Cliff Puckstable June 27, 2012 June 27, 2012 Anyone? I want to remove my gfo/carbon reactor and just replace it with small bio pellets reactor. I know they do different things, but I only have room for one or the other in my tiny sump. Your thoughts?
Origami June 27, 2012 June 27, 2012 I think that I'd remove my biopellets before I removed my carbon.
icecool2 June 27, 2012 June 27, 2012 I try and run my tank as low maintenance as possible. I have nothing against running skimmers, GFO, carbon, calcium reactors, etc. I think they all have their place. For me, I would rather have the tank balanced naturally since it is more self-sustaining and doesn't require as much input on my end. I'm trying to stick to how Julian Sprung runs his tanks. No skimmer, etc. Just natural filtration and he has amazing results.
yauger June 27, 2012 June 27, 2012 I don't run carbon or bio pellets, but then again I don't have fish! only corals broski!
Cliff Puckstable June 27, 2012 Author June 27, 2012 No skimmer, eh? interesting... I'm assuming you do frequent water changes?
Origami June 27, 2012 June 27, 2012 Let me say why it's that way for me. Others have their choice. Dissolved organic carbons (DOCs) in our system come from the breakdown of organic waste through a process of nitrification and denitrification. The first breaks these complex molecules down into ammonia, the second takes that ammonia and, ultimately, changes it to nitrogen gas. Skimmers help to pull some of these DOCs out, biofiltration breaks down a bunch of it, but some just don't come out easily by either mechanism. This can lead to a yellowing of the water by "gelbstof" (yellow stuff in German, I think). GAC (granular activated carbon) helps to remove a lot of gelbstof by adsorbption. Biopellets increase bacteria, but if that bacteria's not breaking down the components of gelbstof, it's ignoring part of what I want to remove. That's why, for me, I'd remove my biopellets before I'd remove my carbon.
icecool2 June 27, 2012 June 27, 2012 Origami, I am very impressed by your knowledge. Really great posts all the time! There is some debate about skimmers possibly removing some of the good things too, although I admittedly have not read enough to speak about it. I have a larger derasa clam and a quickly growing crocea that handle a lot of the nutrient export in the tank. I also have a healthy sandbed with adequate sand stirrers to keep it oxygenated. I do small ~5g water changes every other week on my 75g tank and I've been able to keep my nutrients at an undetectable level since my initial cycle when the tank was stood up. I am actually now looking into starting up an upflow algae turfscrubber to replace my skimmer which I run a few days a week.
yauger June 27, 2012 June 27, 2012 Origami, I am very impressed by your knowledge. Really great posts all the time! bah I taught him everything he knows! he's right though, however I have only seen "yellow water" with a heavy bio load or someone feeding way too much. you should go fish-less like me and enjoy the movements of the corals instead!
yauger June 27, 2012 June 27, 2012 LOL, I like your style, yauger. thanks bro, I only did that cause my workload increased tremendously at work so in order for me to reduce my total hours spent on my tank I removed the fish. since then I kind of got used to the idea and the look. no skimming, water change every 2 weeks and great coral growth. easy.
Origami June 27, 2012 June 27, 2012 Thanks, Icecool. BTW, I like algal turf scrubbers. I think they're an excellent way to both export nutrients naturally and as a side benefit, can help feed your tank (because you'll find the pod population increasing) if you're able to let gravity flow water from the ATS back into the tank. Zygote2k has run a skimmerless system very successfully for years, and PaulB has a neat ATS that he's got installed on the back lip of his tank. Skimmers remove more than DOCs, that's true. They also export salts and heavy metals. Some of the loss is good stuff, but some bad. The overall effect is positive, I believe. An analysis of skimmate was done a while back at Penn State, home to Sanjay Joshi and Ken Feldman. Here's an article: http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2010/2/aafeature/ Here are the conclusions of that one study: The chemical/elemental composition of skimmate generated by an H&S 200-1260 skimmer on a 175-gallon reef tank over the course of several days or a week had some surprises. Only a minor amount of the skimmate (solid + liquid) could be attributed to organic carbon (TOC); about 29%, and most of that material was not water soluble, i.e., was not dissolved organic carbon. The majority of the recovered skimmate solid, apart from the commons ions of seawater, was CaCO3, MgCO3, and SiO2 - inorganic compounds! The origin of these species is not known with certainity, but a good case can be made that the SiO2 stems from the shells of diatoms. The CaCO3 might be derived from other planktonic microbes bearing calcium carbonate shells, or might come from calcium reactor effluent. To the extent that the solid skimmate consists of microflora, then some proportion of the insoluble organic material removed by skimming would then simply be the organic components (the "guts") of these microflora. These microflora do concentrate P, N, and C nutrients from the water column, and so their removal via skimming does constitute a means of nutrient export. The way I read this is 29% of skimmate is DOC, then you have salt exports, and exports via microflora ( which can be thought of non-dissolved organics carbons). Microflora exports would be increased, I would guess, by using biopellets. So, while I'd choose my GAC over biopellets, if I could use both, I would.
Origami June 27, 2012 June 27, 2012 thanks bro, I only did that cause my workload increased tremendously at work so in order for me to reduce my total hours spent on my tank I removed the fish. since then I kind of got used to the idea and the look. no skimming, water change every 2 weeks and great coral growth. easy. Ha. What Josh didn't say is that he got away from the hobby, got a dog, and then found that he just HAD to get back in the hobby again!
hlem June 27, 2012 June 27, 2012 I dont run anything. No carbon, GFO, pellets, nothing. My only reactor is a KALK reactor.
Packman@90 June 27, 2012 June 27, 2012 I do not run anything as well, not even a skimmer. I run an ATS and do limited water changes (one or two a year) and have had success (so far). I love my ATS and will put one on any tank that i upgrade too.
yauger June 27, 2012 June 27, 2012 Ha. What Josh didn't say is that he got away from the hobby, got a dog, and then found that he just HAD to get back in the hobby again! yes but my dog is awesome! but in reality he eats too much, sleeps way too much and farts right next to you... I couldn't be gone forever sir! I always kept an eye on the prize... BTW you have to see my system, very clean and great colors.
Cliff Puckstable June 27, 2012 Author June 27, 2012 Would you happen to have a picture of your ATS setup, and would like to share?
Origami June 27, 2012 June 27, 2012 Would you happen to have a picture of your ATS setup, and would like to share? Here are some pictures in this thread. http://www.wamas.org/forums/topic/32232-interested-in-turf-scrubbers/
rocko918 June 27, 2012 June 27, 2012 (edited) you have in the past... ech? i tried fosban for a little, saw no difference. Use carbon when i frag a lot. I have never run anything full time. Edited June 27, 2012 by rocko918
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