Easiest or Cheapest way to maintain Calc and Alk?

[Incredible Corals]

Well the day came were by 10% water changes can't keep up with the coral sucking up all the calcium. After 10% water changes the calcium only goes up to 350-360 and the drops to 300 by the end of the week. My alk after a water change is only at 125ppm or 7dkh.

 

Two questions:

 

1.) What is the easiest way to maintain Calc and Alk?

 

2.) What is the cheapest way to maintain Calc and Alk?

[hlem]

cheapest = alk-baking soda

[Guest thefishman65]

Do you have an ATO. I think the easiest sound like a kalkwasser reactor - I plan to buil one soon. Just stir slowly and feed the top off water through it. I also think is fairly cheap as you can just use pickling lime.

[Incredible Corals]

Do you have an ATO. I think the easiest sound like a kalkwasser reactor - I plan to buil one soon. Just stir slowly and feed the top off water through it. I also think is fairly cheap as you can just use pickling lime.

 

Yes, I have a 10 gallon reservoir tank with a JBJ ATO. Do you know of any good articles that I can read about setting that up?

[Incredible Corals]

Could I do this? I have 5 gallon of evap a week. This seems like the easiest way to maintaine the Calc.

 

"connect the reactor between my topoff reservoir and the sump, so that when the sump demands water, it will flow from the reservoir, through the reactor, and into the sump."

 

This is all very new to me so I applogize for any dumb questions I know I will have.

[Incredible Corals]

In theory wouldn't I only need these two products...

 

Two Little Fishies KW Reactor 300 (Kalkwasser Reactor)

http://www.marinedepot.com/Two_Little_Fishies_KW_Reactor_300_(Kalkwasser_Reactor)_Kalkwasser_Reactors-Two_Little_Fishies-TL4613-FICRKR-0-vi.html

 

Two Little Fishies Peter Wilkens Kalkwassar 4 Lb

http://www.marinedepot.com/Two_Little_Fishies_Peter_Wilkens_Kalkwassar_Kalkwasser_Additives_Supplements-Two_Little_Fishies-TL1151-FIADCAKW-vi.html

 

So, I would run the pumo for the ATO to the Kalkwasser Reactor which would then dump the Kalkwasser and fresh RO/DI into the sump.

 

Is it really that easy and automated?

 

Also, what happens to the Alk? Does it just stay in check because the Kalkwasser is being added so slowly?

[TonyInVa]

I just ad Kalk water into the top off reservoir. This works for me.

[Big Country]

I use a deltec kalk reactor, if I had it to do over again I wouldn't have put out the cash although I love the unit and it works well. I know one person that uses the Two Little Fishies KW Reactor 300 and said it works well, I'm just not a fan on relying on top off water running through the reactor to mix the kalk. Look at the Avast Marine website and their reactor is $189 and is comparable to the deltec I'm using. As for kalkwasser I've used ESV kalk and Kent kalk but I really like the Bulk Reef Supply kalk which is alot cheaper $11.99 for 4.5 pounds http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/store/products/calcium-alkalinity-magnesium/kalkwasser-calcium-hydroxide/1-gallon-bulk-kalkwasser-calcium-hydroxide-for-aquariums.html . You can either go the kalk route which I did until my demand got too high and I currently dose 2 part on top of the kalk. You can always start dosing 2 part and save up for a kalk reactor to automate things.

[F&Fmgr]

I have the TLF KW300 and its been working well on a 180...don't know how the JBJ sensor works(air or magnet?) this might make a difference b/c if there is too much to top off from on to off, then there is a high risk of OD. just get a ball valve to regulate the flow into the reactor. the "spinner" doesn't need much pressure to spin and fluidize the kalk.

 

hope that helps

 

Sean

[Origami]

I just ad Kalk water into the top off reservoir. This works for me.

This is probably the easiest and cheapest way to add a balanced supplement to tour tank and to have it somewhat automated through your ATO. A Kalk reactor or a regimen of two part are also options but require a little more investment, either in time or equipment. Depending upon the growth, you can outgrow Kalkwasser's capability sometime downstream.

[JMsAquarium]

This is probably the easiest and cheapest way to add a balanced supplement to tour tank and to have it somewhat automated through your ATO. A Kalk reactor or a regimen of two part are also options but require a little more investment, either in time or equipment. Depending upon the growth, you can outgrow Kalkwasser's capability sometime downstream.

 

 

What Tom said. You can always add a kalk reactor and/or start dosing two part solutions later on when you tank needs increase.

[Incredible Corals]

I have the TLF KW300 and its been working well on a 180...don't know how the JBJ sensor works(air or magnet?) this might make a difference b/c if there is too much to top off from on to off, then there is a high risk of OD. just get a ball valve to regulate the flow into the reactor. the "spinner" doesn't need much pressure to spin and fluidize the kalk.

 

hope that helps

 

Sean

 

 

The JBJ uses a magnetic float switch. It usually only turns the top off pump on for a few seconds at a time a couples times a day.

[Incredible Corals]

What Tom said. You can always add a kalk reactor and/or start dosing two part solutions later on when you tank needs increase.

 

I think I'll just go with the TLF reactor and the Bulk Reef Supply Kalk. Combined with shipping it should only be around $100. I alread have the ATO unit, pump and tubing so I should be good to go.

 

Thanks for all the help everyone!

[Incredible Corals]

I use a deltec kalk reactor, if I had it to do over again I wouldn't have put out the cash although I love the unit and it works well. I know one person that uses the Two Little Fishies KW Reactor 300 and said it works well, I'm just not a fan on relying on top off water running through the reactor to mix the kalk. Look at the Avast Marine website and their reactor is $189 and is comparable to the deltec I'm using. As for kalkwasser I've used ESV kalk and Kent kalk but I really like the Bulk Reef Supply kalk which is alot cheaper $11.99 for 4.5 pounds http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/store/products/calcium-alkalinity-magnesium/kalkwasser-calcium-hydroxide/1-gallon-bulk-kalkwasser-calcium-hydroxide-for-aquariums.html . You can either go the kalk route which I did until my demand got too high and I currently dose 2 part on top of the kalk. You can always start dosing 2 part and save up for a kalk reactor to automate things.

 

Nice find, just ordered that. Even with shipping it was still $10 less than Marine Depot's price for 4lbs. I also ordered the TLF Kalk Reactor. I only have a 60 gallon tank and minimal SPS.

 

So this is my plan, tell me if it's wrong. I'm going to use 2 part to get the calk and alk up to 400-450ppm and 9dkh. Then use the Kalk reactor to keep the calc and alk at those level. I will be hooking this up to my existing ATO system. For a fail safe I will have my ATO hooked up to the Aqua Controller with a program code of "if ph > 8.6 then ATO Off". With that code I don't have to worry about the ATO switch malfunctioning and keeping the ATO on and overdosing the take with too much kalk.

 

Am I missing anything?

[Guest thefishman65]

Does anyone know if a Aqua Lifter would have enough water pressure and/or flow to use the TLF reactor?

[Origami]

Missing anything? Depends.

 

How much water is in your ATO system? How much kalk do you intend on putting in the reactor? What kind of pump are you using and how much kalkwasser can it deliver before your probe picks it up?

 

We had one guy here a couple of years ago who would put 3 or 4 weeks worth of kalk in his reactor. He like the fact that he didn't have to add kalk powder but once a month or so. That's a disaster waiting to happen. In fact, it was behind a disaster that did happen, when his safeguards failed, and kalk as pushed out into his system in large amounts over a short time. That's one reason why I don't put more kalk in my reactor than can be used in 1 week's time. Also, my ATO reservoir is limited to about 3% of my total system volume. This limits how much can be delivered should other safeguards fail. Finally, I deliver my kalk using a peristaltic pump driven by a timer, this limits how much can be delivered over any particular period of time.

 

By the way, I use a Deltec KM-500 reactor that I bought used some years ago from a WAMAS member. I think, as balanced additives go, it's one of the best starting points. It certainly has just about the lowest cost of entry (one of your original questions). It also carries risks, though. And, I'm using BRS calcium hydroxide, too. Good stuff.

 

I think you'll like the reactor approach. Just be careful and limit your exposure to mistakes so that you don't have an overdose. And, if you do have an overdose, know what you need to do by reading this in advance:

 

How to respond to a kalk overdose

[Incredible Corals]

How much water is in your ATO system?

 

10 gallons which last almost 2 weeks and is 13% of the tank total volume (when full)

 

How much kalk do you intend on putting in the reactor?

 

I could do what you said and only add enough for one week. So if my tank uses about 5 gallons per week then I would add 10 tsp. Right?

 

What kind of pump are you using and how much kalkwasser can it deliver before your probe picks it up?

 

I'm going to be using a MaxiJet 1200 which is 400gph (what the reactor recommends). I'm not sure how much kalk/time would need to be added/go by before the probe picked up the high ph. Assuming that the ph wouldn't spike in the matter of seconds by 5-6 dkh through out the entire tank, I would think there would be enough time for the probe to pick up an 8.6 reading before more damage is done in the delayed reading. However, if the float switch failed and then the probe failed or didn't pick up the reading it could only dump 1 weeks worth of kalk powder into the system. I don't mind having to add kalk powder every week with water changes. I'm sure it will only take a minute and I'll just make it part of my weekly routine.

 

I think you'll like the reactor approach. Just be careful and limit your exposure to mistakes so that you don't have an overdose. And, if you do have an overdose, know what you need to do by reading this in advance: Thanks, saved to favorites

 

How to respond to a kalk overdose

 

 

Overall, still sound like a good approach?

[epleeds]

i use two part and a profilux doser. Not the cheapest (profilux), but very easy and you dont have to really mess around with it. Sure the initial investment is more than most, but when you only have to refill the 2 part containers monthly it is so easy.

[F&Fmgr]

Does anyone know if a Aqua Lifter would have enough water pressure and/or flow to use the TLF reactor?

 

It should be, as long as there isn't alot of head pressure...i use an mj1200 and have it dialed down to a trickle, just enough to spin

[steveoutlaw]

There are two types of Kalk reactors out there....pump mixed and stirrers. A pump mixed kalk reactor is just that, a reactor that uses a small pump to mix the kalk with the water. These are usually pretty inexpensive and seem to do a pretty good job. A kalk stirrer uses an external motor to turn a stirring arm inside the kalk reactor tube. These are better at keeping the kalk water at a consistent saturation level. Either way, I think that the kalk reactor is a good way to go.

 

If you haven't already ordered, Reeftek makes a decent pump mixed model. Geo makes a very well built one also, but is a little more expensive. If you get the pump mixed kind, make sure replacement impellers for the pump are readily available because you will have to replace them about every year. The Reeftek and the Geo use maxijet pumps so that makes it really convenient.

 

You're not too far from me so you are welcome to come by and see my setup. I have a Geo pump mixed reactor feeding my tank through the ATO. Good luck!

[Incredible Corals]

There are two types of Kalk reactors out there....pump mixed and stirrers. A pump mixed kalk reactor is just that, a reactor that uses a small pump to mix the kalk with the water. These are usually pretty inexpensive and seem to do a pretty good job. A kalk stirrer uses an external motor to turn a stirring arm inside the kalk reactor tube. These are better at keeping the kalk water at a consistent saturation level. Either way, I think that the kalk reactor is a good way to go.

 

If you haven't already ordered, Reeftek makes a decent pump mixed model. Geo makes a very well built one also, but is a little more expensive. If you get the pump mixed kind, make sure replacement impellers for the pump are readily available because you will have to replace them about every year. The Reeftek and the Geo use maxijet pumps so that makes it really convenient.

 

You're not too far from me so you are welcome to come by and see my setup. I have a Geo pump mixed reactor feeding my tank through the ATO. Good luck!

 

Thanks for the help.

 

I did order the TLF Kalk reactor.

 

On another note, I started dosing 2 part. Once I added the Ionic B within a matter of seconds my PH probe already picked up the increase in PH. So, my failsafe of the Aquacontroller to turn off the ATO w/ Kalk Reactor if the PH goes above 8.6 should work and shut the system down before it can OD. My initial fear was the PH wouldn't pick up for a minute or so and the ATO w/ Kalk could OD the system even with the fail safe.

 

If anyone is curious I put the PH probe where the drain is for the overflow in the sump (seperate compartment). Even though the Kalk is being added to the sump itself the PH probe doesn't pick up the reading until the pump moves the Kalk up to the tank, in the tank, and back down the overflow.

 

Can't wait to see the SPS growth and coraline covering the barebottom!

[Origami]

There are two types of Kalk reactors out there....pump mixed and stirrers. A pump mixed kalk reactor is just that, a reactor that uses a small pump to mix the kalk with the water. These are usually pretty inexpensive and seem to do a pretty good job. A kalk stirrer uses an external motor to turn a stirring arm inside the kalk reactor tube. These are better at keeping the kalk water at a consistent saturation level. Either way, I think that the kalk reactor is a good way to go.

 

If you haven't already ordered, Reeftek makes a decent pump mixed model. Geo makes a very well built one also, but is a little more expensive. If you get the pump mixed kind, make sure replacement impellers for the pump are readily available because you will have to replace them about every year. The Reeftek and the Geo use maxijet pumps so that makes it really convenient.

 

You're not too far from me so you are welcome to come by and see my setup. I have a Geo pump mixed reactor feeding my tank through the ATO. Good luck!

Hi Steve. Glad to see you around. This TLF KW reactor that's being talked about up above is a new, third style of reactor: Neither the typical stirrer nor a Nilsen reactor. It apparently uses a sprinkler head at the end of a feed tube that extends to the bottom of the reactor. The feed pump pressurizes the feed tube, causing the settled kalk to stir each time that kalk is dosed. It's an innovative approach.

 

In this video, reactor designer Julian Sprung talks about the motion of the feed tube stirring the kalk. I have to believe, however, that the motion of the water coming out of the sprinkler head helps keep the kalkwasser saturated.

 

Reefbuilders Link

 

Other benefits of this design are: 1) No motor on top as in the case of stirrer-designs, thus one less thing to go wrong and no wall wart to plug in); 2) No recirculating pump as in the case of a Nilsen reactor, thus no problem with replacing impellers that have worn out; 3) Little, if any, air at the top of the reactor and, therefore, less calcium carbonate precipitation; and, 4) it's fairly passive compared to other designs out there: It only needs a feed pump to operate. My only concerns with this design (at this time) would be about whether or not the spray head sufficiently agitates the kalk out at the edges of the reactor. If it doesn't, it can begin to harden there, causing waste and inefficiencies. I'm guessing that Sprung has tested this out and that it's working well.

 

For me, the little mag-cleaner that Sprung shows here is sort of gimmicky, as I like to clean my reactor every few months anyway just to keep it operating well.

 

I'm looking forward to someone posting an equipment review on the product when they get it and use it for a several months.

[steveoutlaw]

Thanks Tom, I hadn't heard of this design before. It would seem to me that the feed pump would have to stay on for an extended period of time in order to get a decent kalk saturation in the water. I have a 150g cube and evaporate about 15g per week and my ATO never comes on for more than a few seconds at a time. It's almost like you would have to have the feed pump on a timer to only run a few times per day so the pump stays on long enough to adequately mix the kalk. I'm interested to hear how this design performs as well.

[Incredible Corals]

Thanks Tom, I hadn't heard of this design before. It would seem to me that the feed pump would have to stay on for an extended period of time in order to get a decent kalk saturation in the water. I have a 150g cube and evaporate about 15g per week and my ATO never comes on for more than a few seconds at a time. It's almost like you would have to have the feed pump on a timer to only run a few times per day so the pump stays on long enough to adequately mix the kalk. I'm interested to hear how this design performs as well.

 

I did search all over the internet for a bad review and found nothing but happy people and positive reviews.

 

Also, the feed line is reduced to a 3/16" ID before it hits the sprinklerhead. So, the ATO will stay on much longer while feeding the reactor and mixing the Kalk as apposed to a 1/2" ID tube dumping in fresh water directly to the sump allowing the float switch to move up within a matter of seconds.

 

Anyone think it would be worth it for me to do a write up on the install and performance over a few months

[Origami]

Thanks Tom, I hadn't heard of this design before. It would seem to me that the feed pump would have to stay on for an extended period of time in order to get a decent kalk saturation in the water. I have a 150g cube and evaporate about 15g per week and my ATO never comes on for more than a few seconds at a time. It's almost like you would have to have the feed pump on a timer to only run a few times per day so the pump stays on long enough to adequately mix the kalk. I'm interested to hear how this design performs as well.

That's exactly one of the thoughts that I had (but didn't write). You'd probably want to put the feed pump on a timer to get the extended mixing action that you're talking about. This is one of those things that people could play around with. Depending upon how much evaporation that the tank experiences in an average day, you'd want to enable dosing in certain windows throughout the day. You want to avoid the scenario, though, where the dosing time is too long as you don't want to have so much flowing through the reactor for so long that kalk powder in particulate form escapes from the reactor, potentially overdosing the tank. Those are parameters that I think the hobbyist can play with.