electricity in the water

[bcjm]

I was doing some maintenance yesterday and I felt the shock. Now I am afraid to put my hand in for the time been.

Is there a way to use a meter to measure there IS a current in the water? Where do I put my probes? One in the water one in the ground of electricity outlet?

I like to disconnect one equipment at a time and do the measurement before I put my hand in the tank again.

Edited August 10, 2010 by Origami2547
Title expanded to reflect hijacking....

[extreme_tooth_decay]

Is there a way to use a meter to measure there IS a current in the water? Where do I put my probes? One in the water one in the ground of the ground electricity outlet?

 

 

That is what I would try. Try your heater first. especially if it is a stealth.

 

 

I like to disconnect one equipment at a time and do the measurement before I put my hand in the tank again.

 

 

Wise plan.

[Charlie]

Is there a way to use a meter to measure there IS a current in the water?

You could get your wife/girlfriend/children/neighbor to put his hand in the tank.

[Biscuit]

You could get your wife/girlfriend/children/neighbor to put his hand in the tank.

 

hahaha thats so wrong

[treesprite]

Why put innocent people at risk? Some better test subjects would be ex-spouse, task-master boss, and slumlord landlord.

 

Do you have GFCI outlets?

[Origami]

Is there a way to use a meter to measure there IS a current in the water? Where do I put my probes? One in the water one in the ground of electricity outlet?

 

This should work as long as there's not isolation between the two (most likely there isn't). A voltmeter connected in this fashion should be able to detect the voltage if it's coming from the failure of one of your devices (most likely culprits are heaters - glass or otherwise - and power heads). Sometimes, people feel tingling that comes from static charge being developed from the mechanical motion of pumps, too. Finally, some people feel a shock sometimes if their arm brushes against a lighting fixture while there hand is in the water.

[Coral Hind]

Don't panic if you read some minor voltage say under 20 volts. Every piece of equipment in or near the tank will induce some voltage as it operates. As long as there are no amps associated with it you are fine.

 

I recommend a GFCI for heaters and internal pumps. A grounding probe inside the sump is a must to provide a path that has less resistance then you.

 

Finally, some people feel a shock sometimes if their arm brushes against a lighting fixture while there hand is in the water.

 

My T5 fixture did that to me everytime I touched. A simple ground wire added to the reflector fixed that.

Edited August 9, 2010 by Coral Hind

[bcjm]

I think it was the heater I touched but it could be the light fixture too. I will use the volt meter tonight to see if I can detect the voltage.

[Origami]

Keep in mind that you don't always have to be touching a failed component to feel a shock. Many people get their first warning when they feel a tingle upon sticking their hand in the water.

 

However, if getting near the heater was when you received your first warning, that's a very good place to start. A failure in the integrity of the capsule can create a local current that can be felt if you place your hand nearby. In some situations, you can have a catastrophic (almost explosive) failure if enough water works its way into the device and gasses are generated rapidly. It's best to nip this in the bud while you have the chance.

 

What kind of heater is it? Tim likes to mention his bad luck with Stealth heaters. While none of my stealth heaters have ever failed, I've had experience with a glass heater failing. In that instance, I received a shock like I described above. Because of the recent concerns about Stealth reliability over the long haul, my Stealths have been relegated to backup status in my inventory despite their solid performance up to the day of their forced retirement.

[extreme_tooth_decay]

Tim likes to mention his bad luck with Stealth heaters.

 

 

FWIW: Tim has never owned a stealth heater (I've never set myself on fire with napalm either). I has the same (green jager) heater for something like 15 years, then bought another one when I broke it.

 

I do like to mention my dislike for stealth heaters though. Here is a thread about them everyone should read: LINK

Edited August 9, 2010 by extreme_tooth_decay

[Charlie]

Why put innocent people at risk? Some better test subjects would be ex-spouse, task-master boss, and slumlord landlord.

 

Forrest, I'd only use my ex-wife if I were CERTAIN that there was lots of current in my tank.

[Chad]

LOL!!! my sentiments exactly!!!

[bcjm]

hmmm... so many people want to have their ex put their hands in the tank to "test" the current, I better check if my wife sabotages any of the tank equipment.

[Dragon Eye]

Well you can always see how lucky you are..... unplug the heater and stick your hand in. If that's not it move to pumps, skimmer, etc.

 

It's better if you can figure it out than have your stuff supercharged.

[Origami]

FWIW: Tim has never owned a stealth heater (I've never set myself on fire with napalm either). I has the same (green jager) heater for something like 15 years, then bought another one when I broke it.

 

I do like to mention my dislike for stealth heaters though. Here is a thread about them everyone should read: LINK

 

I apologize if I mistook your frequent references to the heaters as having basis in personal experience. No offense was intended. I stand corrected.

[extreme_tooth_decay]

I apologize if I mistook your frequent references to the heaters as having basis in personal experience. No offense was intended. I stand corrected.

 

I'm just funnin ya...but I have never owned one. Why would I You are one of the lucky ones. Buy a lottery ticket while the gettin is good.

 

I am trying to provide a valuable public service by pointing out that there are hugely more references to stealth heaters failing available than jager (way more than can be accounted for by market share IMO).

[Origami]

I had 4 operating for around 10 service years total (an avg of 2.5 years each) without problem, but have admit to going to Ebo Jaeger's in the last few months due to these reports. Now I hold the Stealths in reserve as a backup. (I may be using one in my change water....)

 

Sent from my phone using Tapatalk.

[Coral Hind]

I love the Ebo's too but the older ones were much better then the new ones. Sharkey18 had a stealth explode and it took out the side of her sump.

http://www.wamas.org/forums/topic/36850-complete-sump-failure/page__view__findpost__p__316758

[extreme_tooth_decay]

I love the Ebo's too but the older ones were much better then the new ones. Sharkey18 had a stealth explode and it took out the side of her sump.

http://www.wamas.org/forums/topic/36850-complete-sump-failure/page__view__findpost__p__316758

 

 

They aren't perfect, and never were...but they are clearly way better than stealths. I should make a new "Why I don't like stealths" with all the updated posts such as the one you have referenced...I still can't find ANY similar posts for EJ...but I believe they exist...just in much smaller number. It is like driving a Yugo when a Mercedes is the same price.

[Origami]

They aren't perfect, and never were...but they are clearly way better than stealths. I should make a new "Why I don't like stealths" with all the updated posts such as the one you have referenced...I still can't find ANY similar posts for EJ...but I believe they exist...just in much smaller number. It is like driving a Yugo when a Mercedes is the same price.

 

Tim, you've looked into this some (though maybe this was a while ago). I've just taken a quick look at some links and there's some recent speculation that Stealth failures may be more common in the newer "Stealth Pro" models (now made in China). These models, if I recall, have the indicator light on top showing when the heater is on. My models were all older - no indicator light - having a red temperature adjustment knob on top. Have you seen anything to correlate failures to the newer models?

 

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/equipment/103155-beware-marineland-stealth-pro-heater-3.html

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1834202

 

Each of the above links show a newer model Stealth Pro heater. The ReefCentral thread is interesting and contains a response from Marineland indicating they had problems with some units that came out of China.

 

Looking at Laura's pictures (Sharkey18), hers was a Stealth Pro also (note the clear temperature adjustment knob).

 

(We've really hijacked this thread, it seems.)

[extreme_tooth_decay]

Tim, you've looked into this some (though maybe this was a while ago). I've just taken a quick look at some links and there's some recent speculation that Stealth failures may be more common in the newer "Stealth Pro" models (now made in China). These models, if I recall, have the indicator light on top showing when the heater is on. My models were all older - no indicator light - having a red temperature adjustment knob on top. Have you seen anything to correlate failures to the newer models?

 

Short answer: Too hard to tell, too little data, etc.

 

I just looked over the 7 "stealth failure threads" I linked above (LINK) and those threads are from the Jan 2009-Dec 2009 time frame (about 6-18 months ago). In the newest thread, the complainant (phisigs79) was saying the heater was not 2 years old yet, so it seems those heaters are all probably fairly old.

 

I could not find the word "pro" in any of those threads, but that is just a small sample.

 

I don't know when the new Chinese versions hit the market, but it seems all or most of those threads involve heaters which were manufactured quite a while ago, so I doubt many if any of them were "Pro", but that is just a sampling of threads here and is not very scientific. Good data is hard to come by. If it is true that the newer stealths are worse than the older stealths, I'll need to think of a crummier car than a Yugo to compare them to.

 

The only thing that I am really confident about is that there are hugely more failure stories for stealths than jager. Of course not every one will fail, and some people will have heaters that last forever, etc. Some people have Yugos that last forever, too. I just assert it is wise to buy a product known to have less failures on average, especially when the prices are the same-ish.

 

 

(We've really hijacked this thread, it seems.)

 

Indeed, this thread is supremely jacked. One of those hot button issues, I guess. I actually thought we were done a couple times.

Edited August 10, 2010 by extreme_tooth_decay

[Coral Hind]

bcjm, we haven't heard from you in awhile. You still alive?!

 

 

I like the edited title.

[extreme_tooth_decay]

bcjm, we haven't heard from you in awhile. You still alive?!

 

Yeah, good point. We still don't know if it was even the heater at all. And if it was the heater, what brand it is/was.

[thewire]

Mine stealth heater broke too..luckily I found it out while is off. It has a cracked on the middle of the plastic joint. I am not sure how...I have it for like 3 + years

[extreme_tooth_decay]

Mine stealth heater broke too..luckily I found it out while is off. It has a cracked on the middle of the plastic joint. I am not sure how...I have it for like 3 + years

 

I wonder how many of those 3 years it was sizzling your tank and you didn't realize it...you know it didn't crack between the last time it was on and the time you found it

 

I am not sure how...

 

They are junk.

Edited August 11, 2010 by extreme_tooth_decay