odd smell, large dieoff???

[LanglandJoshua]

I have a 75 gallon tank with a 20 gallon sump. I am running a Fluval 405, and 60 gallon seaclone protein skimmer. The stock in my tank are Zooanthids, one BTA, a Blue Hippo tang, 6 line wrass, skunk cleaner shrimp(on the bottom wrigling as if dying), Coral banded shrimp, many turbo snails and hermits. A new addition was my Engineer Goby. Last night I noticed an odd burning hair smell and checked all my pumps and heaters, nothing was out of place or warm. I concluded it must have been the house furnace in the next room must have caught a bit of dog hair( we try, but it gets everywhere). Now all my snails are closed shells and on their backs, a couple dead hermits and shrimp like critters all crawling out of my live rock. I had been suggested buy a gentleman that works at the Marine Scene named Matt that I remove the sponges from my filtration. So being new to this I tried it out a few days ago and now this. I dont know what to do, I put the filtration sponges back in the fluval 405. I really dont want to lose my cleaner shrimp, its been with the tank since the beginning. I dont really have the ability at this time to restock my tank with snails and anything else that may die. So this will really set the tank back quite a while if they die. Any ideas? I suspect its the lack of filtration, my temp is 80 degrees, and last I checked 2 weeks ago my PH was 8.3, salinity 1.023, phosphates 0, amonia .25 from new stuff, Nitrates and nitrites 0. I will probably end up doing more tests today but I just noticed this. Even my BTA, xenia, and Zooanthids are shriveled and nearly pealing off the rocks they are on.

Edited December 3, 2010 by LanglandJoshua

[BowieReefer84]

Do you have a lid on your tank? Did any household cleaner make it's way in somehow? This could kills things, and explain the ammonia spike. Also, lots of parameters can change in two weeks. I would test again like you said, and start mixing some water now.

 

Sidenote - 6 line wrasse will jump out without a lid sooner or later. Mine did.

[encideought]

are you sure your temperature is accurate? 80 is okay but towards the high end, if the temp is much higher than 80 you could start to have some problems. Do you feel any tingling when you put your hand in the tank? Maybe the burning smell is some electrical thing starting to go bad (a heater maybe?). your nitrate levels don't seem too high so I wouldn't think your filtration is the problem, plus I think that's usually a more gradual decline.

[bluce]

Sounds like some substance got into the d/t - sometimes it is very difficult to figure out what that could be.

I would start using carbon asap - this will help clarify the water. You should also remove any dead animals as they decay it will continue to foul up your d/t water.

[LanglandJoshua]

are you sure your temperature is accurate? 80 is okay but towards the high end, if the temp is much higher than 80 you could start to have some problems. Do you feel any tingling when you put your hand in the tank? Maybe the burning smell is some electrical thing starting to go bad (a heater maybe?). your nitrate levels don't seem too high so I wouldn't think your filtration is the problem, plus I think that's usually a more gradual decline.

 

 

I went to check salinity and made contact between my lights metal sheilding and tank water, then got the ____ shocked out of me.

 

AND ITS A BRAND NEW LIGHT!!!

Edited December 3, 2010 by LanglandJoshua

[Coral Hind]

The new goby probably stirred up the sand bed an released hydrogen sulfide and other things trapped in it. I would do a very large water change, add carbon to the fluval, and skim wet. Adding a poly-filter pad would also help to remove heavy metals or chemicals.

 

I think the light is a seperate issue. What type of light is it? Are all the lights working?

[Chad]

I second Coral hind, I dont think the issues are necessarily related.

 

Also, how deep is your sand bed and when did you add the engineering goby? Reasonable chance that is the cause. I would definitely get new tests, a lot can change in two weeks.

[LanglandJoshua]

Yes alot can change, I agree. I just checked my PH is 8.4 and my Amonia is 1.0. Those are the only two I checked as I am trying to figure out what to do with my heater and or light fixture that produced the massive shock. The ammonia is the highest I have ever had in this tank.

[Chad]

I would get some amquel and dose it as well as doing a large water change and adding more aeration to your tank as soon as you can.

 

The light is most likely a separate issue, but you can unplug it for the time being while you address the more time sensitive issue at hand.

 

 

[LanglandJoshua]

At this time, I had ran low on salt so I cant do a water change until at the soonest I get to my LFS which could be a couple of hours. I have been offered by one very generous reefer to hand whats left of my living stock over to him and a spare tank. So it looks like that may be my only option. But does anyone live closer to Vienna Virginia than Gathersburg Maryland?

[Coral Hind]

Amquel works great at binding the ammonia so it is no longer in free form. There are other products that do the same job like Seachem's Amguard.

 

Are you using a GFCI. If you think the heater is the cause then I would unplug it before sticking my hand in the tank. The heater could leak voltage into the water. When you touched the light you became grounded through the the light fixture. completing the path from the heater, thru you, to the ground in the light.

 

 

[Coral Hind]

I think getting an ammonia remover and carbon into the tank along with a good water change would be easier then relocating everything. The LFS should be open by now.

[LanglandJoshua]

Amquel works great at binding the ammonia so it is no longer in free form. There are other products that do the same job like Seachem's Amguard.

 

Are you using a GFCI. If you think the heater is the cause then I would unplug it before sticking my hand in the tank. The heater could leak voltage into the water. When you touched the light you became grounded through the the light fixture. completing the path from the heater, thru you, to the ground in the light.

 

 

 

 

That is exactly what I was thinking, but I cant seem to put words together. thanks lol...so I am looking for warrantee on the heater. If GFCI means ground fault interupter then yes my Deep Blue Solar Extreme came with one in the cord, so it was the ground. The heater has to be it, but power heads were acting fine and my heater was always saying low flow. Even when I put my filters output aiming right at it. That makes too much sense...now

I will look into the Amquel, what would you say a safe dosage would be for that?

[Chad]

I dont remember off hand, follow the dosage on the bottle. Adding more aeration may help keep oxygen levels up while dosing it.

 

Also, I agree that moving the fish at the moment is probably not the best solution since it will cause additional stress (so long as you can take corrective actions soon). The stuff you need (salt, carbon, and an ammonia binder) will also be available at petsmart/petco if you have one closer to you than the lfs.

Edited December 3, 2010 by Chad

[LanglandJoshua]

I dont remember off hand, follow the dosage on the bottle. Adding more aeration may help keep oxygen levels up while dosing it.

 

Also, I agree that moving the fish at the moment is probably not the best solution since it will cause additional stress (so long as you can take corrective actions soon). The stuff you need (salt, carbon, and an ammonia binder) will also be available at petsmart/petco if you have one closer to you than the lfs.

 

 

as of right now, from what I can see I have both my cleaner shrimp and coral banded shrimp dead. Along with countless snails and small bugs that I had never seen before(some pretty big too!) I am worried that even if I clear the amonia out, what will happen with this massive dieoff? Wont that itself crash my chemical levels? I am worried to move my fish out of my tank, but dont see an alternative.

[Coral Hind]

Remove the dead stuff fast before they start to add to the ammonia build-up.

If you have a tap-water conditioner it too will bind free ammonia.

[Chad]

Here are my thoughts and why I recommended what I have

 

Problems like this must be hanlded in a triage type of approach and need fast action.

 

From what I can see, there are at least three symptoms/issues to deal with immediately.

1) Lowering the ammonia levels and getting water parameters back as soon as you can:

a) add amquel

b) add more aeration

c) do a LARGE (at least 50%) water change, while doing water changes make sure that you are circulating the water and aerating it (if possible leave your protein skimmer running)

d) remove as much dead stuff as you can during the water change

2) Deal with stress to your animals

a) once you have taken the actions under (1), test your water again

b) based on the results, you may need to do more of all the actions under (1)

c) this will be an ongoing issue for a bit since you have started to lose the micro organisms in your rock, I would test and take actions under (1) daily for a bit

3) Deal with the current leakage issue

a) test your various pieces of equipment in a saltwater bucket and a multimeter

b) discard/repair/replace faulty equipment

 

These actions are "casualty actions" meant to restore things to a more manageable place. After you have taken actions (1) and (2) evaluate potential causes for the issue in the first place.

Potentials based on what I have read:

1) Faulty electrical equipment causing a significant current leak

2) Engineer goby disturbed an anoxic section of your sand bed and released hydrogen sulfide (possible explanation of the odor)

3) Something else, probably a contaminant based on the speed things happened (windex maybe?)

 

Find and correct the cause while continuing to test daily and taking appropriate action to maintain ammonia levels as low as possible while your system recovers.

Edited December 3, 2010 by Chad

[Chad]

How is it going?

[OldReefer]

Nice checklist Chad. We should probably sticky something like that where people can find it.

 

I'd add "

 

• Throw in a sack of carbon in a media bag
• Throw in a polyfilter to see if there is metal contamination (in which case you are well and truly screwed)

Let us know how you are doing Joshua. You have a lot of reefers with a lot of equipment and water nearby. I am in Alexandria. Happy to help.

 

Bill

 

 

[gwweber]

Yea, did you ever get your tank figured out?

[LanglandJoshua]

Yea, did you ever get your tank figured out?

 

 

Hey guys, Ive been busy with work. So I couldt really reply. Well here is the total, I found while going through the tank that I had a water heater rated for 20 gallons explode in my sump. That accounts for the shock I recieved and alot of dead critters. I also had asked a gentleman that worked at the Marine Scene about my tank, I think his name was Matt. I know he was bald lol and he was alot of help and very polite. But he gave be advice to remove the mechanical filters from my system. That accounts for all the amonia build up. He was a nice guy, but honestly the advice cost me dearly. It set me back months in the aging of my tank. Worst of all here is the list of my poor dead critters: large brittle star, many baby brittle's, all my snails, most hermits, BTA, skunk cleaner shrimp(I had this little guy since I started the system, and it was like 2.5 almost 3 inches long), coral banded shrimp, green tiped star polyps, 15-20 zoanthids(some may be alive), 10-15 mushroom anemone's(some may be alive), and my beloved Blue Hippo Tang named Ellen. Thank GOD the Engineer goby that I got just before this is doin well...so the tank is recovering. Slowly but surely the crap is bein pulled out by my skimmer. I used to have to clean it onces every 3-4 days, now its daily or more. But at least the worst is over and its comin back. Thanks for the help guys

That check list should be pinned for others. We need an emergency check list. One that includes most anything that could happen and how to avoid/handle/recover from it. I didnt even know that I needed a grounding rod. I had considered the electricity+ water= bad. But I didnt know how to handle it. Now I still need to make a grounding rod(I AM NOT PAYIN $30 FOR ONE!).

 

on the plus side now I have plenty of shells for more hermits...

Edited December 19, 2010 by LanglandJoshua

[bluce]

Sorry to hear about all the losses you had - that really sux!

If all you have left is the goby, due to the metal conatamination from the heater, you may want to completely empty your tank to remove all traces of it.

Sometimes it's better to go through a little more pain and effort now than to continue to fight and loose more animals over time.

 

Good luck

[OldReefer]

I hate to tell you but metal contamination is a bad thing. I lost a mature 90 gallon SPS tank overnight because the plug from power supply feel in the sump and dissolved. I lost a couple thousand dollars worth of coral, so I know your pain.

 

You really need to get on of these today and throw it in the sump...

 

 

It will tell you if you have metal in the tank and it will start removing it.

 

If you have metal in the tank, at the very least you should do a 100% water change. If you are going for a fish-only system it doesn't matter. but if you want to do coral you have to take metal seriously.

 

As far as the nutrients are concerned, pick up some Microbacter 7 or Probiotim or some other bacterial booster. They do a fantastic job bringing tanks back in line.

 

Sorry for the problems. The hobby gets better.

[zygote2k]

I also had asked a gentleman that worked at the Marine Scene about my tank, I think his name was Matt. I know he was bald lol and he was alot of help and very polite. But he gave be advice to remove the mechanical filters from my system. That accounts for all the amonia build up. He was a nice guy, but honestly the advice cost me dearly. It set me back months in the aging of my tank.

 

Matt knows what he is talking about. He probably told you to remove your mechanical filtration because most noobs don't

know that they are supposed to rinse sponge filters and their kin frequently to avoid excess nitrate accumulation. Removing a filter sponge won't cause an ammonia buildup. Dead or dying critters and uneaten food are good sources of ammonia. I don't use any mechanical filters in any of the maintenance tanks for the same reason.

[Coral Hind]

Keeping a poly-filter like OldReefer mentioned on hand for emergencies is always a good idea. They have saved many a reef tank.

 

 

Removing a filter sponge can cause an ammonia build-up but only if it has been the main part of the tanks filtration. By removing the sponge you are removing a large surface area that was colonized by bacteria which was getting great flow of constant ammonia to process. Normally a mature tank would have enough bacteria on other surfaces such as rock or sand to avoid an ammonia issue.