Help me understand "tank too clean"

[gmerek2]

I have trouble understand how our tanks are cleaner than the ocean. I see this a lot on forums and need more info on how this is possible since we have a lot more fish per gallon than the ocean.

[YHSublime]

Using dosing methods, like carbon dosing, or GFO, you can strip a tank of some of its vital elements, I would think. It's an far stretch to compare an average 100 gallon hobby tank to the ocean. It would be easier to power wash your driveway vs. a parking garage, even if you did have more in and out traffic in your driveway. Just shooting from the hip here, so no facts, just thoughts.

[sen5241b]

Believe it or not corals need some phosphates to live but they need ppb not ppm. xooxanthelaae is algae and algae needs phosphates to live. I've heard some members on this thread say super low phosphates became a problem. 

[gmerek2]

We are always putting food in tank (dosing phosphates) Fish are always pooping and crop dusting. GFO pumps are slow which should give the phosphates some time to get where needed. There should always be some phosphates present which is why every tank I have seen in the hobby has some sort of algae growing. Pure speculation here also.

[YHSublime]

I think you are also speculating every tank is similar, and that is just not the case. Look at the zeo methods, or the DSR methods, both of which use chemicals in different ways to control and improve water quality. I think the real question is "should our tanks be so clean to display success?" I personally believe mimicking the ocean is best practice, and hair algae is OK! I still think comparing a contained environment to the ocean is apples to oranges.

[elbowdeep88]

I think it's less about trace and macro elements (the ones we measure) and more about disolved organics and microfauna (phyto and the like). On reefs, the food chain starts with the "dust" that makes the water cloudy or discolored at times. We sacrifice that for clarity and to help control the things we can measure-like nitrates.

[paul b]

I think all tanks are to clean.  I myself take mud from the sea a few times a year to throw in my tank.  With the mud I add numerous amphipods.

It is the bacteria I am most interested in because it is the bacteria, not your test kits that keep the water in a state of health.  This is the reason so many people feel mandarins, ruby red dragonettes and pipefish are hard to keep.  There is no natural food chain in their tank.  My reef is stable, if I don't want to feed for a few days it doesn't mean anything and i don't even have to quarantine.  That is because of bacteria and the natural state of the tank and the food I give.  Food with one ingredient such as worm, clam or mysis.  There is also no need to suck out all the detritus as it is an end product of decomposition which provides food for and shelter the tiny organisms.  

Brand new tanks with all new water and rocks are sterile, did you ever see a healthy looking new tank?  Have you ever seen anything spawn in a new tank?   Which tanks have problems with ich or hair algae?  New ones or old ones?   Why do you think that is?

The ocean is far from sterile and so should your tank be.

[sen5241b]

I think it's less about trace and macro elements (the ones we measure) and more about disolved organics and microfauna (phyto and the like). On reefs, the food chain starts with the "dust" that makes the water cloudy or discolored at times. We sacrifice that for clarity and to help control the things we can measure-like nitrates.

 

By "dust" I think you mean marine snow. Tanks with super clean, clear water look great but the filter feeders starve in tanks like that. As for the issue of needing phosphates, they should register zero on your API test tube test. 

Edited May 28, 2015 by sen5241b

[Jason Rhoads]

I agree with all the above, and I also do not worry (too much) about phosphates and nitrates.  I do sporadically test for these, but I do so in order to put them into my spreadsheet for record purposes in the event that anything goes drastically wrong.

 

My corals always exhibit increased polyp extension after I stir up my sand bed or blow off the rocks, and, to me, that indicates that they are getting some form of nutrition from the detritus. 

 

Plus, I use tap water for WCs :0

[AlanM]

I also feel that my tank is looking better now that I am doing less nutrient export.  My chaeto used to grow like crazy, but it almost seemed like it eventually used up whatever source of phosphate it was drawing from because it paused two months ago and started fading.  Same with turf scrubber.  It just stopped picking up algae.  I measured and got 0 nitrate and a 0 on the Hanna ULR phosphate, so now I only do one water change per week instead of small ones each day and just run the grow lights in the algae growers at night.  Tank liiks better now.