GraffitiSpotCorals November 15, 2013 Share November 15, 2013 Tips? Which method are you using? How long have you been doing it? I am about to start my first batch and I figured I would reach out since it involves really NASTY chemicals! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sen5241b November 15, 2013 Share November 15, 2013 I admit I do not know much about this but I wonder if its worth the time and trouble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraffitiSpotCorals November 15, 2013 Author Share November 15, 2013 Well for the small amount of time I definatly think its worth it if you can get 5 more turns with the same stuff before it goes, heck one or two would still be worth it. I have talked to one or two people brefley about it but I would like to know more about the rinsing process/how much flow to use. I have a huge reactor (24" by 6") so I can just use a mag pump and regenerate maybe 5 pounds worth. Also wondering if one or the other (lye or muratic acid) is easier/works better. I imagine there has to be a difference in how long or how many rounds of regeneration you can get out of the gfo between the two? I have never used lye for anything but I have used muratic acid for a few things, and I know it will eat some stuff up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBL November 15, 2013 Share November 15, 2013 I didn't know GFO could be regenerated, I will be following... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami November 15, 2013 Share November 15, 2013 I didn't know GFO could be regenerated, I will be following... http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2010/10/chemistry I've never regenerated GFO but have used both chemicals in working with trying to regenerate DI resin. Get the Muriatic acid at Lowes - the cheap stuff with the blue label made by Crown; and the lye (NaOH) at Tractor Supply - it's got a mostly yellow label and I think it's made by Roebic and is called Crystal Drain Opener. It's pure NaOH (sodium hydroxide crystals). The acid wash is first, I believe, and is used to dissolve any calcium carbonate that may have precipitated on the outside of the GFO. The lye is used to basically rip off the adsorbed phosphate from the GFO surface. The muriatic is easy enough to work with as long as you a) don't breath the fumes and b) remember to add acid to water (A==>W). Lye gives off a lot of heat when you mix it with water, so you're going to want to put the container in an ice bath to help keep it cool. Also, lye can be pretty hard on a lot of plastics - slowly dissolving some and splitting the container at the most inopportune time. So, if you can do this all in a large glass jar then all the better. Otherwise, I think that HDPE (the stuff milk jugs are made from) work, too. Plastic coke bottles do not. I'd also advise rinsing the GFO with water between the acid and base (lye) washes just to further dilute the acid before neutralizing with the base. It's not critical, but you'll get better performance out of the lye. At the end, give the GFO a really good rinse to wash out all of the lye. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraffitiSpotCorals November 16, 2013 Author Share November 16, 2013 Wow thanks man, I am not sure how I missed that article! Questions answered. Weird how the people I talked to only used one or the other for the bath and then just rinsed. You always seem to have the answers to my questions, thank you! I will update after I do my first run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraffitiSpotCorals November 16, 2013 Author Share November 16, 2013 I am having trouble finding the right "drain opener" stuff. It's all crystals and not powder. Anyone know where I can go locally to get what I need? I don't want to order bulk online if I don't like the process or the results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami November 16, 2013 Share November 16, 2013 Crystals are fine, Paul. It dissolves and that's all you need it to do. Go to Tractor Supply Company (there's one near the Walmart in Manassas) and find it there. It's made by Roebic and comes in a white bottle with a mostly yellow label on it (with a red border) - called Crystal Drain Opener. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraffitiSpotCorals November 16, 2013 Author Share November 16, 2013 Cool, thanks Tom I owe you one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainRon November 16, 2013 Share November 16, 2013 I want to say I rememeber overklok saying he was doing this too. Maybe shoot him a pm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraffitiSpotCorals November 16, 2013 Author Share November 16, 2013 Yea he is one of the guys I talked to. I found the 100% lye at he rice if anyone is following. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraffitiSpotCorals November 16, 2013 Author Share November 16, 2013 JE Rice in manassas that is... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami November 16, 2013 Share November 16, 2013 Yea he is one of the guys I talked to. I found the 100% lye at he rice if anyone is following. JE Rice in manassas that is... I was wondering about that.... Was it Crystal Drain Opener or another brand? How much for a bottle of the stuff? I think that I paid something like $14 for a couple pounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraffitiSpotCorals November 16, 2013 Author Share November 16, 2013 One pound Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmerek2 November 17, 2013 Share November 17, 2013 Is that $3.79 each? that sounds more cost effective. At $7 I think Ill just work the extra hour of overtime at work to pay for good fresh and safe material. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami November 17, 2013 Share November 17, 2013 That's a great price, Paul. Thanks for finding another source at half the cost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraffitiSpotCorals November 17, 2013 Author Share November 17, 2013 Yea I was very surprised it was so cheap, I am going to start the process tonight and take pics and such. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraffitiSpotCorals November 23, 2013 Author Share November 23, 2013 I am confused, I have a bunch of gfo. It says per 500ml of gfo use X amount of A. How do I tell how much 500ml of gfo weights? The conversions online are confusing me this early... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraffitiSpotCorals November 23, 2013 Author Share November 23, 2013 I think that 500ml of gfo is about .75 pounds? I guess it doesn't have to be exact anyways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainRon November 23, 2013 Share November 23, 2013 500 ml = ~2.1 cups. That should be a little easier to measure. Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraffitiSpotCorals November 23, 2013 Author Share November 23, 2013 Thank you! I am past the muratic acid stage. Didn't bubble too much probly because my phosphate meter was reading wrong half the time and I would pull it early thinking it was exausted. Check your batteries everyone, just because it says check, and still works, doesn't mean it's reading correct! Tomorrow I will be starting the lye flush. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grav November 25, 2013 Share November 25, 2013 Good luck, I've never done it either and would be curious to hear how it goes and if the renewed product is as effective as the 1st time. We use GFO in bulk but we mix it with activated carbon. Unless someone knows a trick, it is too much work to separate them from each other. We also use (and sell) a GFO substitute that pound for pound can remove more Po4. It is a little more expensive than GFO but it can be regenerated several times using hyper salinity saltwater (synthetic salt mix and RO/DI.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraffitiSpotCorals November 25, 2013 Author Share November 25, 2013 I tested the reactor setup with the gfo in it, just to check for leaks and make sure the gfo moved well in the reactor. It did very well. 5 pounds with a mag five, will have to dial it back a bit because I got a lot of fines, which were probly made from me stirring the gfo in a bucket with the muratic acid. The top of the reactor leaked some where the gasket sits, not sure if it was because it was cold or what but I need to play with it a bit. I hope I don't need a new top because I can see the gasket where the keyholes sit and that could be the cause. I may need a top with just holes and not keyholes. Here is the muratic acid bubbling the gfo in the bucket. Here is the setup just about to test for leaks. All the gfo moved very well with my homemade reactor and mag 5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraffitiSpotCorals November 25, 2013 Author Share November 25, 2013 Unfortunately the advanced aquarist site was not working yesterday so I never to to actually start the lie process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraffitiSpotCorals November 25, 2013 Author Share November 25, 2013 Good luck, I've never done it either and would be curious to hear how it goes and if the renewed product is as effective as the 1st time. We use GFO in bulk but we mix it with activated carbon. Unless someone knows a trick, it is too much work to separate them from each other. We also use (and sell) a GFO substitute that pound for pound can remove more Po4. It is a little more expensive than GFO but it can be regenerated several times using hyper salinity saltwater (synthetic salt mix and RO/DI.) As I have read most people get about five runs of regeneration, I think thats pretty good, depending on how much loss from the surface area being dissolved. If I were running a buisness I would separate the carbon and gfo, for one so the carbon doesn't tumble and two so you can do what I am doing and save near 5 times the amount on gfo. Which product are you talking about regenerating with saltwater? What I remember reading is you can use that method to an extent with any gfo but its not very effective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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