clearsky57 January 7, 2012 Share January 7, 2012 Hi there: I am on a very brief business trip down here in Daytona Beach, and as I got into town early today, I had the opportunity to visit 4 LFS's down here... one a freshwater cichlid place, which happened to have a very good variety of aftricans, but, the prices were no better than home. But,,,, I did get to three stores predominantly marine, so I was in the preverbial "candy store" for me anyhow.... I am planning on bringing back a few things and when I get back, I will take pics and show and tell them to all.... While I was perousing one of the stores, the owner was telling me about LED's and wondered if I was going to go that way..... He showed me a brand EcoRay 60D (dimensions 14 x 8 x ?) but he told me that two of them would be more than I have with my double 175's metal haylide. in fact He really touted them.... his price was $269. (of course I would have to get two) Now can all you LED pros tell me 1: whether this is a decent brand, and 2: if in fact they would be better than the metal haylides.... I know they will be less to operate and bulbs last a heck of a lot longer... my concern is whether this size light configuration is enough for a 75???? The price sounds good.... they have two cords, one for the blues and one for the whites.... apparently according to the owner, they have better lens' than the originals, which tended to be aimed straight down pillar like,, where these new ones are widened.... Please help out here as If I can save on shipping and the price is in fact good.... (I will go on line to see what I can find out), but my main concern is whether they can run a successful reef tank.... I come home monday so I can visit two of the stores to pick out a few new additions to my tank... thanks david Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvreef January 7, 2012 Share January 7, 2012 I am not sure of the brand of led is good or bad... but i do know that I have read alot about the leds and almost everything I have read is great....just make sure to acclimate your tank to the leds as they are alot more light than your mh will be... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clearsky57 January 7, 2012 Author Share January 7, 2012 wv: in fact the gentleman suggested, starting the blues about an hour before the whites come on , and only running them about 6-8 hours at first, then stage them where the whites cut off an hour before the blues at the end as well... d Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zygote2k January 7, 2012 Share January 7, 2012 They are 1w LED's. In this category there a few to choose from- Ecoxotic 12w and 19w strips come to mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mando77 January 7, 2012 Share January 7, 2012 I would look at the actuall lights and drivers and research. If the light is a CREE than they are good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mando77 January 7, 2012 Share January 7, 2012 Also the actual wattage of the LED should atleast be 3 watts each. 1 watt doesn't do much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taiscici January 7, 2012 Share January 7, 2012 I would built your own with cre xm-l. They are not that hard and cost less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clearsky57 January 7, 2012 Author Share January 7, 2012 Thanks folks.... this just confirmed my concerns that it isn't as easy as just finding the cheapsest unit and there you go... I don't understand all the acronyms (CREE) and such so I will just live with my haylides and such until I know more about the leds.... I know many people are making their own, and , i think I should learn some more about them.... maybe once i see enough units, whether home made or purchased, I can figure out what is going to be best for me.... thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zygote2k January 7, 2012 Share January 7, 2012 I would look at the actuall lights and drivers and research. If the light is a CREE than they are good. there are other good brands beside Cree. Also the actual wattage of the LED should atleast be 3 watts each. 1 watt doesn't do much. 1 watt is good for some applications. 3w are good for others. 50w and 100w are good too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clearsky57 January 7, 2012 Author Share January 7, 2012 by the way Andy, don't the 3 watt leds have to be dialed down?? if they are used at full wattage won't they create too much algaes??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave w January 7, 2012 Share January 7, 2012 I think algae growth is a function of high nutrients rather than good light. The extra light just brings into the open what had been hidden. I'd guess that total watts or lumens would be the worry, not whether any individual LED was one watt or 50 watts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Hind January 7, 2012 Share January 7, 2012 I don't understand all the acronyms (CREE) and such so I will just live with my haylides and such until I know more about the leds.... Cree is just a maker of LED's and they have been doing it for like 20 years. Like Zygote2K mentioned there others that make just as good a product. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zygote2k January 7, 2012 Share January 7, 2012 by the way Andy, don't the 3 watt leds have to be dialed down?? if they are used at full wattage won't they create too much algaes??? Are your halides dialed down? They are at least 175w- much more than many 3w led's... don't let the intensity of LED scare you. dimming is not required- we've gotten along without dimming with T5's and halides for nearly 40 years just fine. Having LEDs also gives you new ideas on how to light your tank- full lighting or spotlighting depending on how you arrange your rock. for a 75 you could do any of the following and grow just about any coral you want- $400-700 range 2 Ecorays 6 Panorama 12w strips 5 Panorama 19w strips 50w Photon cannon 100w Photon cannon 1 AI fixture 1 Radeon fixture DIY 36x3w fixture 6 Par38 bulbs on track light is light. provide enough of it in a reasonable replication of sunlight and corals will grow. more light will allow you to penetrate deeper tanks, illuminate larger areas, and grow specialized things. pick the light you want then build the reef around it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jan January 7, 2012 Share January 7, 2012 I have a few questions about LED's 1-How do you know when to change the bulb? 2-What percentage of light are you losing per year? 3-Do the lights dim when they are spent? 4-What affect will spent lights have on our set ups? 5-In how many years will an LED user have to consider changing the LED'S beforethe diminished light is detrimental to the corals?Would this be 50% or more before the total 50,000 hours of light usage? I ask this question in particular as I look at the LED moonlights in my lights. They're very dim. They need to be replaced. I only have a few but it's not going to be easy. 6-How easy is it to change LED bulbs in these new set up? Has anyone tried it yet? 7-What will it cost to replace each LED bulb or do we just get another fixture? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RubberFrog January 8, 2012 Share January 8, 2012 The answer to all of that is "no". LEDs do not dim or lose intensity with time. There is always the possibility that a single led could fail, but it is unlikely. The less themselves will most likely outlast your interest in the fixture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bankyf January 8, 2012 Share January 8, 2012 The answer to all of that is "no". LEDs do not dim or lose intensity with time. There is always the possibility that a single led could fail, but it is unlikely. The less themselves will most likely outlast your interest in the fixture. The answer to that is "yes". LED's do lose intensity with time, however you would likely be looking at 5-10 years to drop down to 70% intensity depending on use. I have several panorama strips with one or two leds out, so the likelihood of failure is there. My LED experience in another industry is that quality leds are FAR less likely to suffer these failures. Some of the cheap Chinese LEDs are lucky to make it 2-3 years without failing. It is probably true that you will be ready to update your fixture to the latest and greatest before either of these are a significant concern as long as you buy a quality fixture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RubberFrog January 9, 2012 Share January 9, 2012 ^ That was kind of my point. How many people have the same fixture ten years out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RubberFrog January 9, 2012 Share January 9, 2012 ^ That was kind of my point. How many people have the same fixture ten years out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trockafella January 9, 2012 Share January 9, 2012 ^ That was kind of my point. How many people have the same fixture ten years out? And that point kinda defeats the point of LEDs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest thefishman65 January 9, 2012 Share January 9, 2012 I had the same T12 fixture for about 14 (maybe longer) years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zygote2k January 10, 2012 Share January 10, 2012 And that point kinda defeats the point of LEDs. I'm going on 3 years with Par38's and haven't noticed any failures yet. In this time frame I would have replaced 6) 250w HQI's and 12) T5's. The bulb replacement alone was $600. Electrical consumption was down 75% for this period too. It doesn't take a rocket scientist or a serial killer clown to figure out that there really is a point to getting LED's now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chad January 10, 2012 Share January 10, 2012 I'm still not convinced... Why did ecotech take such a radical departure from other fixtures if things weren't still maturing. I can read the ti leaves enough to see that LEDs are the way things are going, but they certainly are not there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zygote2k January 10, 2012 Share January 10, 2012 LED's are here to stay. color blending and dimming are the frontlines of this industry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trockafella January 10, 2012 Share January 10, 2012 (edited) I'm going on 3 years with Par38's and haven't noticed any failures yet. In this time frame I would have replaced 6) 250w HQI's and 12) T5's. The bulb replacement alone was $600. Electrical consumption was down 75% for this period too. It doesn't take a rocket scientist or a serial killer clown to figure out that there really is a point to getting LED's now. Rob, I wasn't knocking LEDs, I was making the point in regards to the Guy who says they last 10 years before replacement, and then says who actually keeps it that long anyways. One of the so called benefits of LEDs is not having to replace bulbs or fixtures for 10 years, but what's the benefit of them if you're constantly "upgrading ". Edited January 10, 2012 by trockafella Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BowieReefer84 January 10, 2012 Share January 10, 2012 At the end of the day this is a luxury hobby for most people. I am going with the lights I think will grow the best corals with the best colors. Saving a few bucks on electricity is not a major concern of mine. That said, I can understand the savings debate for people with tanks that require 3+ halides (6'+ tanks). I think the heat issue is a better selling point than the electricity savings to be honest, and that is why I put them on my biocube rather than a 150 watt 14k halide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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