Controller and Automation Questions

[Matt LeBaron]

So having finally just about gotten my aquarium setup back to how I like it after my move I'm thinking about future projects. One thing I would like to do is get an automation setup going. I know there are several commercial systems that can monitor things like PH, Temp, and ORP and get those reported out via your home network to the Internet but are there any systems that also incorporate remote control via the internet and/or programming to for instance turn an outlet off and on during certain times or turn an outlet back on after a set amount of time of it being turned off.

 

Also if they do allow for this type of control what platforms do they support for this control (Andriod, IOS, Windows, Linux) and what are the GUI's like. Such as fully fleshed out or more of a DIY type of setup.

 

Some of the things that I am looking to do is to get my two heaters onto the same temp control as I am having some issues getting them lined up to where they both come on at the same time so that I don't have one running constantly with the other just sitting. Being able to turn my protein skimmer off for a period of time when I feed without having to remember to turn it back on later. (this has become a problem with my new 8 month old and the time required by her now) Being able to have a record of the temp and PH changes if any over the course of a day or days and potentially automating some dosing that I do manually right now. I'd also like to have some remote control over the tank and I'm thinking of potentially in the future automating some feeding or at least allowing me to do some of it remotely; I'm thinking of upgrading my green water production beyond some cut off soda bottles and maybe allowing for dosing right into the tank, same with maybe hatching brine shrimp but I'm not sure on that. Being able to automate some of the dry food I feed my gobies and pistol shrimp is also something I have thought about.

 

I've done some basic research on home automation stuff like Z Wave controllers and receivers but getting all of that setup to do a lot of the things I would like would involve a heck of a lot of kit bashing and DIY so I'm hoping there may be something on the market that can save me the work of having to do all of that.

 

Any advice, experience, thoughts, or ideas are welcome.

[hypertech]

An Apex will do all of that. The network control is via a web page so you can use any type of computer. There is an iOS app and there at least used to be an Android app.

[Origami]

There's an Android app for the Apex (that also works with the AC-III) but it's no longer supported by the hobbyist-developer. I use it to monitor my Apex and, while I can control the outlets, you can't program from there. Instead, I access my Apex through its standard browser interface by putting a bookmark on my phone. One click, and I'm in.

[hypertech]

You can't program from the ios app either. You can control outlets, see parameters, and view graphs. I use my computer for programming.

Edited November 6, 2012 by hypertech

[Rosco's Reefs]

Most any controller on the market will do what you want to do. I have the Reef Angel controller and really like it. It does require a more computer savvy person to do the more esoteric functions but supports all the above plus dosers, skimmers, chillers, automatic water changers, etc. Support is readily available on the forums and I can also help if needed.

 

Much progress has been made on this controller in recent months to make it more "user-friendly," to include installation menus, configuration menus, etc. You do the programming on a close-by computer or laptop; it is a pain to have to move the Reef Angel to the computer. While you are a little far from Gaithersburg, I'd be happy to have you over and show you what I'm doing with mine, if interested.

 

Every time this topic comes up the board goes nuts defending their particular brand of controller; let's don't do that this time. It all comes down to, in my mind, what you like. I am a tinkerer, a DIY person, so I went this route. You will eventually go yours. Thanks.

[zygote2k]

I've used 3 of the different control systems on the market over the past few years and after playing with the Apex for about a year, it seems to be the hands down winner for plug and play and versatility.

The Reef Angel sounds like a nice system with tons of potential, but you have to be a techie like the previous poster says to make it work for you. If you're a caveman like the majority of us, then go with the Apex.

[ErikS]

Most any controller on the market will do what you want to do. I have the Reef Angel controller and really like it. It does require a more computer savvy person to do the more esoteric functions but supports all the above plus dosers, skimmers, chillers, automatic water changers, etc. Support is readily available on the forums and I can also help if needed.

While I've had great luck with Neptune products - their service is 1st rate and the products work very well. My ACIII is several years old and still going strong. The only issues I've had are outlets no longer being able to be controlled on DC8's.

 

That being said if one has any kind of tech savvy the Reef Angel looks great. Expandable & budget friendly.....and if you're a code person the sky is really the limit (write your own functions).

 

........... but you have to be a techie like the previous poster says to make it work for you. If you're a caveman like the majority of us, then go with the Apex.

I'd wager we have a higher % of software folks in WAMAS than most other clubs. But correct, you do need a bit of tech ability.

Edited November 6, 2012 by ErikS

[Matt LeBaron]

Looking around a bit it appears that the Apex controller has an expansion module for controlling Vortech pumps, which is a bonus for me, I noticed that the Reef Angel has the same but has anyone worked with this before? How hard is it to program the Reef Angel to made the Vortech do specific things? My immediate question would be how to get it to turn to feeding mode on command.

 

What programming languages does Apex use? Is it a unit specific scripting language or something more open? Looks like the Reef Angel is basically an Arduino so it uses that C++ derivative I'm assuming.

 

Also I noticed that the Apex can do voltage detection through it's power modules, is the Reef Angel capable of the same thing? I also saw that the Reef Angel has a salinity probe option but didn't notice anything similar for the Apex, am I just missing it?

 

Another question I have is how each of the controllers record data. Is it in application some how or in like a flat file format?

 

The Reef Angel looks tempting to me because of the tinkerer in me and price but I have to balance that against the amount of free time I have for that (very little right now) so I wouldn't want the Reef Angel to be a 80+ hour project just to get some of the basic stuff I want setup.

 

And just to round out my list of questions, are there any rumors on upcoming new and improved features/probes/abilities from either company?

[Origami]

The only issues I've had are outlets no longer being able to be controlled on DC8's.

Erik, you probably know that outlets 4 & 8 are relay-based outlets, while 1-3 and 5-7 use triacs. Somewhere in the Internet ether, there's are DIY instructions on how to test for and to replace a failed triac in a DC8. This may be the reason that you have an uncontrollable outlet on your device. If you have access to a soldering iron, the replacement is fairly straightforward. It may be worth a shot.

 

Ah. Here we go. Here's a thread on our forum:

 

http://www.wamas.org/forums/topic/42945-diy-dc8-repair/

 

And, here's the thread that it refers to:

http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/showthread.php?t=22779 (too bad the pictures are gone now)

 

Here's a success story from ReefCentral on a failed relay outlet that involves giving it a sharp smack. Of course, you can always replace a relay...

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1696585

 

Back to Matt:

The Apex doesn't use a conventional "programming language" per se. It's a set of instructions that basically update a dynamic state-table wherein each entry represents the state of an "outlet." Download the users guide from Neptune or go here for another, better users guide.

[Rosco's Reefs]

Some responses to your questions about Reef Angel.

 

Matt said, "How hard is it to program the Reef Angel to made the Vortech do specific things?"

 

A blurb from the Reef Angel forum here

 

Matt said, "My immediate question would be how to get it to turn to feeding mode on command?"

 

Another blurb here

 

I asked your question about power detection but must've not understood the question because he said:

 

Roberto said, "I think he's talking about current and not voltage. No, there is no power consumption monitoring."

 

Matt asked, "how each of the controllers record data"

 

The data is available on the user portal, on various open source apps, and via either CSV or XML feeds

 

Matt asked, "balance that against the amount of free time I have."

 

Like any hobby, work expands to overfill the amount of time anyone has to invest in it. My recommendation, regardless of which controller you choose, is to get the basics up, then add one new thing at a time until you have it doing what you want. As to new features, I never cease to be amazed at what the programming wonks discuss on a daily basis on the forum, best of all they share their code as they perfect it. As for me? I have NEVER written a line of code for this thing...I am pretty good at cut, copy, paste, however. Then if I break their code, they help me fix it.

 

Ross

[Matt LeBaron]

Thanks for the info Ross. That answered a lot of questions I have and it was good to see the help that the community provides. I think I'll likely end up going for the Reef Angel. Maybe see if I can convince the wife that it would make a good birthday or x-mas present.

[ErikS]

Erik, you probably know that outlets 4 & 8 are relay-based outlets, while 1-3 and 5-7 use triacs. ........

Thanks, I greatly appreciate it. I'll sound like an ingrate but given they seem to fail only after a few years I just work around them (can still use most of them as always on). Overall I still rate them as solid. If I ever get to the point where I need more controlled I'll probably look into fixing them (I have 3 DC8s, one as a spare).