fish ideas again... bigger tank

[treesprite]

As history has it, I have not liked people's suggestions or they have been unrealistic. It's possible that I'm being too picky, so I'm going to try extending myself a little more. Please give me some ideas that make sense and aren't "out in left field" or too far removed from what I'm trying to find. This will maybe be a little easier because I have a bigger tank.

 

Be realistic please. I'm tired and frustrated looking at pictures of fish all the time and not finding what I want.

 

65 gal display, dimensions 36Lx18Wx24H

system volumn 95 gal (30 in sump)

 

Current fish occupants:

1 fridmani psuedochromis (orchid dottyback) (less aggressive than the others)

1 male tomato clown

1 very big female tomato clown

1 Vanderbilt chromis

 

Looking for:

1 medium-sized fish (when mature), up to 4 to 6". that is predominantly or half yellow... light orange=dark yellow, so that's ok too

and

a few small pretty fish, up to 2 to 3", prefer ones that will hang with each other, but ok if not

 

Do not suggest:

tangs (yellow tang's my dream fish and this tank is too short)

mean damsels

difficult to care for fish

fish that are pale and ugly

aggressive fish

non-reef safe fish

venemous fish

red, black, or brown fish

fish that are clearly incompatible (you'll have to help me on this)

high-priced fish

 

At this exact moment I am considering for the medium-sized fish with yellow, a bicolor anthias (psuedanthias bicolor). The "yellow" is actually a light orange, but that's fine. The mature size is supposedly up to 5". Feedback???

 

Thanks.

 

NOTE: if you have a pic of what you're suggesting, or a link to one, please post it.

Edited November 15, 2007 by treesprite

[davelin315]

Hmmm... a little picky, are we?

 

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that you're rolling the dice with anthias. You want an easy to care for fish and anthias in general are planktonic grazers - on the reef they eat all day by picking zooplankton from the water column. As such they need to be fed a couple of times a day or they rapidly deteriorate. Ever since I bought some from Flying Fish Express during their inception (they are now liveaquaria.com) I have learned the hard way that they are not for a tank that is not kept up constantly as I always lost them all due to feeding difficulty.

 

Now, as far as available choices, you've ruled out an awful lot of fish already. I'm not convinced that you couldn't do a yellow tang in your tank. Also, with the relative aggressiveness of your fish, you're looking for some problems by adding a less aggressive fish into your system. I would suggest a Centryopyge angel of some sort. They can hold their own and they are fairly compatible with reef systems. Only thing I would worry about is that large female clown. I have had problems with large female clowns hitting anything that touches the water after they are established and breaking them in half to immobilize and then feed to an anemone or themselves.

[zotzer]

How about a midas blenny? Beautiful yellow fish with a lot of character. I enjoy having fish that occupy different places in the water column. Plus, it eats algae, so it serves a purpose too...besides just being cute.

 

Tracy

[treesprite]

I didn't know anthias were like that.... thanks for the info.

 

I used to think my female clown was the killer of damsels I used to have, but now I believe she was scapegoated by that one single damsel that was left... I always found it interesting that she chose that one specific one to let live.... wasn't her that killed them. The female clown ignores the dottyback and tolerates it stealing food from her mouth, and she pays no attention to the little vanderbilt chromis.

 

The fridmani is the dottyback that is not terribly aggressive, just very territorial. I haven't seen it go after the chromis so far.

 

So, with this tang thing. A zillion people say no. 3 people have said they thought it would be ok. Do I listen to a zillion or to the mere 3, just because I so selfishly really really want a yellow tang? The one I used to have in my 45 (long time ago) grew from very small to a big bright ball of sun, plump, active, "happy looking", and ate anything I fed to it... I really miss that fish :(

 

I'm inclined to believe that people are afraid to speak up if they think tangs are ok in tanks that are less than 75gal, hence I haven't asked. Maybe I should. So who is willing to speak what they really think, in spite of tang police?

[wreck]

How about a scribble rabbitfish? I picked one up from Beltway Bandit when he broke down his tank. I thought my big 4" female Tomato Clown was going to terrorize him, but they get along great and they're like best buddies now. The rabbitfish has very interesting yellow mazelike lines on it's sides,yellow fins, and also eats algae, but I've been told the dorsal fins are somewhat venomous.

Wreck

[lanman]

How about a Royal Gramma? Mine has always been a model citizen; holds his own with a moderately aggressive clown, a mildly aggressive coral beauty, and a very aggressive Lyretail Anthia.

 

 

bob

[jason the filter freak]

my vote is on a bi-color angel... awesome and pretty to boot

[Carl]

I had a great yellow tang in my 60 gallon tank for 6 years.

 

She got along fine with a pygmy angel, blue chromis, a pair of percula clowns, and a flame hawk.

 

-Carl

[bk_market]

I think you definitely should do a yellow tang or a hippo tang.

Try Aquarium One they got tiny yellow tang about 1" very cute

 

 

Lyretail anthias work too. If I ever catch one of my male lyretail from my tank i can give one to u. Guarantee healthy and eating like a pig all kind of food.

Edited November 15, 2007 by bk_market

[treesprite]

hmmm.... let's see.

 

Royal gramma - I was planning to get one, then bought the dotty off someone for 10 bucks. It was in a 29g with a little percula and no problem with aggression. Bk, wasn't that you that was going to ****** it as I raced from work to get it? Thank goodness for empty pockets or I'd have had to fight you. Anyway, dottys and grammas are supposedly incompatible so I'm leaving that idea out.

 

Angels - I thought none are reef-safe?? Otherwise I'd have probably already taken care of this problem. Bi-colors look like someone cut a yellow fish and blue fish in half and glued them together. Reminds me of a mermaid I saw.... it was in this tiny museum.... someone sewed the top of a monkey waist up, to the bottom half of a fish and preserved it... how sick is that?

 

Scribbled rabbitfish - I will have to look up a picture of one since I don't know what it is.

 

I really don't like blennies... I kind of don't see them as "fish".

[dhoch]

How about a canary wrasse? Beautiful fish, definitely yellow and fit's your size need.

 

link: http://www.marinedepotlive.com/golden-cori...h--wrasses.html

 

Dave

[treesprite]

How about a canary wrasse? Beautiful fish, definitely yellow and fit's your size need.

 

link: http://www.marinedepotlive.com/golden-cori...h--wrasses.html

 

Dave

 

It's definately a nice looking fish, and if there weren't other problems, I would certainly have it on the possibility list if that expert warning is for some inconsequential reason.

 

Here are the potential problems:

1. supposedly not compatible with dottybacks (dotty's fault), though I think that has more to do with appearance and it's a different color

2. the ad says it needs more sand... my SSB is only 1"... anyone have anything to say about that?

4. it's a jumper, which would not be a big deal if it was the only negative consideration

 

Does anyone here have this wrasse, have this wrasse with a dottyback, and/or have this wrasse without a lot of sand?

 

Hey, anyone with suggestions, could you please post pics and descriptions of requirements and stuff? Thanks.

Edited November 15, 2007 by treesprite

[mosheikh]

Radiant Wrasse - Very colorful and active fish.

[Rascal]

A lot of fish aren't considered compatible with dottybacks. You might consider putting the dotty in your sump for a month or two while any newcomers get established.

 

IMO you could put a smallish Tang (Yellow, Tang, Tomini) as long as there was plenty of swimming room for it and you didn't overcrowd the tank with other big (for your tank) fish. I do not think it would be a good idea to buy a small Tang of a species that gets big and needs a lot more swimming room. Personally I would not recommend a Hippo for a 3 foot tank. I know there are those who have done it and been successful, but I think they are the exception rather than the rule.

 

I second the recommendations for Royal Gramma and Midas Blenny.

 

For small pretty fish I have been happy with my purple reef chromis and Talbots Damsels. Both are nice looking, stay small, and non-aggressive. Also look into blue and yellow neon gobies and perhaps a couple of clown gobies.

[vaironman]

Would a flame angel be OK?

 

It usually costs around $55-$60 - high price category?

Orange body + blue tip fins. Some with really orange close to red color. Overtime, the color will lose a little bit and becomes more of an orangist color.

[treesprite]

Do you think it would be hard to get someone to swap out their juvie yellow tang for a bigger one if I got a juvie and it was time for it to be in a bigger tank? I wouldn't want to get the fish knowing I would end up giving it up, but trading it with someone I "know" just for size would not be like giving it up.

 

Here is a question about tangs. Some sites give smaller tank requirements for yellow mimic, aka, chocolate tangs (is it acantharus pyro something?) than they do for other tangs. Does anyone know anything about them? Are they more likely to do ok in a smaller tank as some of the sites are saying? How long do they retain the solid yellow, and what do they usually look like later (I've seen pictures of mature ones and they are not all the same)?

 

Flame angel = not wanting that color, and last time I got one, I had it home for 1 day and took it back due to reading that they aren't reef-safe. I would just get a lemonpeel angel if I wasn't worried about it picking at things, instead of trying so hard to find a yellow fish.

 

There's the dotty aggression thing again. Fridmanis (or Orchids) are the exception to dottyback aggressiveness, otherwise I wouldn't have gotten it. It's territorial, but doesn't typically carry on aggressive attacks outside of it's own space or with fish that are not similar to it in shape and color. Supposedly Fridmanis are ok even with peaceful gobies.

 

Blue neon gobies are something I've considered. Not my ideal fish, but maybe good enough. There are some other smaller fish I've thought about, but I'll wait for suggestions.

 

I would want to be able to get fish from a trusted source, where I know there are good qt and preventative procedures taken on new arrivals. I don't mind driving a little further out for the peace of mind, as I have a terrible "new fish" anxiety issue. I also wouldn't mind getting fish from another member if anyone is looking to sell something and hasn't had a disease for a couple of years, or any recently introduced fish that might have something.

 

Am I the only person who has this much trouble selecting fish?

[zotzer]

 

Am I the only person who has this much trouble selecting fish?

 

For every reason you may want a certain fish, the internet has blessed us with the capability of finding ten reasons not to get one. This is both good and bad.

 

For what it's worth, I have an order in with MS for three of these teeny tiny gobies. The intent is a micro-school for the main tank. I think they have a neat metallic color. They didn't come in this week....hopefully we'll have better luck with next week's shipment. Maybe something different that you hadn't thought of.....

 

http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Di...cfm?pCatId=2560

 

Tracy

[copps]

 

Looking for:

1 medium-sized fish (when mature), up to 4 to 6". that is predominantly or half yellow... light orange=dark yellow, so that's ok too

and

a few small pretty fish, up to 2 to 3", prefer ones that will hang with each other, but ok if not

 

 

As for the former, what about one or two pyramid butterflies... a reef safe butterfly of the genus Hemitauricthys that feeds mainly on plankton up in the water column... Here's a shot Chris (143gadgets) took of my pair...

 

As for the latter, people always like my group of glass or blue eye cardinals (Apogon leptacanthus) when seen in person, and they are one of the very few fish that will form a true school throughout life in a small aquarium...

 

So, with this tang thing. A zillion people say no. 3 people have said they thought it would be ok. Do I listen to a zillion or to the mere 3, just because I so selfishly really really want a yellow tang? The one I used to have in my 45 (long time ago) grew from very small to a big bright ball of sun, plump, active, "happy looking", and ate anything I fed to it... I really miss that fish :(

 

I'm inclined to believe that people are afraid to speak up if they think tangs are ok in tanks that are less than 75gal, hence I haven't asked. Maybe I should. So who is willing to speak what they really think, in spite of tang police?

 

So many things are written on message boards because people "read it somewhere"... and not as a result of first hand experience... Grouping all tangs together in requirements and appropriate tank size is wrong no matter how its done... There are tangs I feel comfortable with in a 65 gallon and tangs I wouldn't feel comfortable putting in a 500 gallon... For the most part tangs could be broken down by genera, and Zebrasoma (of which the yellow is Zebrasoma flavescens) happen to be the most suited to smaller aquarium in my opinion. They also grow much slower than other genera of tangs, like the hippo for instance, which I'd stay away from in a three foot tank. Small Zebrasoma are fine in smaller systems and grow slowly... if you got a small yellow tang (not too small as the tiny ones are tougher to adapt and lose body weight very quickly adapting sometimes) you could keep it for years in the 65... the bottom line is that for every tang that dies as a result of outgrowing a system, there are at least 50,000 that die as a result of human error before being given a chance to outgrow it... why don't the "tang police" concentrate on that? ... stick with Zebrasoma and you'll be fine...

 

 

Angels - I thought none are reef-safe??

 

No!!!! I have about 20 angels with most in reefs... I could write a book about this, but suffice it to say that is wrong... not only could you keep them, you could keep a spawning pair in a 65 and watch them each night!

 

How about a canary wrasse? Beautiful fish, definitely yellow and fit's your size need.

 

link: http://www.marinedepotlive.com/golden-cori...h--wrasses.html

 

Dave

 

 

It's definately a nice looking fish, and if there weren't other problems, I would certainly have it on the possibility list if that expert warning is for some inconsequential reason.

 

Here are the potential problems:

1. supposedly not compatible with dottybacks (dotty's fault), though I think that has more to do with appearance and it's a different color

2. the ad says it needs more sand... my SSB is only 1"... anyone have anything to say about that?

4. it's a jumper, which would not be a big deal if it was the only negative consideration

 

Does anyone here have this wrasse, have this wrasse with a dottyback, and/or have this wrasse without a lot of sand?

 

Hey, anyone with suggestions, could you please post pics and descriptions of requirements and stuff? Thanks.

 

This is a great suggestion Dave... this fish is awesome... cheap, colorful, and hardy... yes they jump but so could ALL fish at one time or another, so you should plan for it anyway! I cannot comment on their compatability with a dottyback because dottybacks are completely unpredictable... you should know yours... I keep mine with the little bit of sand I have for aesthetics and he's fine... here he is...

 

 

 

Radiant Wrasse - Very colorful and active fish.

 

Another good suggestion and a close relative of the canary wrasse, but much more dark red than anything and a bit pricey as you're paying its plane ticket from Africa...

 

A lot of fish aren't considered compatible with dottybacks. You might consider putting the dotty in your sump for a month or two while any newcomers get established.

 

IMO you could put a smallish Tang (Yellow, Tang, Tomini) as long as there was plenty of swimming room for it and you didn't overcrowd the tank with other big (for your tank) fish. I do not think it would be a good idea to buy a small Tang of a species that gets big and needs a lot more swimming room. Personally I would not recommend a Hippo for a 3 foot tank. I know there are those who have done it and been successful, but I think they are the exception rather than the rule.

 

I second the recommendations for Royal Gramma and Midas Blenny.

 

For small pretty fish I have been happy with my purple reef chromis and Talbots Damsels. Both are nice looking, stay small, and non-aggressive. Also look into blue and yellow neon gobies and perhaps a couple of clown gobies.

 

A good post and I back it up... hippos grow quickly, are more skittish, and require more swimming room than Zebrasoma... I'll second the suggestion of Talbot's damsels... mild mannered and pretty... if anything's going to tango with your dottyback it would be a royal gramma, so you may want to stay away from those...

 

Do you think it would be hard to get someone to swap out their juvie yellow tang for a bigger one if I got a juvie and it was time for it to be in a bigger tank? I wouldn't want to get the fish knowing I would end up giving it up, but trading it with someone I "know" just for size would not be like giving it up.

 

 

Again this would be years and years down the line...

 

Here is a question about tangs. Some sites give smaller tank requirements for yellow mimic, aka, chocolate tangs (is it acantharus pyro something?) than they do for other tangs. Does anyone know anything about them? Are they more likely to do ok in a smaller tank as some of the sites are saying? How long do they retain the solid yellow, and what do they usually look like later (I've seen pictures of mature ones and they are not all the same)?

 

Acanthurus pyroferus is a species that mimics different pygmy angels in different areas, thus the different colorations... Most Acanthurus species tangs require alot of swimming space, but when small these mimics act much more like the pygmies they are mimicking, requiring less swimming room than other Acanthurus you may see flying in the surge zone... they also do not grow as large as most of the other Acanthurus... but definitely not suitable for a 3 foot tank for too long... As to your last question this species will only hold their solid yellow coloration to about the size of an adult lemonpeel or other Centropyge, because after that it does not benefit them...

 

Flame angel = not wanting that color, and last time I got one, I had it home for 1 day and took it back due to reading that they aren't reef-safe. I would just get a lemonpeel angel if I wasn't worried about it picking at things, instead of trying so hard to find a yellow fish.

 

A flame angel has a much better chance in a reef than a lemonpeel... lemonpeels are amongst the worst... I have one of 12 captive bred lemonpeels ever produced and even he picks on corals... so much for the "doesn't know corals" theory!

 

Hope that helps...

 

Copps

[davelin315]

I agree with John's loooonnnngggg post! Don't believe everything you read. I have had a bunch of different angels in my reef tanks and none of them ate any corals, but then again, each individual is different. To list them, I've had a keyhole/Melas, coral beauty, Potters (not recommended - difficult angel), pygmy, bi-color, flame, lemonpeel, eblei, midnight, Shepard's, Fischer's, and none of them have picked. That's not to say that this will always be the case, but you have to know each fish before you buy them! They are liable to change their mind... at school we just got a bi-color that was picking at sps, so it went into a FOWLR at school.

 

Forrest, really, you need to look for a fish that you like and then, if you're not sure, ask people what their specific opinions are on them. You'll get a huge laundry list of fish, as you have seen, if you don't ask for a specific thing.

[treesprite]

Forrest, really, you need to look for a fish that you like and then, if you're not sure, ask people what their specific opinions are on them. You'll get a huge laundry list of fish, as you have seen, if you don't ask for a specific thing.

 

Actually this is helpful. It seems when I do it the other way around, there are always issues with my ideas. I think I've come to a conclusion, thanks to the great feedback and the suggestions.

 

Talbots damsels are not aggressive like other damsels? The damsel I had that carpet surfed looked like the talbots except the blue and yellow were reversed. It was very mean, but a beautiful healthy creature.

 

Since there is some support that it would be ok to keep a yellow tang in there, I feel comfortable enough doing that. I also think it would be nice to try the blue-eyed cardinals.... what number would be best in consideration of them and the other fish?

[dbartco]

candy hogfish?

[vaironman]

On Angel, if I may add a little more this species and Copps is the expert on this subject. I currently have two (one flame and one majestic) in my full of reef tank and some are expensive frags. They have never touched any of my LPS or SPS. I do feed them daily and they are fat, healthy. Started both with small size angels, the majestic is now at medium size. The flame is at full adult size now. However, Copps suggestion of the blue eyes cardinal is excellent. I saw 2 pairs at Dandy7200 new tank last night and it's the next thing that have to have. Not that expensive to get a school and just cool looking when they start breeding with the male mouth all big........ huge........ (carrying the babies inside)

[zotzer]

candy hogfish?

 

I love mine! I accidentally snapped some pics of him, while trying to get some of the blue xenia frag for Bob. Happy accident....he is very hard to photograph because he is a fast swimmer! He has the coolest irridescent eyes.....

 

 

 

Oh, BTW....I got him in a group buy from BlueZooAquatics.com. So, ordering online from them doesn't always turn out badly.

 

Tracy

Edited November 16, 2007 by zotzer

[treesprite]

"doesn't always" is an automatic statement of risk, because even though it says something might not be bad, it also says something might not be good. I'll stick to purchasing in person... yeah I could use the lower cost given my budget, but I would rather have to wait for having enough mad money than to risk the fish's life.