Alkalinity Spike, but nothing has changed....

[YHSublime]

Hey WAMAS,

 

I'm trying to do some problem solving here. I've added a few corals to my tank, like tiny frags, nothing huge, and my alkalinity has jumped from steady 8.6 all the way up to 12.8dKH which I just tested today. 

 

None of the corals are showing stress (at least yet), so I double checked, and came up with the same number. I checked the date on my reagent, and it's good until August/2022. 

 

No recent water changes, and I dose ESV 2 part. My next step is checking the dosers/delivery. Is there any other way my alkalinity to flex so hard?

[YHSublime]

I just realized some things have changed. For example, a big one is I've started running carbon, and my lights have been dimmed recently (from 75% to about 50%) so those are two giant changes, would that/could that effect my dKH?

 

[howaboutme]

When you double checked, did you use the same test? When I get an off number, I always check it w/ another test so I typically keep at least 2, if not 3, different alk tests at once. Your number is so different that I'd like it is testing error. Are you at the end of your regents?

[YHSublime]

3 minutes ago, howaboutme said:

When you double checked, did you use the same test? When I get an off number, I always check it w/ another test so I typically keep at least 2, if not 3, different alk tests at once. Your number is so different that I'd like it is testing error. Are you at the end of your regents?

 

I'm about to check right now, it is at the end of the reagent, but I've been using it for the past 2 months or so. That being said, I lapsed from 11/22 being the last sample I took up until today, but when I stopped I had a daily history of 8.4-8.6 steady. 

[YHSublime]

I dose the same amount of each solution (alkalinity and calcium) per day, and I know this is happening because my dosing containers are equal in volume right now. 

[howaboutme]

I've had issues w/ wild numbers when you get to the end of the regents. Since you checked your doser I'd still err towards testing error. Can you go to LFS to get another Alk test? I'd also think your Alk won't wouldn't rise if you lowered your lighting as lowering lighting is lowering photosynthesis thus lowering ph.

Edited December 6, 2021 by howaboutme
gave incorrect comment, corrected above!

[YHSublime]

2 minutes ago, howaboutme said:

I've had issues w/ wild numbers when you get to the end of the regents. Since you checked your doser I'd still err towards testing error. Can you go to LFS to get another Alk test? I'd also think your Alk won't rise if you lowered your lighting as lowering lighting is lowering photosynthesis thus lowering ph.

 

Couple local reefers I've reached out to to see if I can get a second opinion on a water test. I'm never reactive, but this is a mystery for sure. 

[DaJMasta]

Sounds like less light is meaning less photosynthesis and growth, which is depleting the alkalinity from the water slower and causing the number to rise with a fixed dose.  I'd just back off the amount and tune it back up when either the corals settle into the new lighting or when it comes back up and their growth speeds up.

[YHSublime]

1 minute ago, DaJMasta said:

Sounds like less light is meaning less photosynthesis and growth, which is depleting the alkalinity from the water slower and causing the number to rise with a fixed dose.  I'd just back off the amount and tune it back up when either the corals settle into the new lighting or when it comes back up and their growth speeds up.

 

That's a good theory. Once I get another opinion and if the alk #'s are the same, that's exactly what I will do. 

[howaboutme]

9 minutes ago, DaJMasta said:

Sounds like less light is meaning less photosynthesis and growth, which is depleting the alkalinity from the water slower and causing the number to rise with a fixed dose.  I'd just back off the amount and tune it back up when either the corals settle into the new lighting or when it comes back up and their growth speeds up.

This is it! My comment was wrong so I adjusted my comment above so no one else makes a mistake.

[YHSublime]

This poor little tank, everything swings so wildly, and I'm busy paying attention to other things that are wrecking my regularly scheduled programing. I'm going to do a water change which will lower it, adjust dosers down, and pull the carbon. 

 

I'm also going to get back to daily testing. 

[JJKK]

I know you listed alot of corals forsale.  Do you have less corals now then before so the alk isn't been consumed as much?

[DaJMasta]

While the water change will get it down faster, I don't know if it's a requirement.  Generally high alkalinity only seems to be really a problem when in conjunction with really low nitrate/phosphate and then people will see 'alkalinity burns' on stony corals.  I think the Red Sea Coral Pro I'm using is supposed to mix to 11dKH, so even at 12.8 dKH you're not so far outside the normal range.

While you're probably fine either way, if it crept up in a short amount of time, the water change may be better (corals haven't gotten used to it being high), but if it took a while, it may be better to gradually lower it by just reducing supplementation enough for it slowly fall.

[YHSublime]

9 minutes ago, JJKK said:

I know you listed alot of corals forsale.  Do you have less corals now then before so the alk isn't been consumed as much?

 

I'm going through my FS posts and nothing has really left the tank that would make an impact, softies or anemones. The big stuff I still have. I've actually put more in than has left, and most of what's gone in has been SPS. I honestly think it really is a lighting/consumption thing. Once that CSB took a trip through the vortech, I dialed my lights back quite a bit to accommodate a faster healing period. I don't know if that was the best choice of action, but it's what I did!

 

So I've done a 10 gallon water change on a about 30 gallon total system volume. It took my alkalinity down to 11.2 from the 12.8dKH. I also turned my doser off so I can track consumption over the next few days. Either way, I feel like I'm going to have to monitor this for a while.

 

4 minutes ago, DaJMasta said:

While the water change will get it down faster, I don't know if it's a requirement.  Generally high alkalinity only seems to be really a problem when in conjunction with really low nitrate/phosphate and then people will see 'alkalinity burns' on stony corals.  I think the Red Sea Coral Pro I'm using is supposed to mix to 11dKH, so even at 12.8 dKH you're not so far outside the normal range.

 

A bit worried here, as my nitrate is 0 and my phosphate is .04, so I'd say I might fall in this camp. I use IO salt for this purpose, as I like to maintain a lower alkalinity, but maybe I've been looking at it all wrong. I just added T5's, so I think I'll start ramping them up more and more each day, and start with 2 hours for now.

 

7 minutes ago, DaJMasta said:

While you're probably fine either way, if it crept up in a short amount of time, the water change may be better (corals haven't gotten used to it being high), but if it took a while, it may be better to gradually lower it by just reducing supplementation enough for it slowly fall.

 

Problem here is I stopped being vigilant. I have a record of every day from mid August up until just before the Thanksgiving holiday. I just happened to test today, and presumed I should have been where I left it. 

[jhOU]

The nem incident and reduced lighting almost certainly brought demand wayyy down. I think the answer is as simple as that. Just monitor and correct… but don’t over correct!


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[YHSublime]

The nem incident and reduced lighting almost certainly brought demand wayyy down. I think the answer is as simple as that. Just monitor and correct… but don’t over correct!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I agree, good advice about not over correcting!

[YHSublime]

So in 3 more hours, it'll will have been 48 hours since I did a large water change. 

 

I turned my doser off, 10 gallons changed, and brought it down to 11.2dKH (from it's originally registered 12.8) I also confirmed with another test (far more accurate then mine) that my dKH was 11.8 (so really not too bad all things considered, except for the fact that I try to maintain lower.) 

 

Yesterday (about 24 hours after turning the doser off and water change) I was at 10.2, so 1.6 was the difference, hopefully it wasn't too fast. Today at 1:00pm, it was seemingly .3 higher coming in at 10.5dKH. 

 

What's shocking to me, is that I went from dosing 30ml + of each ESV solution daily, and now I'm back to nada, but maybe when I test in 3 hours I'll see I'm about 1 point of dKH a day. I went to the Reef Chemistry Calculator, and even at 1 point a day, that still puts me at half of what I was dosing prior to this snaffu. The only thing that might be off here is that I don't have a handle on my water volume, which I guess is possible.  

[tpallas]

On 12/6/2021 at 3:11 PM, DaJMasta said:

Sounds like less light is meaning less photosynthesis and growth, which is depleting the alkalinity from the water slower and causing the number to rise with a fixed dose.  I'd just back off the amount and tune it back up when either the corals settle into the new lighting or when it comes back up and their growth speeds up.

 

This is the answer....light and nutrients affect the growth and hence alk consumption considerably. 

Edited December 11, 2021 by tpallas

[YHSublime]

 
This is the answer....light and nutrients affect the growth and hence alk consumption considerably. 

Right. I turned my lights back up to to tire prior intensity. I turned off dosers, waited 3 days. 1.3dKH consumed a day. I’ve upped back to 15ml of each solution a day, will adjust from there.

[YHSublime]

I cut my lights back onto what they were at before, and turned the dosers off for 3 days. Last night at the 72 hour mark I started dosing 15ml of each solution when my alkalinty was at 9dKH. Tonight, at the 96 hour mark, I upped it to 25ml of each solution, as I had dropped a half point down to 8.5dKH tonight. 

 

I'm going to continue monitoring alk daily, but I'm sure I'm back on track, as long as I don't get any lower. I also think I'm going to try and keep my alkalinity a little bit higher now, around 9, I've always aimed to keep it around 8-8.5. I expect the higher levels will kick in coral growth, my LPS like torches and hammers and montis just explode with growth, but my sticks/acros always seem stunted, sans a few special cases. 

[nburg]

I've had spikes when I ignored routine maintenance from a stalactite forming on the dosing tube and then falling off and dissolving into the tank. For my tank, it wasn't a huge increase, but on a smaller tank it could have an impact. 

[YHSublime]

6 minutes ago, nburg said:

I've had spikes when I ignored routine maintenance from a stalactite forming on the dosing tube and then falling off and dissolving into the tank. For my tank, it wasn't a huge increase, but on a smaller tank it could have an impact. 

curious. I don’t think that was the case in this instance though. Things are back on track with the lighting schedule corrected again.