Aquacultured live rock?

[suru]

I am planning to start a new 34 gallon reef tank, and wonder if anyone here has tried using aquacultured live rock. A quick google shows there are at least a few suppliers in Florida. Is the product good? How does it compare with "wild" live rock from the Pacific? I'd like to use as much aquacultured livestock as possible in my tank.

 

Many thanks!

[CHUBAKAH]

Welcome to WAMAS!

 

Most of our local vendors carry rock in their stores, and would be my first choice.

 

If you list your location, I am sure one of them is close enough to you to help you out.

 

I know of at least one store now bringing in what your talking about, and curing it in their vats.

[dbartco]

Interesting question! Anthony Calfo was talking at our last meeting the the "aquacultured" stuff out of the pacific was actually costlier to the reefs than the small percentage we were taking out of the reefs themselves. (because of the manufacturing of it and the regulations on live rock, and NO regulations on "aquacultured liverock". )

 

I'm not sure about the process in the atlantic though.

[suru]

Thanks!

 

I am located in DC, so can make it out to a lot of the Virginia or Maryland vendors. I haven't seen aquacultured rock at the few I've been too, but will double check, and certainly appreciate you pointing me in the right direction if you can.

 

Thanks!

 

Welcome to WAMAS!

 

Most of our local vendors carry rock in their stores, and would be my first choice.

 

If you list your location, I am sure one of them is close enough to you to help you out.

 

I know of at least one store now bringing in what your talking about, and curing it in their vats.

[Brian Ward]

I believe this is the stuff that Anthony Calfo spoke about at our last meeting. It's not really aquacultured rock, they treat the rock in such a way as to get around the export restrictions. Use of live rock from the ocean for our tanks is negligible and sustainable according to Anthony. However, if you want to avoid using product from the ocean, consider making your own rock using cement and crushed coral. There's a thread around here somewhere on how to do it.

[suru]

Interesting - I hadn't thought about that aspect of it... Nothing is ever cut and dried, it seems. Thanks, and I certainly appreciate any other feedback people have.

 

 

 

Interesting question! Anthony Calfo was talking at our last meeting the the "aquacultured" stuff out of the pacific was actually costlier to the reefs than the small percentage we were taking out of the reefs themselves. (because of the manufacturing of it and the regulations on live rock, and NO regulations on "aquacultured liverock". )

 

I'm not sure about the process in the atlantic though.

[Brian Ward]

The basic premise is that live rock is considered stony coral and is subject to the export restrictions (counts against the pounds of coral that can be exported/imported). But "aquacultured" rock isn't subject to the export restrictions and so it is harvested in much larger quantities. According to Calfo, the cement industry actually contributes more to the destruction of the reefs than harvesting live rock for tanks.

[dbartco]

Yeah, what brian said (just much more elequently...)

 

So a sticky wicket, and sure I don't know..

[extreme_tooth_decay]

I am planning to start a new 34 gallon reef tank, and wonder if anyone here has tried using aquacultured live rock. A quick google shows there are at least a few suppliers in Florida. Is the product good? How does it compare with "wild" live rock from the Pacific? I'd like to use as much aquacultured livestock as possible in my tank.

 

Many thanks!

 

 

I think The Aquarium Center in Randallstown has Florida aquacultured LR. At least I bought some there once and that's what they told me. Bonus was it had mushroom hitchikers I've never seen before (that's why I bought it). They have since reorganized, I'm not sure what they stock now.

 

It was just as "good" as any other LR.

 

tim

[mogurnda]

I have heard and read Anthony's opinions about this, and I have never seen him provide numbers or data. Did he provide information to back up his claims? Rock from TBS and Gulf View is actually dry rock that is placed on the bottom of the Gulf for several years to become colonized by the relevant organisms. It is as good a biological filter as the stuff from the Pacific, and if properly shipped has a lot less die off. It will carry a lot more hitchhikers, both good and bad, because of this.

 

In the absence of real data, my opinion is that you choose the source of the live rock based on your goals. With Gulf live rock, you get diversity of organisms, including corals, that are suitable for a Caribbean biotope. If you want more interesting shapes and sizes, and less risk of mantis shrimp, whelks and eunicid worms, then Pacific rock is probably a better bet.

[Brian Ward]

I have heard and read Anthony's opinions about this, and I have never seen him provide numbers or data. Did he provide information to back up his claims? Rock from TBS and Gulf View is actually dry rock that is placed on the bottom of the Gulf for several years to become colonized by the relevant organisms. It is as good a biological filter as the stuff from the Pacific, and if properly shipped has a lot less die off. It will carry a lot more hitchhikers, both good and bad, because of this.

 

In the absence of real data, my opinion is that you choose the source of the live rock based on your goals. With Gulf live rock, you get diversity of organisms, including corals, that are suitable for a Caribbean biotope. If you want more interesting shapes and sizes, and less risk of mantis shrimp, whelks and eunicid worms, then Pacific rock is probably a better bet.

 

No, unfortunately no hard data during the talk. I believe his specific examples were dealing with pacific rock and not caribbean. If the vendor is taking dead rock from other places and putting it in the ocean to make it come alive, then I think this is a perfectly acceptable way to aquaculture the rock. Anthony's point was that aquacultured rock from the pacific islands is mostly a sham to skirt export regulations.

 

All in all, I think the main point is not to blindly accept something labed "aquacultured" as being better for the environment. Check out the details behind it so you can make wise decisions about your purchases.

Edited December 30, 2008 by Brian Ward

[Origami]

Calfo limited his opinions to aquacultured rock coming out of foreign jurisdictions, not to Gulf aquacultured rock. Dave (mogurnda) has it right. Aquacultured Gulf rock from Florida is mined and farmed offshore under special license from Florida's state government.

 

I started out using (TBS) Gulf aquacultured rock, actually. On the plus side: It's full of life (good hitchikers), and generally already encrusted with coralline and a lot of macroalgae. On the down side: It's rather blocky and dense (about 50% more dense than wild, Pacific rock). Sometimes the macroalgae can get out of control (e.g. Caulerpa mexicana) unless you're aggressive about pruning it back. And bad hitchikers (gorilla crabs, (generally small) mantis shrimp (though I had one that was upwards of 3 inches in one of my rocks - I gave him away). It's also kind of expensive (especially when you consider the density and the fact that you can pick up rock from retiring aquarists for a very reasonable price).

[Coral Hind]

Florida aquacultured rock is not what Anthony was talking about. The Florida aquacultured rock is mined out of quarries inland. It is taken out on barges to be set in areas set aside for this purpose. The permits are leased from the Federal Game and Wildlife for areas that are about 15 miles from the coast. The rocks are left there for a year or so and then collected. In small loads. The government will only allow the collection of so many buckets of rock per week from an area.

 

In around 1996 the state stopped the collection of wild live rock. I had a side job working for a dealer and we would dive down by Clearwater and set out the rocks in long rows, about 100' x 10' in about 30 feet of water. After the rocks were brought back it went into a greenhouse with large vats to cure. The vats had octopus inside them that would go over the rocks and remove any of the unwanted crabs and shrimps.

[Coral Hind]

From a "green" or carbon footprint point of view. Why buy rock and ship it all the way from the other side of the world when there is suitable rock farmed under government watch, just a days drive away.

[Hilary]

Even greener - get "used" rock from other hobbiests as Origami/Tom pointed out. Aside from an odd piece here or there from local LFS when I wanted something specific all of my rock for two different systems came from tanks being broken down. Generally you can count on no hitchhikers, little to no cycle, and it often comes with coral and coralline. Why start from scratch when you can get cured rock for about a quarter of the price?

Edited December 30, 2008 by Hilary

[zygote2k]

When I worked at the last LFS, we exclusively sold Florida Keys aquacultured liverock. It would be shipped in the morning in FL and arrive here by evening.

It would have encrusting sps, sponges, gorgonians, halimeda, mantis shrimps, turkeyfoot clams, orange ball sponge, hydrozoans, tunicates, and sometimes ricordea. I have never seen nicer, fully encrusted rock from anywhere else in the world.