Looks like somebody copies BubbleKing

[steveoutlaw]

http://www.reefgeek.com/filtration/protein-skimmers/reef-octopus-protein-skimmers/reef-octopus-classic-series/nwb110sss-classic-space-saver-in-sump-protein-skimmer.html

[johnnybv]

May look the same but does not perform the same!

[John Ford]

Not a bad price. I've often considered ditching my ev180 for a pinwheel style skimmer. With the downdraft I think I lose my foam head for awhile longer than I'd like after feeding

[zygote2k]

half of the skimmers on the market are copies of each other. skimmer bodies are pretty much the same, so it boils down to whomever has the better pump.

six of one, half dozen of the other.

Ford or Chevy.

[John Ford]

Always go with Ford. I drive a VW...

[GraffitiSpotCorals]

May look the same but does not perform the same!

How do you know that? Did you buy one and run it side by side?

 

Reef octopus are our favorite skimmers and we have used a number of them, bubble king are great too but so expensive I could never afford one. Then if something broke, could never afford to fix it! I have seen lots of bubble kings in action on friends tanks and such, I don't see any difference in performance compared to the best comparable reef octopus skimmers.

I have not used one with this type of pump so I can't comment on this skimmer (I won't do that if I haven't used or watched one someone owns actually preform).

 

I agree with rob, the pump is where it's at. If you clean and maintain a reef octopus pump it should last just as well as a bubble kings pump. Cleaning all pumps should be done more than most actually do it.

 

Just because you spend a ton of money on a nice pump doesn't mean they are the best. The ehiem pumps are awesome but the needle wheel section is so freaking thin, I wouldn't use one.

 

I am not a fan of these space saver type skimmers, I like the ones that give you the most contact time and have the wider body.

[gmerek2]

Get rid of that aqua c you are totally right. I had one it was junk. Lost head all the time sometimes with no reason behind it. Probably user error. My reef octopus is a lot more user friendly

[johnnybv]

How do you know that? Did you buy one and run it side by side?

 

Reef octopus are our favorite skimmers and we have used a number of them, bubble king are great too but so expensive I could never afford one. Then if something broke, could never afford to fix it! I have seen lots of bubble kings in action on friends tanks and such, I don't see any difference in performance compared to the best comparable reef octopus skimmers.

I have not used one with this type of pump so I can't comment on this skimmer (I won't do that if I haven't used or watched one someone owns actually preform).

 

I agree with rob, the pump is where it's at. If you clean and maintain a reef octopus pump it should last just as well as a bubble kings pump. Cleaning all pumps should be done more than most actually do it.

 

Just because you spend a ton of money on a nice pump doesn't mean they are the best. The ehiem pumps are awesome but the needle wheel section is so freaking thin, I wouldn't use one.

 

I am not a fan of these space saver type skimmers, I like the ones that give you the most contact time and have the wider body.

 

Never said anything about cost, and yes I have both bubble king and octopus running and the bubble king outperforms it handily.  Not saying there is anything wrong with Octopus I use and sell them too, but this thread was opened saying that the octopus looks just like the Bubble King, and it does......it does not perform like it and I will stand by that comment.  There have been many discussions about how do you tell if one skimmer outperforms another, and there are very few ways, and like everything else in this hobby everyone has their own opinion.  In this case I look at the LPM air intake on the bubble king using the Red dragon Pump vs the Chinese counterpart on the Octopus, compare the energy consumption between the two, and finally the opinion part, look at the foam and the production.  The Bubble king looks like shaving cream, even better than the Deltecs.  Is it enough to justify the cost difference?  Well that is up to you.

[GraffitiSpotCorals]

Well put! That pump on the bubble king knock off I have not used on any of our reef octopus skimmers. Air intake to me as long as its up to par for the skimmer size and body doesn't matter if the price difference is that much.

[steveoutlaw]

I like starting arguments.

[gmerek2]

I like starting arguments.

lol me too work gets boring without wamas

[GraffitiSpotCorals]

Good information and learning comes from "arguing" sometimes

I was not aware John runs any reef octopus skimmers though. Especially this model, which would be needed to make that kind of statement in my opinion. Even if they are on different systems its not really comparing the two skimmers.

[rioreef]

half of the skimmers on the market are copies of each other. skimmer bodies are pretty much the same, so it boils down to whomever has the better pump.

 

 

So what are opinions out there on what the best lineup of pumps are?

[ErikS]

I like starting arguments.

Then you need to update the signature

 

Mr. Outlaw

Professional &*^% Disturber

 

Though if we're having a contest I'm throwing my name into the ring

[ridetheducati]

So what are opinions out there on what the best lineup of pumps are?

 

I think you missed the point.  The pump capabilities, such as LPH and water flow, must match/fit the characteristics of the skimmer body.

 

For example, a Sicce PSK2500 (1100LPH/600gph) performs very well on an eight inch skimmer body four inch neck.  Put that same pump on a four or 10 inch body and that skimmer will not perform very well.  There are other factors that should be considered as well, but I do not what to totally derail the thread.

 

When I evaluate skimmers I look at the following in this order:

1.  LPH

2. GPH

3. Wattage

4. Skimmer body size

5. Neck diameter

6. Skimmer height

7. Pump reliability/parts availability

8. Cost

 

With this information, I can adequately determine whether the skimmer is going to perform on a certain system.  

 

Rephase the question, what pump perform well on a 6, 8, 10, or 12 inch body.

[ridetheducati]

I must clarify my post above with a little information about my personality.  I am technical minded and demand performance, when possible I take advantage of opportunities to improve on performance.  Some people like plug and play, I would rather improve, plug, and play. 

[Origami]

Nice list, Tony.

[ctenophore]

I think you missed the point.  The pump capabilities, such as LPH and water flow, must match/fit the characteristics of the skimmer body.

 

For example, a Sicce PSK2500 (1100LPH/600gph) performs very well on an eight inch skimmer body four inch neck.  Put that same pump on a four or 10 inch body and that skimmer will not perform very well.  There are other factors that should be considered as well, but I do not what to totally derail the thread.

 

When I evaluate skimmers I look at the following in this order:

1.  LPH

2. GPH

3. Wattage

4. Skimmer body size

5. Neck diameter

6. Skimmer height

7. Pump reliability/parts availability

8. Cost

 

With this information, I can adequately determine whether the skimmer is going to perform on a certain system.  

 

Rephase the question, what pump perform well on a 6, 8, 10, or 12 inch body.

1100lph If you can get the 2500 to start up in the correct direction  The PSK1000 is a much better pump in the same class.

 

Since this is an arguing thread, I think that height and neck are way more important than body size.  The first influences air draw dramatically.  No standard pinwheel pump made will work on a 6" x 48" body.  But it will work well on a 10"x10" body.  Neck needs to be sized to air draw.  3.5" to 3.75" is best for 1100lph IME.  Then body size, which determines contact time.  You want 2 minutes ideally.  Very few skimmers are large enough for the flow rates most folks push through their skimmers.  That's why recirculating designs are useful.  A 2 gallon skimmer should have 1gpm through it, or 60gph.

 

We tested all the Waveline-spawn pumps and found that they use more watts per lph than AC pumps.  The Sicces are reliable, easy to find, fairly inexpensive, and perform well enough.  Anything beyond that is diminishing returns. You could spend those extra dollars in more effective ways to improve water quality.

 

IMO, dollars per gram per day of skimmate removed is the best way to evaluate skimmers.  Real world efficiency has to account for monetary cost.  If the expensive german pump can pull 200 extra lph at 5 less watts, but takes 3 months to repair, your skimmer performance over time should reflect that.