I am defeated

[flowerseller]

I figured there mght be another link based upon some of the way people mentioned things.

I might have thought more about nitrate spike or PH drop issue than ammonia with disturbing/mixing up an established sand bed. Maybe even more parasitic issues.

I gently twist portions of my sand bed ( more to prevent caking/binding) periodically so it may not be an issue for my 15+yld sand.

 

If the rock, like the tank, was out of water there will be deffinate die off of bacteria during the move since the rock is exposed to air. That's what I believe would be more the culprit to the ammonia spike.

 

Fishwish:

My water if free and you might want the fresh exchanged water since it's aged but clean.

I run 40w of UV 24/7 therefore the aged water is generally crystal clear as a result.

I'll have 10g in an hour and can exchange more if desired.

[traveller7]

I don't know what type of ballasts (am not at home to look). The blubs are 250W AB double ended. I went to Wally's and Roozen's (after calling) and neither had them. (I didn't know enough then to ask for double ended when I called). Marine Scene has them but I can't get out there in time. Am going there tomorrow lunch and will also get water.

Your tank will be fine a few days/week without the 250's.

 

Check out some of the pictures here to see what colors you like and get some feedback:

 

http://www.cnidarianreef.com/lamps.cfm

 

Again you have some time, get some feed back on the types of critters you want to keep, the ballasts you have, etc., before spending your money. Bulbs make a difference in how your tank looks and how your critters grow

[Guest fishwish]

Your tank will be fine a few days/week without the 250's.

 

Check out some of the pictures here to see what colors you like and get some feedback:

 

http://www.cnidarianreef.com/lamps.cfm

 

Again you have some time, get some feed back on the types of critters you want to keep, the ballasts you have, etc., before spending your money. Bulbs make a difference in how your tank looks and how your critters grow

 

Great advice. Thought I had to get the lights immediately -- ouch! expensive $90 each! -- and didn't know I had a choice. Don't even know what type of lighting I have. All I know at this point is that I have double ended 250 watt bulbs. Everything is happening too fast. Good to know I don't have to address this today. Almost everything is dead now... only a few mushrooms left anyway.

 

Cleaning out the disintegrating stuff this AM. Should I cut off only the gross stuff or rip the whole thing out? I have about 4 very large softies that parts of are dissolving. Will never get the ammonia under control with the rotting stuff in there. Can any parts be saved or do I rip them totally off the rock? Gross.

[flowerseller]

Everything is happening too fast

It's going to get faster as the ammonia builds up.

You need to help nuetralize it.

 

GET SOME "CYCLE"!

[Guest fishwish]

It's going to get faster as the ammonia builds up.

You need to help nuetralize it.

 

GET SOME "CYCLE"!

 

I added Cycle and Prime (like Amquel but better according to LFS) yesterday. TX!

[Guest fishwish]

-You can install a 3 way "T" pipe connector under the sink by turning off the water valve and removing the the Cold Water Line and connecting back up to 3way with one end screwed with Plumbers White Tape on threads to Shutoff Valve, opposite end to Steel Hose to Cold Water Faucet and 3rd middle end to a shutoff valve with John Getz Fitting on end going to RO/DI. I'll do my best to stop in this week to help you with this procedure, but after I show you, will see it's very simple to do! EVERYONE should have this type of connection to RO/DI unit, NO SADDLE VALVES NEEDED!

 

OMG, that sounds great and simple! Wish I had known that.

 

Good news, thanks to advice from a member, I have a temp fix to my RO/DI installation problem. I simply tightened the nut on the saddle handle and now it doesn't spew water anymore!! Still drips a bit from the bottom connection, but it drips slowly and I put a bowl under it. Think I can stop drip with silicon tape. Am now getting 2.5 gal/hour of good water!! WOO HOO!!

 

Thanks to everyone who offered water and plumbing fixes!!!!

 

Lesson learned: Do NOT start this hobby without getting RO/DI installed FIRST and building up a good reserve of water. It is simply too hard to frantically run around the metropolitan area buying, borrowing and hauling water. I started this venture with 35g new (aged) saltwater and moved 70gal of the original tank water and thought I'd be fine. Not! Error #1.

 

Questions re water:

 

How much in reserve is recommended? fresh? saltwater?

 

Do you keep it in your garage? Outside? Is algae in the reserve a problem?

 

What do you keep reserves in? I saw that many use 35/45g trash cans. Also saw a post for a rain barrel.

 

Do you keep it heated? In motion? Or only before use?

 

How long do you age your water before use?

 

Thanks!

 

Ellen

[steveoutlaw]

I keep a 20g trashcan full of RODI for mixing, and I have a 5g bucket with a float valve on it for my auto top off. When making new salt water you want to let it sit for a minimum of 24 hours before introducing it to the tank. I only use a heater for the saltwater I'm actively mixing and I keep a powerhead going constantly when mixing.

 

the only way I would keep it in the garage is if you have a good top for it to keep dust and dirt out.

[rocko918]

for me i have a 30 gallon rubbermaid tub, keep RO water in there with a heater and 2 powerheads. 1 powerhead pointing at the surface. I try and keep the water the same temp as the tank. I have a top on the tub but not sealed.

When i need saltwater i mix and let it sit with a powerhead in it. I usally do not have saltwater sitting around unless i know or plan on doing a water change.

[dhoch]

I typically have between 5 and 20 gallons of RO water (1 5 for top off, 2 5 for saltwater changes, and 1 5 as a resivoir)... that are various stages of filling.

 

I typically don't mix the saltwater till the day before I'm going to do a water change.

 

Dave

[Guest fishwish]

I figured there mght be another link based upon some of the way people mentioned things.

I might have thought more about nitrate spike or PH drop issue than ammonia with disturbing/mixing up an established sand bed. Maybe even more parasitic issues.

I gently twist portions of my sand bed ( more to prevent caking/binding) periodically so it may not be an issue for my 15+yld sand.

 

If the rock, like the tank, was out of water there will be deffinate die off of bacteria during the move since the rock is exposed to air. That's what I believe would be more the culprit to the ammonia spike.

 

None of the rock, sand or livestock were exposed to air for any longer than it took to take them out of the tank and plop them in a 5g bucket or 3 20g rubbermaid containers. I asked the seller prior to the move if he could keep the livestock in another of his tanks until I got the tank set up and stablized in a few days. On Friday late morning, he put them in a 50g w/ the original saltwater, with a heater and floresent hood. No water movement, powerhead or airstone -- was this a problem?

 

The live rock with more live stuff (mushrooms, etc.) were put in Rubbermaid box with the original water -- no powerhead or airstone or light. The fish in the 50g were all dead by 8 am the next morning before moving. I moved the base rock and then the sand on Sat . Tank very cloudy. Had to go ahead and blindly put the coral live rock in anyway. The Rubbermaid water w/ the more live rock looked good and so did the mushrooms, but I probably crushed some because I couldn't see where I was placing them. The water in the 50g was smelly by time I moved them. I didn't know what was alive or dead and neither did the seller. I put them in the cloudy water on Sunday without the smelly water, and the tank instantly looked even worse. I think the problem was that the move took too long, there was no water movement in the holding tank, I put dead stuff in ... and then there's the sand?

 

What's confusing to me is that coral and fish are shipped for days with no heat, light or movement and they survive. What did I do wrong besides not moving fast enough?? Or did I move too fast and should have waited for the water to clear? But then the stuff was dying in the holding tank.

[dhoch]

No water movement, powerhead or airstone -- was this a problem?

 

That killed them guaranteed .... they all suffocated (no air because not air exchange from water movement)

 

Yes fish & corals do survive for a couple of days in bags, but typically they have O2 pumped into the bag before shipping, so they do not suffocate.

 

Dave

[flowerseller]

That killed them guaranteed .... they all suffocated (no air because not air exchange from water movement)

 

Yes fish & corals do survive for a couple of days in bags, but typically they have O2 pumped into the bag before shipping, so they do not suffocate.

 

Exactly.

That's too bad. The seller should have know better.

[HowardofNOVA]

Now that sucks!

I would have a short conversation with the seller...

 

.....probably between swings of the ball bat! :wink:

 

 

 

I'm going to try and put a simple DIY on water hook ups! Look for it soon!

[Guest fishwish]

That killed them guaranteed .... they all suffocated (no air because not air exchange from water movement)

 

Yes fish & corals do survive for a couple of days in bags, but typically they have O2 pumped into the bag before shipping, so they do not suffocate.

 

Dave

well, there you go. Makes me sick. All the death, effort and expense could have easily been avoided. There was a powerhead sitting right next to the tank.

[Guest fishwish]

Now that sucks!

I would have a short conversation with the seller...

 

.....probably between swings of the ball bat! :wink:

Am very, very upset. But then it was ultimately my responsibility. I did keep questioning him about why things were going wrong. I can't believe I didn't catch it. If I had been there I would have recognized the need for O2 (gasping at surface). But, oh well. What's done is done. Nothing to do now but regroup, get organized and rebuild.

 

Thanks to everyone for their support and help.

 

 

 

I'm going to try and put a simple DIY on water hook ups! Look for it soon!

Saw it... excellent post!!

[HowardofNOVA]

Excellent,

Now pull up your boot straps, take a deep breath and let see if we can get you back on track and having FUN again ASAP ok?

[SteveD]

Fishwish,

You're not alone. I encourage you to keep at it, but remember mistakes will happen. That's part of the learning process. Some mistakes will be more depressing/expensive than others.

 

I'm in the process of setting up a 90 gallon AGA. To sum up my story...I bought a complete 75 gallon used setup minus the livestock for $1200. It included lights, protein skimmer, sump, return pump, wavemaker, RO/DI and basically everything else the guy had.

 

That was in March. I ended up throwing away the 75G tank because the plumbing was cemented in place and was leaking. It was also convient excuse to upgrade to a 90 . The CF lighting was crap and making a lot of noise so I ended up paying around $600 for T5 lighting. I've also blown money on plumbing parts I ended up not using.

 

I've lost a lot of money, but I've also learned a lot. You just need to go slow. I started in March and all I've got in my tank is liverock and sand. Sadly, I still stare at the tank for several hours a day.

 

Your perseverance will be rewarded.

[Guest fishwish]

Fishwish,

You're not alone.

 

I started in March and all I've got in my tank is liverock and sand. Sadly, I still stare at the tank for several hours a day.

 

 

 

Thanks for sharing and for your encouragement! Its good to hear your story and know I'm not alone. I stare too... mostly at dead and rotting stuff at this point. Must be an addiction. ReefFreak, let's hope there's in our future!

[Caribbean Jake]

Glad to hear you have the courage to continue. I have had two big ones this year that have put me over the edge of quiting, but this group is the best there is, and encouragement comes in every way and form, both positive and no so positive... after all, when is cold outside and we can not play a round of golf.. what else will I be doing? putting up christmas lights?,,... no way... reefing...

[emissary]

Thanks for sharing and for your encouragement! Its good to hear your story and know I'm not alone. I stare too... mostly at dead and rotting stuff at this point. Must be an addiction. ReefFreak, let's hope there's in our future!

 

I'm sure there will be. It's a sad story to hear, but not altogether surprising or new. I bought a used 75 from someone way back when. Tank, stand, small sump, canopy, normal output lighting, crappy skimmer. I didn't know plumbing from the holes in my socks. Didn't use RO. It was problem after problem. I was killing so many things left and right it was awful. Fortunately I didn't have the $$$ to buy that many things left and right. As I started to learn I upgraded lighting, bought an RO filter and suddenly things started to come under control. Gradually I figured out all the things I was doing wrong. At the time, I didn't have WAMAS. My biggest mistake.

[rsaavedra]

fishwish don't quit! Quick story:

 

I've been a Reef Addict for 7 years or so, little that I know thinking it would be easier on 1st shot I set up a 1G pico, then 6 months later upgraded to a 5G, 1 year later upgraded to a 10G, about 1 year later upgraded to a 15G High, 1.5 years upgraded to a 20G Long, about 2 years later upgraded to a 24G that cracked and hopped to a 46G BF to save the livestock. So you see it happens once or twice to everyone NO EXEPTIONS!

 

 

Thanks,

 

Raf

 

Quic Pic Chronicle:

 

24G that cracked:

 

Emergency move to the 46G

 

Corals and Survivors

 

Live Rock Rubble for Refugium/Sump

 

The DarkSide of the tank with no lights

 

New Pictures with new lights installed and finally got off my rear and did some aquascaping.

5X39W T5's, all Bulbs are Geissman; Back 2 Front:

Pure Actinics

AquaBlue +

Sun 6500K

AquaBlue +

Pure Actinics

 

All the lights on

 

Only Pure Actinics on

 

New Full Tank Shot as of today!

 

 

My Bicolor Angel with my favorite coral (blue maze brain)

 

 

Another picture of my Bicolor Angel with some zoanthids

 

 

My maroon yellow stripe clown

 

 

My firefish pair

 

 

Marcey's Clavularia (Sea in the City). Well here is a pic of my neon green center Clove Polyps

 

[Guest fishwish]

Raf --

 

Beautiful tank!!!!!!!!!!!! I want mine to look like that!!

 

There's hope.... this AM when checking on the tank, I was amased to see the blue damsel that had hichiked over to my tank in LR is ALIVE!! Amazing. Hadn't seen it since putting in the tank. I don't undertand how... still have ammonia, though level getting better. This is an inspiration ... more water changes!

[dhoch]

Ahhhh there is life....

 

Those damsels are just about indistructable....

 

Keep with the water changes (if you are still doing them)... probably want to get the little guy some food too...

 

Dave

[Guest fishwish]

 

Keep with the water changes (if you are still doing them)... probably want to get the little guy some food too...

 

Dave

 

Yippie!

 

Am still doing water changes. Was just going to ask if I could feed the poor little guy. He's getting dinner!

[dhoch]

Don't over feed him (you've got enough problems with out adding to it by adding too much food)... give him a little bit at a time (as to what... he'll eat just about anything frozen to flake to pellets)...

 

Dave