ATO). Apparently, the sensor needs to be re-set every time it's unplugged. I thought (and still do) just think it's just a design glitch so haven't thought too much of it. After a wc, I do exactly what you just did, push the sensor down until it clicks, then up about 1/2", or wherever I remember my sweat spot is for the sensor to give me the right water line. I posted something about this a few months ago and a few people chimed in w/ similar issues/suggestions.

[Origami]

You have something completely different than I have. I overlooked that this was a "Deluxe" which integrates the ATO. I didn't realize that the ATO was added in this way. Sorry, I'm not familiar with the innards in this particular product or the specs on that pump. You can send a note to Justin or Dan over at Avast and they can look into it and get back to you.

[ctenophore]

Hi All,

 

Sorry, just saw this.  I am going to check it out and try to reproduce on my end (I use the exact same setup on my system).  Will let you know asap.

 

Justin

[AlanM]

Thanks.  I'll wait to hear before I open up the box and see if I can see what it does that's different from the pressure switch on the skimmate locker.

[dandy7200]

You have a bad power supply.  It is not delivering enough current to power the start up of the pump.  When you submerge the sensor it charges the caps inside the power supply, then lift it to activate the cycle and the caps now have enough reserve to start motor.  Since the nature of this device requires instantaneous start up current full load has to be available at the beginning of the cycle or the motor wont start as you are observing.

[dandy7200]

You have something completely different than I have. I overlooked that this was a "Deluxe" which integrates the ATO. I didn't realize that the ATO was added in this way. Sorry, I'm not familiar with the innards in this particular product or the specs on that pump. You can send a note to Justin or Dan over at Avast and they can look into it and get back to you.

 

How could you miss this, you were the one who helped me calculate the power requirements 

[Origami]

How could you miss this, you were the one who helped me calculate the power requirements 

Ha. I remember doing that (now that you mention it) and the subsequent re-spec on the power supply. *forehead-slap*

[AlanM]

You have a bad power supply.  It is not delivering enough current to power the start up of the pump.  When you submerge the sensor it charges the caps inside the power supply, then lift it to activate the cycle and the caps now have enough reserve to start motor.  Since the nature of this device requires instantaneous start up current full load has to be available at the beginning of the cycle or the motor wont start as you are observing.

I hope I didnt accidentally switch power supplies with cheap ebay one I bought for my apex, but I dont think I did.

 

Here is the pic of my power supply. Sounds like it's all Tom's fault after all if he specced it out.

 

[Origami]

^^Good one. No, I spec'd the replacement supply after Dan asked me about it. A few did get out with an underpowered supply if I correctly recall what I was told.

[dandy7200]

Alan,

 

You didn't swap power supplies, it looks like we accidentally packed the incorrect one with your order.  Yours says .5A and the correct one is 1A.  I emailed you so we can correct the problem.

[dandy7200]

I do like the idea of blaming Tom though.......

[Origami]

I do like the idea of blaming Tom though.......

e tu Brutus.

 

Did somebody get the plate off the bus that I was just thrown under?