TROLL December 29, 2006 Share December 29, 2006 Recently, I was driven by a very idea of keep conservation going and creating a common place for people to trade, sell, and buy corals and accessories. So, I've established a new auction site dedicated to the purpose of percentage donation to societies and organization. Anyway, I'm looking for members of WAMAS that might be able to help with jump start the site. I've listed a few items on my site and hopefully, earn enough money to afford appropiate software which has more feature that allows for fee to be earn through each sales on the site. Also, there's a whole a lot more features such as webstore, payment option, buy it now, etc. Once I get the necessary amount of money to purchase the software- I'll revise some codes to add option bar that choose the specific organizations to have percentage donation from all fee. Right now, my site is 100% free for all sale fee. Registration will always be free. If any of you would be interested to help out by either post items for sale or donation. Come visit my site, thanks! P.S. I see that WAMAS have held an auction previously and maybe it'll be great to have US wide auction later on- I'll check the site admin feature and see if I can waive all fee so the WAMAS will recieve all money toward its' respective organization fund. Reef Auction Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VicSkimmr December 29, 2006 Share December 29, 2006 Oh come on, do you honestly believe we're going to take you seriously with a name like TROLL? :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhoch December 29, 2006 Share December 29, 2006 Actually his name is Troy, and he's a valid and paid member from up in my area. Troy... as your first post, probably not a good idea to be promoting something like this, but it's an interesteing idea. THere are allready a huge number of sites like this (including reef central, here on this forum, craig's list and ebay)... Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TROLL December 29, 2006 Author Share December 29, 2006 I'm surprised Dave know my other handle Anyway, all other sites doesn't really do percentage donation to conservation organizations etc. I don't care about profits, I just want one valid place for everyone to meet and trade instead of roaming all over the other sites and trying to get whatever you need without missing chance. Beside, most auction site are about profits, some do charity but not the right charity you would want to have your money going to, I.E. Breast Cancer Research etc. We seriously need to refocus on reef conservation especially today, it is starting to fade into background and we need to keep going because gobal warming, removing wild stock, and many more is having serious impacts on reef. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsaavedra December 30, 2006 Share December 30, 2006 Isn't the 1st post promoting a commercial enterprise? This is not a valid post under the regular members account , doesn't his account needs to be switched to a vendors account? I tought this was posted under the rules, why the proper steps haven't been taken to inform Mr Troll (Troy) of the violation and why the post hasn't been closed and removed until thr proper account switch has been made? We need to get on point and follow the rules mods. Sign of not doing so could be taken as favoritism by some members. Raf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbartco December 30, 2006 Share December 30, 2006 Isn't the 1st post promoting a commercial enterprise? This is not a valid post under the regular members account , doesn't his account needs to be switched to a vendors account? I tought this was posted under the rules, why the proper steps haven't been taken to inform Mr Troll (Troy) of the violation and why the post hasn't been closed and removed until thr proper account switch has been made? We need to get on point and follow the rules mods. Sign of not doing so could be taken as favoritism by some members. Raf Lost that holiday spirit quickly... 1. yes - warned 2. no need. vendor of what? "Wamas" has made no stand on the issue other than telling him that this is typically not a place for commercial promotion. We have given vendor access to those that have a symbiotic relationship with the club. We haven't made any judgements here. 3. because it is the holidays, and mine are not spent trolling (no pun intended) the boards to find someone who has tripped up and immediately ban them from the site. For what we know, he is a paid member, with eager ideas for conservation, that hasn't read through all the rules. He has paid, which is above the 99% of the general, bb members names that show up with promotion postings. Relax. Enough problems have been caused by immediate deletion of posts. Troy, if there is something you wish to bring up for club backing, please fee free to contact us at officers@wamas.org for discussion. And, if in light with clubs goals, we could go from there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gadgets December 30, 2006 Share December 30, 2006 I like the idea. In fact, I just registered on the site. You have my support. i love the idea about giving some profits to help reef conservation. Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason the filter freak December 30, 2006 Share December 30, 2006 I like the idea as well, but i definately can see what raff is talking about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smarsh97 December 30, 2006 Share December 30, 2006 I think it sounds cool. What better cause than reef conservation. I joined and as soon as I have something to auction I will. Sandy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dzekunoi December 30, 2006 Share December 30, 2006 Part goes to concervation, OK. How big part? And where does another part goes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDBDRZ December 30, 2006 Share December 30, 2006 What a way to welcome a new member. Man have these forums changed in the last couple years that I was away......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TROLL December 30, 2006 Author Share December 30, 2006 It's good to see commited reefers! Sadly, can't say the same for skeptical views but I cannot blame them because they're only acting on good behalf of which to defend the intregity of forum and site. I'm not a vendor, I wish I was because that'll mean I'll be making decent money. When I was growing up, I've always dream of making huge I mean, HUGE, difference in environmental cause. There is not so many people out that share the same feeling or thought for such cause. To clarify a few issue with the idea- I won't be making any actual profits. As of this time, the software I am using doesn't have feature of obtaining any fee of sort except I was able to revise the program a bit to accomdate the paypal donation to obtain the software update. After the software update, I'll be including fee, percentage to conservation and percentage to reef auction only to cover the site cost, bandwidth, hosting, and domain fee. If there is any problem with the site, please let me know and I'll be glad to answer more questions. Part goes to concervation, OK. How big part? And where does another part goes? Right now, I'm thinking about 20% to conservation and 80% to cover the site fee but will glady to revise percentage if too much money is left from site fee I may do standard 10% fee from each auction so means 2% from each auction goes to conservation and 8% to site. It's an idea that is still in work- First I need to evaluate and see how sale are going on site after new software is place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dzekunoi December 30, 2006 Share December 30, 2006 I think it's normal when people sceptical about potential scams. Altogether, I like your idea. And the site looks nice. I might be willing to use it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TROLL December 30, 2006 Author Share December 30, 2006 I think it's normal when people sceptical about potential scams. Altogether, I like your idea. And the site looks nice. I might be willing to use it Understood! There's too many scams out there floating and unfortunately, they're harming the very reputation of honest sites and hinder the growth of new sites. I've worked with many site, I'm a web designer on side business, they're having so much trouble clearing through due to scams, spammers, etc. Unlike 2-3 years ago, spammers, scammers, and more are spreading so fast, like hair algae in phosphate laced tank. Thanks for the compliment, I worked hard past week to revise the template that will sit comfortably with everyone and familar layout. The company that design the program never really give it several templates to choose from and site owners have to modify the template. Also, how do you like the color and picture? I think that is one of my favorite work ever since I started web designing 2 years ago. Troy, if there is something you wish to bring up for club backing, please fee free to contact us at officers@wamas.org for discussion. And, if in light with clubs goals, we could go from there. Sure thing! Matter of the fact, I only live 10 mins away from Dave and will gladly to discuss a few things over with him if in person conversation is necessary. I see him once in while and maybe will again next week or 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emissary December 30, 2006 Share December 30, 2006 What a way to welcome a new member. Man have these forums changed in the last couple years that I was away......... Sorry :( It's just Raf. He likes to incite the worst in people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YBeNormal December 30, 2006 Share December 30, 2006 (edited) Sorry :( It's just Raf. He likes to incite the worst in people. That statement was totally uncalled for IMHO. WAMAS is supposed to be a non-profit society and this board belongs to the members. Members have a right and an obligation to question things that they feel are innapropriate. Raf was only excercising his rights and doing so does not justify personal attacks against his character--especially from someone in your position. Edited December 30, 2006 by YBeNormal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TROLL December 30, 2006 Author Share December 30, 2006 (edited) Some people don't interpret others' comment the same as everyone so they all have different perspective. What Raf did was normal reaction to what he suspected to be a forum abuse especially with spammers hanging around the forum lately. He has all rights to voice out what may seems to be out of place but might should've exercise a bit more discreet such as PM'ing the moderator to inquiry first. I don't personally know Raf like Emissary do so I cannot justify his comment- I won't know for sure till I meet Raf for real and judge from there. Maybe it was a friendly head-up of who is who so I don't get mixed with wrong crowd.... Edited December 30, 2006 by TROLL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YBeNormal December 30, 2006 Share December 30, 2006 I should start by wishing you a belated "Welcome to WAMAS" Troll. Sorry about the skepticism you've encountered so far. We're generally a very friendly bunch but can get a little rough around the edges sometimes. Raf is definitely one of the more vocal members of the board when he feels that someone is being treated unfairly or rules are being broken. He's direct and to the point with his opinions and that tends to ruffle feathers sometimes. I'll admit that I have cringed a bit when reading some of his posts but I respect him for standing up for what he believes to be correct. He is one of the most friendly and most honest people I've met in a long time and is not someone I'd consider to be part of the "wrong crowd". Even if he were, I absolutely do not agree with personal attacks in public forums. I have not had a chance to check out your new site but will do so soon. Rather than saying that xx% of the fees go to costs and xx% go to conservation, why not state that this will be a not-for-profit effort and that all funds will go to (1) direct operating expenses and (2) non-profit conservation groups and efforts in that order? This (or something similar) inspires more confidence that the funds are being used only for the intended purpose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsaavedra December 30, 2006 Share December 30, 2006 (edited) Lost that holiday spirit quickly... 1. yes - warned 2. no need. vendor of what? "Wamas" has made no stand on the issue other than telling him that this is typically not a place for commercial promotion. We have given vendor access to those that have a symbiotic relationship with the club. We haven't made any judgements here. 3. because it is the holidays, and mine are not spent trolling (no pun intended) the boards to find someone who has tripped up and immediately ban them from the site. For what we know, he is a paid member, with eager ideas for conservation, that hasn't read through all the rules. He has paid, which is above the 99% of the general, bb members names that show up with promotion postings. Relax. Enough problems have been caused by immediate deletion of posts. Troy, if there is something you wish to bring up for club backing, please fee free to contact us at officers@wamas.org for discussion. And, if in light with clubs goals, we could go from there. Doug I haven't lost my holiday spirit! Is a commercial enterprise (there is a money exchanged for services even if Troy is acting as a middleman by providing the website he still facilitating the commercial tool that provides the service even if it's non-profit there still is money exchanged. Don't get me wrong I am fascinated with the auction idea and turning profits to conservation, it's awesome. Well Doug take it as trolling if that makes you happy but you know me, I am vocal and I don't hesitate to voice my opinions, as I have said times before is my opinion and if don't like it oh well, sorry if I hurt your feelings. What a way to welcome a new member. Man have these forums changed in the last couple years that I was away......... You are right, I should have said Welcome to the Club in the first sentence and then proceed with my comments. It's good to see commited reefers! Sadly, can't say the same for skeptical views but I cannot blame them because they're only acting on good behalf of which to defend the intregity of forum and site. I'm not a vendor, I wish I was because that'll mean I'll be making decent money. When I was growing up, I've always dream of making huge I mean, HUGE, difference in environmental cause. There is not so many people out that share the same feeling or thought for such cause. To clarify a few issue with the idea- I won't be making any actual profits. As of this time, the software I am using doesn't have feature of obtaining any fee of sort except I was able to revise the program a bit to accomdate the paypal donation to obtain the software update. After the software update, I'll be including fee, percentage to conservation and percentage to reef auction only to cover the site cost, bandwidth, hosting, and domain fee. If there is any problem with the site, please let me know and I'll be glad to answer more questions. Right now, I'm thinking about 20% to conservation and 80% to cover the site fee but will glady to revise percentage if too much money is left from site fee I may do standard 10% fee from each auction so means 2% from each auction goes to conservation and 8% to site. It's an idea that is still in work- First I need to evaluate and see how sale are going on site after new software is place. Troy I love the idea and the drive behind it, I think is awesome. I'm willing to join and be part of the effort, but could the individual seller change and determine how much they will like to donate to conservation for example instead of 8% to the site/2% to conservation I would like to do it for example 50% (45% to conservation and 5% to the site? I think it should determined by the individual user how much the would like to donate. Sorry :( It's just Raf. He likes to incite the worst in people. I don't why you are making such comments, you do the same in diferent ways at times. Edited December 30, 2006 by rsaavedra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TROLL December 30, 2006 Author Share December 30, 2006 (edited) Doug I haven't lost my holiday spirit! Is a commercial enterprise (there is a money exchanged for services even if Troy is acting as a middleman by providing the website he still facilitating the commercial tool that provides the service even if it's non-profit there still is money exchanged. Don't get me wrong I am fascinated with the auction idea and turning profits to conservation, it's awesome. I've been looking into commercial enterprise as may call it. I spoke with a bud who is in legal and he clearly stated that to be commercial enterprise or vendor, the person must first have business license or tex exempt. He said that my site still falls in personal website category until there are sufficent income that will validate one's site as business purpose. So far, my website is still personal in legal's eye and since it will be dedicated to assist conservation by donations- There's nothing wrong with owning a website and help others by raising funds that goes toward charities, organizations, societies, researches, etc. I've been discussing with one of WAMAS officer and he has expressed the interest of converting my membership to vendor but this is an idea still in work. There was no in detail information that might define my site as actual vendor. I'm still considering the possibility but nothing in place yet. Well Doug take it as trolling if that makes you happy but you know me, I am vocal and I don't hesitate to voice my opinions, as I have said times before is my opinion and if don't like it oh well, sorry if I hurt your feelings.You are right, I should have said Welcome to the Club in the first sentence and then proceed with my comments. Lol, now- I know you're a man with teeth Just hopefully your bark is worse than your bite. Troy I love the idea and the drive behind it, I think is awesome. I'm willing to join and be part of the effort, but could the individual seller change and determine how much they will like to donate to conservation for example instead of 8% to the site/2% to conservation I would like to do it for example 50% (45% to conservation and 5% to the site? I think it should determined by the individual user how much the would like to donate.I don't why you are making such comments, you do the same in diferent ways at times. Frankly, that is a very good idea! However, the problematic nature behind the percents are: 1. All auction will have seller fee of 10% not the bidders, that is to protect the bidders' interest in auction due to the fact it is the sellers that sell the items not the bidder. Also, it will prevent the sellers from using wide known exploit by registering several names and forcefully increase the bid and entrap the bidders which in effect, is at no cost of the seller and their action. 2. Why 10%? It is pretty fair and common rate among auctions on the site and in real world. Consider this, if auction ends at $10, that means the fee is $1 for the sale which covers all cost such as picture, featured listing, etc whatever might seem appropiate. There might be a small fee to cover the pictures- that is to cover the bandwidth cost. 3. Why not any higher than 10% due to members' perference? Unfortunately, the programming does not allow that due to possible exploitation where the people working for site may adjust the percent fee for individual. This just open so many issues involving favorism and malices aganist specific sellers. 50% could be good but it isn't favorable to the seller, I.E. if his/her coral (rare orange zoo) or that butt-ugly tang (Sorry, just love Dave's comment!) sold for $1,000 and he/she will have to pay $500 and that is just way too much cut. Not everyone will want to lose that much money just to donate, 10% is much more reasonable and easily manage. 4. If members are interested in donating more beyond the standard 10%, he/she is free to do so. I will see about what I can do to revise the programming to allow such option as long as it doesn't interfere with fee. Maybe I'll have dedicated pages added to the site where person can go and place desired donation as they may deem fit. I should start by wishing you a belated "Welcome to WAMAS" Troll. Sorry about the skepticism you've encountered so far. We're generally a very friendly bunch but can get a little rough around the edges sometimes. Heh, sounds like normal MD/DC crowd to me I've grown up around this Tri-State area, I'm from Delaware myself and moved to MD recently. Nevertheless, still interesting bunch of crowd. Thank for welcome! I actually signed up for WAMAS last summer but somehow I lost the access to forum by either forgot my original user name or due to forum maintainence. I have not had a chance to check out your new site but will do so soon. Rather than saying that xx% of the fees go to costs and xx% go to conservation, why not state that this will be a not-for-profit effort and that all funds will go to (1) direct operating expenses and (2) non-profit conservation groups and efforts in that order? This (or something similar) inspires more confidence that the funds are being used only for the intended purpose. Yes, that is what I should've said however, that triggers some questions from potential members- main question will be, how much? Without stating the amount, it can be only a few cents per month and the site takes in rest of fee. I believe honesty is the best policy so everyone deserve to know what is going on with fee rather than paying for fee without knowing where those money goes to. Edited December 30, 2006 by TROLL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDBDRZ December 30, 2006 Share December 30, 2006 (edited) You are right, I should have said Welcome to the Club in the first sentence and then proceed with my comments. I think people need to remember that this is a hobby and a source of enjoyment. You assume that this wasnt addressed by an officer. I leave it up to the officers to deal with the appropriate handling of his website but keep in mind that by your definition of commercial enterprise a number of the people who sell frags on this site should probably be consider vendors. There is entirely too much posturing and petty bickering on this site. Its no wonder none of the old time club members participate anymore. Some of you need to learn to step away from the keyboard once in a while instead of typing. Edited December 30, 2006 by SDBDRZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason the filter freak December 30, 2006 Share December 30, 2006 (edited) Comment retracted, why not have a vote? Edited December 30, 2006 by jason the filter freak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TROLL December 30, 2006 Author Share December 30, 2006 Keep in mind that by your definition of commercial enterprise a number of the people who sell frags on this site should probably be consider vendors. WELL SAID! I've met number of people that sells frags for life and looks very much like vendors!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason the filter freak December 31, 2006 Share December 31, 2006 reminds me of an olnd thread something about... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TROLL December 31, 2006 Author Share December 31, 2006 reminds me of an olnd thread something about... No wonder why I'm always hungry! Actually, my handle is from my real nickname that was given before internet was born so... It has no relation to any of mythology character, tho. Long story behind the nickname, really. There was no way I could prevent people from using the term especially in negative way. Why can't they call it Bob or something else!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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