sachabballi reef August 5, 2013 Share August 5, 2013 On my 180 I have 2 returns that use separate pumps for each and then I have 2 tunze 6105 as well. I vary the speeds but never max it out as it us a tremendous amount of flow and will kick up my large coarse sand so I assume your sugar sand could be part of the problem with the amount if flow if you have them on high Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
collettk August 5, 2013 Author Share August 5, 2013 True..but what alot of us do is pump about 5-10x turnover and have powerheads to help circulate water inside the tank...sometimes the return pumps can blast in only a few spots...not a huge problem...if you have multiple return lines coming in but if its only one or 2 your not getting great circulation.... I have two return lines and two Tunzes 6105 Powerheads hooked up to RKE APC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
collettk August 5, 2013 Author Share August 5, 2013 On my 180 I have 2 returns that use separate pumps for each and then I have 2 tunze 6105 as well. I vary the speeds but never max it out as it us a tremendous amount of flow and will kick up my large coarse sand so I assume your sugar sand could be part of the problem with the amount if flow if you have them on high Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2 You must have been replying the same time as me...I set my tunzes on a 40% min 80% max sequential setup on a 5 second bursts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Hind August 5, 2013 Share August 5, 2013 Flow will help to keep the particles in suspension so the filtersocks and skimmer can remove them. I would leave the flow alone, just my view on it. I would add the flocculant, skim wet, rinse out the filter socks when needed, and just sit back and let it clear out with time. Us this time to plan out the rest of the tank as far as stocking goes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami August 5, 2013 Share August 5, 2013 A flocculant is a great idea. It should really help bind the particles and clear up the water faster when used with a filter sock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Integral9 August 5, 2013 Share August 5, 2013 When you add water to salt, the mix goes through a period of supersaturation, which causes insoluble precipitates (calcium chloride and magnesium hydroxide) to form. This is probably what you're seeing. Always add salt to water, not water to salt. Tom is correct. The reaction got effed up when it didn't have enough h2o to complete. The chemistry is all effed up. I'd personally start over with the water. Also, unless someone else has resolved this situation before with a flocculant, I'd be concerned about it pulling other ions out of the water as well. Has anyone used a flocculant before? also, fwiw: My tank turns over about 30x per hour. 2 x 1400 gph power heads and a 1080gph return pump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
collettk August 5, 2013 Author Share August 5, 2013 Tom is correct. The reaction got effed up when it didn't have enough h2o to complete. The chemistry is all effed up. I'd personally start over with the water. Also, unless someone else has resolved this situation before with a flocculant, I'd be concerned about it pulling other ions out of the water as well. Has anyone used a flocculant before? also, fwiw: My tank turns over about 30x per hour. 2 x 1400 gph power heads and a 1080gph return pump. I can't really start over with the water...I already have livestock. Maybe try doing a 20% water change everyday for a week? I did look up Dr. Tim's Clear up. The one review I found wasn't very hopeful "/9/2013 By: Archie Scarlette from LasVegas. I put 3 of the 4 ounces of the product in my 150 Gal tank. Within 5 hours I had a clear tank. The next morning the tank was cloudy again. I added the remaining ounce from the bottle.. The tank remained cloudy for the rest of day two. The morning of day three the tank was clear again, but slowly clouded up during the day. Each night the tank clears but slowly goes back to the murky as if I had spilled milk in it during the day. Very confusing. I have to assume the product is working and that I have an issue caused by something else. Cleaning filtration etc. does not seem to have any impact upon the problem." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
collettk August 5, 2013 Author Share August 5, 2013 My tank turns over about 30x per hour. 2 x 1400 gph power heads and a 1080gph return pump. Are you suppose to count your powerheads as part of turn over? I never factored that in since It's not actually pushing water back into the sump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Hind August 5, 2013 Share August 5, 2013 Dr' Tim's is not what i consider a true flocculant but a bacteria binder. Look into the other products I listed on page one of this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
collettk August 5, 2013 Author Share August 5, 2013 I just wanted to thank everyone for your help...you gave me a lot to chew on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Hind August 5, 2013 Share August 5, 2013 You're welcome, that's what this club is all about, sharing experiences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Integral9 August 5, 2013 Share August 5, 2013 You can do up to a 50% water change w/out adverse effects. Although I have not done many of those, only in the most dire of situations would I do one and I would probably not do one every day. imo, I think you need to give the bacteria a chance to recolonize the new water, so maybe wait a day or two between changes. If you did 5 of those 50% water changes, you would still end up with about 5% of the original water left over. Which may not be all that bad. At 20% at a time, you would need a lot more water changes to get the original concentration down to what only few 50% changes would do. When dealing with big tanks, the question is normally, how much water can you make. If you cannot make that much water, and there is a LFS nearby, you may want to talk to them about helping you out with the water changes. Many LFS have a service side and they haul water around for those service calls often. Yes you should include power heads in the turnover calculation IF (and ONLY IF) they are IN the display. if they in the sump, they do not count because they are powering things like media reactors or skimmers, not contributing to the overall flow of the display tank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
collettk August 6, 2013 Author Share August 6, 2013 Yes you should include power heads in the turnover calculation IF (and ONLY IF) they are IN the display. if they in the sump, they do not count because they are powering things like media reactors or skimmers, not contributing to the overall flow of the display tank. I'm not sure what my water flow is then...since my return pump is rated at 1450 and then I have my two Tunzes running at 80%. Maybe I should dial down my return pump? I'm thinking this cloudiness is either a batcteria bloom or substrate being kicked up from my refugium...any amount of sifting I do with my hand in the refugium causes the substrate to kick up and go into my return. Epilogue: Came home today and found one of my five tiny Bartlett Anthias missing. Ended up finding it in the built in overflow. What a pain. I ended up having to disassemble the bulkhead at the bottom just to get him out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Hind August 6, 2013 Share August 6, 2013 Why do you sift the substrate in the refugium? I've always just left mine alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
collettk August 6, 2013 Author Share August 6, 2013 Why do you sift the substrate in the refugium? I've always just left mine alone. no I don't usually...This was when I had to move things around in there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Hind August 6, 2013 Share August 6, 2013 I think your reator would last longer, stay cleaner, if the feed pump was located where the return pump is at in the last chamber. The filter before that chamber would help clean that water so debris or organics don't clog the media. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lnevo August 6, 2013 Share August 6, 2013 Sorry for your loss. I'm afraid it won't be the last. You could do a 50-75% water change without affecting your livestock. Just make sure parameters (temp,ph and salinity are good) and swap it out. How long has this tank been running? How long did you cycle it? Did you add any bacteria? Are you using RO/DI? Sorry if some of these were answered, I rescanned the thread and didn't see. Sand should be settled by now or filtered by your sock, which I'd be changing daily. I'd also change the carbon at least 1x a week if the tank is still cloudy, And finally a 50% water change minimum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
collettk August 6, 2013 Author Share August 6, 2013 Sorry for your loss. I'm afraid it won't be the last. You could do a 50-75% water change without affecting your livestock. Just make sure parameters (temp,ph and salinity are good) and swap it out. How long has this tank been running? How long did you cycle it? Did you add any bacteria? Are you using RO/DI? Nothing died yet (knock on wood). I used cured live rock. Waited almost a month just to be on cautious. All parameters are good so far. Sorry if some of these were answered, I rescanned the thread and didn't see. Sand should be settled by now or filtered by your sock, which I'd be changing daily. I'd also change the carbon at least 1x a week if the tank is still cloudy, And finally a 50% water change minimum. Tank has been up six weeks. 50% water change isn't really an option...I have nothing to mix 90g of RO and salt with...max is 50g Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lnevo August 6, 2013 Share August 6, 2013 Go ahead and do 50 then another 50 as soon as you can. You should consider investing in another brute or some rubbermaid containers for the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheyCallMeMr.703 August 7, 2013 Share August 7, 2013 You should consider investing in another brute or some rubbermaid containers for the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zygote2k August 8, 2013 Share August 8, 2013 patience young grasshopper. the cloud will lift as if by magic and your fish will once again be visible. do nothing but watch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
collettk August 8, 2013 Author Share August 8, 2013 Just installed a UV sterilizer...hopefully this should help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Hind August 8, 2013 Share August 8, 2013 If it is bacteria the UV will help but if it is just particulates from substrate or calcium precipitation it will not change anything. Did you try the flocculant? patience young grasshopper. the cloud will lift as if by magic and your fish will once again be visible. do nothing but watch. I agree! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
collettk August 8, 2013 Author Share August 8, 2013 I'm trying to avoid adding additional chemicals to the water at this point. I did buy some crushed coral I plan to add to the sump to anchor down the loose substrate I have in there. I'll probably add it tonight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Hind August 8, 2013 Share August 8, 2013 Just rince it really well. From my experience, the CC will eventually settle in and the finer material will end up on top. Again, that was my result from trying that, hopefully it works better for you. Here is a recent thread from another member's cloudy tank experience. Maybe it has some info for you. http://wamas.org/forums/topic/54435-tank-is-still-cloudy/page-6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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