jason the filter freak June 28, 2010 Share June 28, 2010 That is spectacular, I'm so glad to see someone successfully rearing these fish, I'd seen very similar behavior in bala sharks on many many occasions but never knew what it was, seems like a poor way to ensure survival. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truestelf June 29, 2010 Share June 29, 2010 Bangaii baby update: Has anyone ever seen Sudden Fright Syndrome in baby fish? Wow, it's intense!!! I read about it a week ago in an article from Frank Marini. Basically it is a short circuit of the nervous system when a large stimulus is introduced like turning on lights or feeding etc. it is caused by a lack of HUFA's in the diet, and I admit I was not enriching my nauplii. So this morning I added the baby brine shrimp and about half of the baby fish go catatonic..... one right after the other. I was horrified. They were floating on the bottom, stuck in the fake plant, all over the place lying on their sides. I thought I was going to lose the entire clutch. I figured it was SFS. I didn't really know what to do so I just kept them moving. I grabbed the siphon tube I use to collect the brine nauplii and started stirring. Amazingly enough, it worked. Some took longer than others but eventually they all came around. When I left for work some of them still looked a bit wobbly but once I got home they all seemed fine. If I lost any, it's only one or two. It was crazy. They all started feeding and then starting "falling over" on their sides, and sinking to the bottom. So now I am enriching my brine cultures with HUFA and phyto. What a freakin pain. But the babies are 9 days old today and other than whatever brain damage they sustained this morning , they seem to be doing fine. This evenings feeding was uneventful! Laura glad everything is going well :O) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reefhunter June 29, 2010 Share June 29, 2010 VERY cool! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reefhunter June 29, 2010 Share June 29, 2010 SFS reminds me of those goats that pass out when you scare them... hilarious! Awesome pictures Laura! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkey18 July 5, 2010 Author Share July 5, 2010 Here are the little buggers at 2 weeks old. They have approximately doubled in size. There were 27 initially and I count 25 now.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason the filter freak July 6, 2010 Share July 6, 2010 That is absolutely awesome, what are they eating now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkey18 July 6, 2010 Author Share July 6, 2010 They are still eating baby brine shrimp (bbs), enriched with HUFA and phyto. Apparently they will be eating that for a while. Most say they won't wean onto anything else for a while. I keep two cultures going at all times and feed before the bbs are 48 hrs old. i tried frozen cyclopeez but they wouldn't touch it. The next thing I will try is some live brine shrimp or shredded shrimp. Laura PS congrats on your boards! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Hind July 6, 2010 Share July 6, 2010 Cool pictures Laura. Only two loses so far is really good, especially since you were gone for the weekend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hilary July 8, 2010 Share July 8, 2010 Woo hoo - what little cuties! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkey18 July 18, 2010 Author Share July 18, 2010 The baby bangaiis are 28 days old today. The good news is that they are finally starting to eat something other than newly hatched baby brine shrimp! They refuse frozen cyclopeez, frozen rotifers and frozen bbs. BUT they will eat shredded frozen mysis!! WooHoo It's an important step for two reasons. 1) Keeping constant cultures of brine shrimp is a pain and 2) they will get more nutrition and HUFA's so I don't have to worry about sudden fright syndrome and malnutrition. Most information says they aren't ready for sale until they are three or four months old. I am planning on keeping a few but will be selling most of them. It also seems like a lot of losses occur after 4 weeks so hopefully I will not lose many. Current count is between 23 and 27. Priority will go to other people who want to breed and I will try to identify gender as well. It's tough, but I've been working on it! I also will not sell more than 2 or 3 to anyone unless you have more than one tank to house them in. Contrary to common belief, these are NOT good schooling fish (which is why I originally bought 5). They tend to hide in the rock work a lot since they are nocturnal, and 2 males will fight to the death. Lastly, since these fish are all siblings, I am giving some thought to purchasing other captive raised bangaiis so to maintain genetic diversity, although I need to do more research in this area to find out how inbreeding might affect them. Here are some pics! You can see they are developing some spots on their fins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason the filter freak July 18, 2010 Share July 18, 2010 Really really glad to hear they're eating mysis, also its awesome to see that you're putting so much thought into this process, CHEERS! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkey18 August 16, 2010 Author Share August 16, 2010 Good news! My male Bangaii released his second clutch of babies last night! Looks like about 24 tiny little replicas. The first clutch of 27 is still doing great. They are now 56 days old. I moved them into the refugium about a week ago and at that time all 27 were still alive. Its hard to count them now among all the macro. Hopefully they will be ready for sale in another month or two!! I now have so many Bangaiis in house I had to set up ANOTHER tank, just to raise these babies. It's cycling now. I'm not complaining but I live in a very small house and I'm going to have to start choosing between furniture and fish tanks soon. I'll miss that desk. Laura Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt LeBaron August 16, 2010 Share August 16, 2010 Very interesting read, thanks for sharing with us. Have you had any problems with the male dropping the clutch when moving him to a breeding tank once you see that his mouth is full of eggs? I've heard or some people having that problem and I was curious if you had encountered it and how you went about moving the male around. I just ordered a school of Red Spot Cardinal fish and I would like to eventually breed them so since you've had so much success I'm hoping to learn from it. As to in breeding, I don't know about Saltwater fish but I've gone a lot of breeding with freshwater gouramis over the years and I currently have a 4th generation inbred Paradise fish that is fine, ironically he's the most brightly colored one I've ever seen. He keeps doing a mating dance for his mother/aunt so I may get to see what happens after 5 generations. I've gotten to 3rd generation inbreeding with other gourmais without any problems also. Generally I doubt there will be any problems until you get many generations in with inbreeding if even then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Hind August 16, 2010 Share August 16, 2010 Good news all around, the first batch is doing well and now you have second clutch of babies. What are you currently feeding two month olds? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkey18 August 16, 2010 Author Share August 16, 2010 I am feeding the two month olds a mix of frozen foods: Mysis enriched brine, rods, scallops etc. That still remains my biggest concern since not all of the babies eat everything I offer. I am hoping that by offering a variety, each of them will eat at least something..... I stopped giving them baby brine shrimp about 2 weeks ago. For a week or so before that I offered one meal a day of bbs and one of frozen something. After about 2 weeks of that I just stopped the bbs. Of course now I am culturing bbs again so I might throw some in for the older ones just for fun. I use a container, not a net to move the male holding eggs. I leave him alone as much as possible until day 20 and then move him to the 10g breeding tank. He held the first clutch for 26 days and the second for 27. I have a second male who held eggs for about 5 days before they disappeared, and I know thats not uncommon. I am hoping he will start holding longer in the future. I just got lucky with mumbles: he's a champion breeder. As far as genetic diversity: I am still looking into that. I have 5 wild caught Bangaiis and once I get them all in separate tanks I will breed some of the new babies to the non-parental wild caughts and plan on introducing new wild caughts or tank breds into my system in the future. Line breeding might create some nice fish in the beginning without any issues but eventually there will be a problem, usually in a gene that shows no VISIBLE negative phenotype. Since the total population of these fish is quite limited i think genetic diversity is important. Laura Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason the filter freak August 16, 2010 Share August 16, 2010 spectacular thanks for the update, are you planning on trying anyother fish either other kinds of cardinals or other fish at all?lp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Hind August 16, 2010 Share August 16, 2010 That sounds like a good diet. At least in the sump they should be able to eat any pods they find which will help their diet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkey18 August 16, 2010 Author Share August 16, 2010 Thanks Jason, I am not planning on trying anything else. These bangaiis have me way too busy as it is! I still have one of the original wild caughts that I have to catch and remove to a new tank, I need to catch the female and reunite her with mumbles in a new tank and figure out the gender of the two others, not to mention keeping all 53 babies alive. I think I've found my breeding niche and it will be a while before I attempt anything else. I totally just fell into this after buying five bangaiis. These are definitely unplanned pregnancies!!! Laura Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FearTheTerps October 22, 2010 Share October 22, 2010 Haven't had an update in awhile. Just wondering how the little guys are doing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Hind October 22, 2010 Share October 22, 2010 When I saw them last week they were doing great. Two tanks full and I think she was about to setup another tank for them. A dozen or so are ready to find new homes so if you are interested I would PM her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkey18 October 29, 2010 Author Share October 29, 2010 Hey! I have baby Bangaiis coming out my eyes! I currently have two clutches growing up, one is 4 months old and one is 2 months old. The 4 month olds are about the size of a quarter. My star male is also holding another clutch in his mouth. I am ready to see the larger ones so if anyone is interested send me a pm. I'll be around this Sunday from 10am to 2pm. Laura Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkey18 December 15, 2012 Author Share December 15, 2012 WOW! After two years off from cardinal breeding I finally have a male holding eggs! I am super excited, especially because this is a young pair. it is only their second clutch. First clutch was dumped from the stress of moving from one house to the other. That was about 3 weeks ago. Right on schedule he is holding again. Today is day 1, hopefully I will have some baby fish in about 28 days! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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