good to see so much LED's

[zygote2k]

No matter what style or type of LED that you go with, I'm just glad to see so many people making the switch from energy wasting expensive fluorescent and halide to new tech., low power, high light LED's.

[bambam]

I am sort of new to this, how do LED's work?

[Noobalicious]

My MC/PC bulbs only have a couple months on them, so I figure I can take my time building a new LED lighting rig and have it ready by the time new bulbs are needed. Just need to start reading up on all the DIY articles.

Edited March 31, 2010 by Noobalicious

[Brian Ward]

I am sort of new to this, how do LED's work?

 

You use an array of high-output LEDs to replace your current light source. Head over to the DIY forum and look for chucelli's post on how to build an LED light fixture.

[bambam]

thanks

[F&Fmgr]

"handheld, filter-based lux meters may be inexpensive and convenient, but are notoriously unreliable for measuring

[zygote2k]

I like LEDs, and I plan to use them as accent/actinic supp. however i think with any LED system, format, or wattage I think the maximum depth of tank they should be used on is 20"

 

Sean

 

You're basing this on what?

I know for a proven fact that the PAR38's penetrate all the way down to 32" and there is enough light that the montiporas on the very bottom are growing rapidly. Maybe those 1watt LED's are best used on shallow tanks- something to consider if you're shelling out $500 for a light fixture.

Proof is in the pudding- 2 weeks time difference in these 2 photos-

[Jon Lazar]

I think a more robust evaluation of this LED lighting configuration would be to put LED lighting over one side of a tank, and "traditional" lighting over the other. Then place two frag racks with equal-sized frags from the same mother coral, and normalize the setup for distance to the lights, flow, and anything else you can think of. Then measure the results. That way it's not just an anecdotal evaluation.

[F&Fmgr]

rob those pics show about 1/8"-1/4" of growth of montiporas in two weeks. Under PC's when i first started the store i would get that same growth rate at 13" tank depth plus 6" from light to tank (19" total). The color improvement is great(which we both agree on) but the growth is normal IME.

 

"You're basing this on what?"

I'm basing this on the 1watt LEDs as after 20-24" the 1 watters lose par to the point where you wont get enough growth in SPS, however i think LPS and softies still grow well in 60-100 PAR. Also im basing this on the fact that your tank is 24" deep and those montis are on the bottom and getting what I consider normal growth. The acro growing that you posted a pic of had considerably fast growth(was the growth over a month or 2 weeks?). That impressed me. but what depth is the acro at? you said 12" I think(correct me if I'm wrong).

"I know for a proven fact that the PAR38's penetrate all the way down to 32"

 

At what PAR do they penetrate to 32"? I mean VHO's and VHO T5's penetrate to around 30". In my experience you don't need a ton of light to grow monti's like that. What I am impressed about is the low energy consumption and the colors displayed by LEDs. Regardless of make or model or wattage used, LEDs give unprecedented PAR vs power consumption.

 

I'm not trying to argue with you whether or not a higher wattage lamp puts out more par than a lower wattage one. We all know the answer that. But you seem to think that the PAR 38s are a better value. Each bulb costs 120, you have 3-4 bulbs. thats anywhere from $360-$480. and because of the angle of your reflectors the light is more concentrated, giving higher PAR readings, but the light does not cover the entire tank. Don't you think that with a wider angle reflector youd lose PAR the deeper you went at a faster rate than with the 40 deg. lights that "spotlight" your tank? Also consider the cost of lighting your whole tank with the par38 40 degree bulbs how many more would you need? 1,2,3 maybe 4? Thats potentially hundreds of dollars more. So if you needed 6 bulbs, lets say, to cover all surfaces in your tank thats at least $600 not counting materials and time to fabricate a light rack. Or, the other option would be to have wider angled reflectors from which the PAR would diminish at shallower depths than the 40 degree bulbs.

 

I am going to contact Ecoxotic and ask them about their optics angles and reflectors. they responded to my questions about PAR saying that at 12" tank depth and 6" between the light fixture they reported the PAR around 180-200. I think thats a pretty good par reading for that depth when compared to 250 watt MH 20Ks

 

Sean

[F&Fmgr]

I think a more robust evaluation of this LED lighting configuration would be to put LED lighting over one side of a tank, and "traditional" lighting over the other. Then place two frag racks with equal-sized frags from the same mother coral, and normalize the setup for distance to the lights, flow, and anything else you can think of. Then measure the results. That way it's not just an anecdotal evaluation.

 

+1

I plan to do that soon by using a 60 cube( Ive wanted one ever since I sold Rob his) and lighting it with LED only and tying it to a 120 so they share the same water. I plan to have all of the same corals in both tanks.

[zygote2k]

The staghorn that is growing fast is about 12" from the light. The montis are 32" from the light. Yeah- montis will grow with lower light than acros, but the proof is that enough light is penetrating to the bottom to achieve rapid growth. If you use 60 degree or 80 degree optics, you'll get more light coverage but significantly less par. I wanted the most par and I also wanted the spotlight effect. I'm so tired of the pile of rocks and every surface lit up. The spotlighting makes you plan your rock structure according to where the strong light shines the most.

We're not talking about conventional lighting anymore- I think we're done with halides, t5's, pc's, vho's, etc. Simply stated, the PAR38's offer the most bang for the buck. I replaced my 400w halide with 3) P38's. I paid $90 each wholesale and I had to build my own fixture for about $30. Even if I was to pay retail, they are significantly cheaper than most any conventional light system. I got 500 par at 12"- can the ecoxotics do that? I believe the answer will be "no". The 40 degrees are not for everyone- so get 60's or 80's if you want the whole tank lit up.

Honestly, I think if you build the reef correctly, you'll need a lot less light than with a conventional system and achieve the same growth rates.

FWIW, I'm building a 9 bulb, 5) 12k 40 degree and 4) 20k 40 degree light system on a 210. I/we will be using track lighting and the lights will highlight 3 individual columns. If I were to use the 24.5" Ecoxotics to light the same area, it would cost nearly $1500 and I couldn't get much light to the bottom.

I'm also converting a maintenance tank by replacing a 400w HQI with 3) 40 degree bulbs.

I wouldn't be this preachy if they didn't work.

Edited April 1, 2010 by zygote2k

[zygote2k]

From Evilc66 on Michigan Reefers-

 

To anyone entertaining the thought of using these lamps, forget everything you know about lighting an aquarium. The quicker you do that, the easier it is to use these lights. They create such a different effect, and are so positionable, that you can't just say that you need X lamps for Y area. Get creative. Think of it like lighting a statue. You wouldn't hang a shop light over it and call it good, would you? No. You would position spotlights around it and have them shine on different areas to highlight certain features. Consider your rockwork in much the same way. It's not that good of an example with the "wall of rock" look, but if you have peaks or towers in your rock, take advantage of the features. You now also don't need to think about low, medium and high light areas going from bottom to top of the tank. Now you can have lower or higher light areas wherever you want them.

[amos]

Interesting analysis:

 

http://glassbox-design.com/2010/par-spread-nanocustoms-par38-led-spotlight/

[Charlie]

Maybe we could have a DIY build party sometime. We could order heatsink material (maybe with a GB discount) cut them to size, use chucelli's (or create one) template to drill the holes and the more expirenced of a us could help teach folks how to use a soldering iron. Just an idea.

[Novi]

Maybe in like a year or 2 when I go BIG Upgrade (3-400 Gallon Big) I am definitely going to go with LED's. There just amazing and you cant beat the growth, color, and expense no matter how you look at it.

[Gadgets]

I like using LEDs, just not as the main lighting. I'm actually using all three types of lighting.

 

1. Metal Halide

2. T5 Fluorescent

3. LED Actinic PowerBrites

[overklok]

I have replaced all my T-5 and CF fluorescent supplements with LEDs.

 

On my 90 I replaced the CFs in the Coralife fixture with 2 Reefbrite 48" 24 watt Blue LEDs.

 

On my 50 corner I have replaced the CFs and T-5s with CoralVue 2x14 watt blue LEDs and Ice Cap moonlights.

 

Much better color and less light on the glass, the LEDs are more focused.

 

I am running 150 20,000 K radiums and LEDs.

[BowieReefer84]

( I am new and posted this already as it's own thread, but it is better fitted under this thread)

 

Hello All!

 

http://www.saltwater...controller.html

 

It says the fixture is equivilant to a 400 watt MH . . . I am curious what others think. If it is the same output as a 400 watt MH, and produces the shimmer effect WITHOUT producing heat it seems like it is worth looking into. Hopefully someone on here has first hand experience with this light system. maybe? Also note that this fixture allows your lights to cycle in a 29 day lunar cycle. AKA sunrise to sunset intensity changes . . .pretty sweet in my opinion. I don't really want to debate cost / value as it is obviously pretty expensive. I am more interested in overall performance and ability to keep sps.

[zygote2k]

( I am new and posted this already as it's own thread, but it is better fitted under this thread)

 

Hello All!

 

http://www.saltwater...controller.html

 

It says the fixture is equivilant to a 400 watt MH . . . I am curious what others think. If it is the same output as a 400 watt MH, and produces the shimmer effect WITHOUT producing heat it seems like it is worth looking into. Hopefully someone on here has first hand experience with this light system. maybe? Also note that this fixture allows your lights to cycle in a 29 day lunar cycle. AKA sunrise to sunset intensity changes . . .pretty sweet in my opinion. I don't really want to debate cost / value as it is obviously pretty expensive. I am more interested in overall performance and ability to keep sps.

sounds like you should be the guinea pig and test it.

[BowieReefer84]

I am currently running a 29G with softies (pulsing xenia, ric's, short gsp, long gsp, colt coral . . . ) and 130 watts of PC which works well. I am planning an upgrade, and just trying to create a wishlist. I would love to be the guinea pig, but now isn't the time. hahaha

 

 

[zygote2k]

I am currently running a 29G with softies (pulsing xenia, ric's, short gsp, long gsp, colt coral . . . ) and 130 watts of PC which works well. I am planning an upgrade, and just trying to create a wishlist. I would love to be the guinea pig, but now isn't the time. hahaha

You could use the PAR38's- 2 of them would probably be sufficient.

[BowieReefer84]

zygote,

 

Thank you for all your input. Truly appreciated! I was able to find these . . . http://www.ledliquidatorsinc.com/PAR_38_12_LED_Cree_light_bulb.php

 

Would you recommend 12, 24, or 36 watt? Also, do they make par 38's in blue? I know Cree is a good brand from what I have researched so far.

 

Thanks!

[trockafella]

Not those par38's. The Evill66 Par38, found on nano-tuners.com. They come in 12k and 20k, or you can get them in all blue and all red..

 

 

[BowieReefer84]

10-4. Can those go in any track light fixture, or is there something specific people are using? I really like the easy set up of these, and the pendant look they have!!

 

 

[trockafella]

Nope, they use a basic socket, ive seen some pretty nice track lighting used with these..