magnesium

[treesprite]

Does anyone have any specific, detailed tips or advice about raising magnesium to kill algae, that is possibly not already in all the stuff I already read? I have never dosed it before, so am a bit apprehensive.

 

My magnesium was at 1250 using a Sea Chem test (so dang complicated, I don't usually do it even though I had the test kit). It appears that some people are going up by 100 mg/l a day, which seems crazy to me. I added enough last night to go up by roughly 50 mg/l (I will know around midnight tonight when I get home from work and test again).

 

I used Fluval brand magnesium, which says 5ml in 20 gal of water raises mag by 5mg/l. My volume is about 70 to 75 (~50 in tank minus rock displacement, ~15 in sump, ~10 in fuge). So I have to multiply dose by 3.5. I think the amount added last night will raise me up about 50mg/l, which I should know around midnight when I get home from work and do a test.

 

I have never had a problem like this before, even all the time that my nitrate and phosphate were off the charts (before joining WAMAS and learning that I was supposed to test those things). This tank went into full use right before Christmas, and has had no fish in it, so I have not put a single drop or crumb of food in it all this time. The rocks had no algae on them at all when I put them in (I took them out of the newly-fishless tanks, did a scrub down of them, then stuck them in a tank with no light; but even before, they did not have all this algae growing on them). The sand was new and well-rinsed. I had a little diatom thing briefly, then the algae started. There was no period of cyano during any of this, just diatoms then algae.

 

There are sps and lps corals, about 6 astrea snails, and supposedly a couple small mithrax crabs which I got to eat the algae and have not seen since the day I put them in (I assumed them to be able to live off of the algae, so I hope I wasn't wrong and starved them to death). The astrea snails are covered in flowing green manes, which would look kind of cool if it wasn't for the hair being hair algae.

[Origami]

Raising magnesium levels using Kent's Tech-M magnesium was said to be helpful in killing off bryopsis many years back. It didn't always work with other brands so it was thought to be a result of some trace impurity.

 

You may have phosphate-laden rock. Phosphates will adsorb onto aragonite surfaces and may be the source that is supplying phosphate to your aquarium. An acid wash may help to strip off the rock surface and expose new, uncontaminated surfaces below. 

 

Also, take a look at flucanozole and bryopsis as it applies to reef aquariums. (Google flucanazole bryopsis reef.) This treatment can also knock out hair algae. However, if you have a nutrient problem in the water or in the rock, the treatment will only give you temporary relief.

 

Finally, some people have had success dosing hydrogen peroxide of several weeks to control algae.

[treesprite]

I just got home, so now I can test stuff. I will check my phosphate test kit for an expiration date and make sure I am not making any mistake when I do the test. I imagine the level will show lower than what it would be if the algae wasn't consuming any.

 

Aside from being on the rock, there really is no other source for the phosphate, so I hope it isn't a liverock issue.

[treesprite]

Magnesium is about 1300.

 

Phosphate is about .1 based on my perception of comparison to Sea Chem color scale (also used the AP kit just for comparison; AP is too crude for levels below .25 and someone with wishful thinking would say my sample was zero).

 

Nitrate is about 5

 

I wonder how high the phosphate would be if the algae wasn't in there. I just discovered spots of green hair growing out of the sand, and this sand is new, never had any food or fish poop on it. There is also algae on non-flesh parts of LPS trunks. The stuff is growing faster than I can pull it out of the tank. I have been using only actinics for light for a couple of weeks.

 

Should I forget about raising the magnesium any higher?

 

I need to read more about the hydrogen peroxide. Thanks for the suggestion.

[Origami]

Phosphate would undoubtedly be higher if the algae wasn't there. I'm actually surprised that, with as much algae as you've got going, you have any non-zero reading of phosphate right now. I would have assumed that the algae were growing fast enough to lock it up as soon as it was available. 

 

I'd forget about the magnesium. It's primary efficacy was against Bryopsis as I recall. I don't recall it being broadly applied to algae in general. 

[treesprite]

I am going to test my RO water. It should be ok, because I replaced the filters recently, and got zero when I tested it before use of the water (tap water phosphate is high).

 

My all has been low (which I'm in the process of fixing), and I am wondering if the algae likes less alkaline water. Some post on some forum suggested that someone raise alk (who had low level all and algae roblem), because algae likes low alkalinity. I haven't had a chance to research it yet.

 

I wonder if I got something in the water at some point. I sometimes forget to wash my hands before putting them in the tank. I may have had hand lotion on them.

[madweazl]

I've never observed accelerated algae growth in relation to alkalinity levels, be it low or high. On the plus side, removal of the algae is exporting the phosphates so eventually, it will disappear on its own. I wouldn't suspect anything on your hands to cause the algae bloom, that would typically manifest as a poor reaction from your corals. I would think it wise to maintain the levels you currently have if the corals are in good health and let the algae bring the phosphate levels down; if you arent adding an energy source to the tank, it will eventually run out. 

[treesprite]

The corals are great, now that they aren't crammed in little "temporary" tanks (ended up being 1.5 years), with so much rock that the rocks cast too many shadows and made good circulation impossible. I lost most of the SPS I had, but the few that lived are now growing again (monti, pavona, and one acro).

 

Since only two rocks (but big ones) have any coral growing in them, I will take out the ones with algae and switch them with rocks from the liverock tank which has no light hence no algae (half of my rock is separate from main system, because I set up the 50 instead of my 120). I just don't want to have to do it a second time, so I need to fix the problem.

 

Any suggestions for doing anything to the non-algae rock that is going in? The stuff coming out will get semi-nuked.

[Origami]

Higher alk levels can be associated with a several things that might have some bearing on the anectdotal evidence: 1) If dripped in the form of kalkwasser, some phosphates could be precipitated out as calcium phosphate in the region where the kalk is dripping. And, 2) higher alkalinity tends to shift the pH upwards, shifting some of the CO2 into other forms (bicarbonate and carbonate), possibly making it less available to photosynthesis. However, in the long run, the dissolved CO2 will reach equilibirium with the air, so I don't think that this would be a long-term solution; and, 3) increased alkalinity might favor growth of competitors (corals, coralline algae, etc.) that would compete for similar nutrients as the problem algae.

 

Again, if your rock is leaching phosphates, then an acid wash may be reasonable. Otherwise, you can continue to harvest the algae and, someday, there should be none left (you'd hope). 

[treesprite]

I was just reading about the muriatic acid wash procedure. There is no place where I live to do such a thing.

[Origami]

I was just reading about the muriatic acid wash procedure. There is no place where I live to do such a thing.

Honestly, you could do it in a plastic trash can or a Rubbermaid bin. If the rock stops bubbling, the acid is for the most part neutralized. You could always toss in a box of baking soda at the end to make sure it's neutralized or even slightly basic. At that point, it's pretty much just dirty salt water (with carbonates, phosphates and other grime). It's best done outdoors though so you have adequate ventilation. It's good to have gloves, too. You can do it with vinegar, but it'll take a lot more. Using muriatic acid is cheaper, but you just have to practice good handling procedures when working with it.

[flooddc]

How bad is your hair algae that you wanted to go through all these drastic measures?

have any picture? 

 

I had a few spots on my glass and frag rack that I occasionally use a tooth brush and remove them. It's eye sore, but realistically not too bad actually. I found lots of pods and micro sea stars living in the algae too.  I think my algae is resulted from little or no flow. If you increase flow in those area it might go away.

[treesprite]

Algae very bad. I have never seen such bad algae. The stuff is growing on rocks, sand, and even corals. I believe the snails are carrying it around the tank to every spot, because they are covered in it.

 

Last night I found a sample bottle of Carib Sea phoshate remover PhosBuster (a sample from when MACNA was here). I put some of that in the tank, not as much as it says to use, because I don't like putting weird stuff in the tank. I did it because I don't think doing repeated big water changes is going to solve the problem, even though that is my usual reaction to water issues.

 

I changed a couple bulbs when I had a T5 fixture on the tank; that fixture was just on there temporarily, because it is too big (I got it for the 120g tank I decided not to set up). I think using it is why the out burst of algae came on so suddenly like a slap in the face from a passerby on the street. Someone gave me an LED fixture which can be more controlled, so I put that on a couple weeks ago, and have had only the actinics running on it (but there is a lot of ambient light from Windows).

 

I used to dose carbon and Biodigest, which I had not been doing in this tank, except Biodigest at startup. I just started using vinegar, but at a starting amount it is too little to do anything, and it takes months to really have an effect.

Edited March 1, 2018 by treesprite

[flooddc]

I personally think those "chem" stuffs  are temporary fix. Have you test your rodi? perhaps a sea hare will keep it under control.  

[treesprite]

I know that about the liquid phosphate remover. I need something to put a dent in the algae asap, until I can solve the problem for real.

 

I did think about a Sea hare, just not sure if I want one in there. I also thought about getting an urchin. I wonder want either of them long term.

[Origami]

Dave Lin had a school tank that should probably have been the shining example of algae gone wild. He put a sea hare in and it made short work of the mess. You might want to consider it.

 

I've also seen moderately bad cases resolved with multi-week therapy with flucanazole. 

 

The sea hare sounds like it might be a pretty good option. Take pictures so we can see how the situation progresses.

[treesprite]

I'll try to get a sea hare this weekend. Any suggestions for where to get one without driving for an hour? I'm in zip code 20906. The closest place to me is Tropical Lagoon, and I have never seen them in there.

[treesprite]

I haven't raised magnesium any higher. I don't think I will do it. I bought peroxide, but am afraid to use it.

 

As turns out, Tropical Lagoon does have sea hares. I was going to go today, but I won't have time to acclimate it properly right away. I don't want it sitting in a bag for 4 hours, since that may be as bad as just tossing it right into the tank. So I guess I'm not getting it today. Honestly, though, I saw so much stuff today on the internet that I'm afraid the thing will die on me right away if I get one.

 

The blue leg hermits I got yesterday are picking all over the rocks. I hope they are eating the algae. I got 20 of them, but they are very tiny. I didn't get any sails.

 

I took a couple very hairy rocks out of the DT and put them in the QT with the cherub angel I got yesterday. I want to see if the fish will eat it.

Edited March 4, 2018 by treesprite