zygote2k October 17, 2011 October 17, 2011 A client dosed his tank full of tangs with both of these meds on friday morning to treat what appeared to be parasites. 4 hours later, all fish had died except an angel and 2 tomato clowns. $1000 worth of tangs down the drain. When I arrived this morning to do a massive w/c, I read the Cupramine bottle and it clearly states, "Do not use with any other medication". The client had heard that Copper and Prazi could be used together and figured Cupramine was close enough to copper and dosed. Sean had told me in the past why these 2 meds shouldn't be mixed, but I can't remember what the reason was. Can someone please explain this for me?
Coral Hind October 17, 2011 October 17, 2011 From what I have read, the prazi breaks down the cupramine into an ionic state which is very toxic. (from the Seachem website): Q: I've been dosing with Cupramine and then I added Product X and everything died. What happened? A: If Product X is a reducing agent such as ParaGuard (or other aldehyde based medications), or if you overdose with a dechlorinator, such as Prime then the Cu+2 will be reduced to Cu+. Cu+ is 10 times more toxic than Cu+2. I have also read that UV units can do the same thing so make sure they are turned off.
Jan October 17, 2011 October 17, 2011 I had no problem with Copper safe and pure prazi. Prazi pro was a problem, I was told. As a matter of fact I have a tank set up right now with both. Fish are doing fine.
Coral Hind October 17, 2011 October 17, 2011 Yes, Coppersafe seems fine. The Cupramine formula is different as it has an organic complex added which keeps it fully charged at Cu2+.
F&Fmgr October 18, 2011 October 18, 2011 Cupr(amine) is chelated to an amino acid, where as coppersafe and others similiar to it are much more stable as they have a stronger bond that 1.does NOT breakdown nearly as quickly, and 2. is NOt affected by declor. The other thing is, i have had nothing but negative experiences with the prazipro as it seems to me that the sequestering agent is marginally toxic to fishies. if youre gonna use both then use coppersafe or copper power and pure unsequestered Praziquantel. I use grain vodka to mix with the prazi, which as everybody knows vodka breaks down into carbon rather quickly. I should not the everyone who deals with these meds say that Pure prazi is not toxic and is extremelty hard to over dose.
Coral Hind October 18, 2011 October 18, 2011 Sean, Prazi seems to only last in the system for about 3 to 4 days so if you dosed it first and then followed it with the copper treatment, wouldn't that be a safer option?
Chad October 18, 2011 October 18, 2011 ^hopefully not off topic, but something I have wondered about with the Prazi is what is the disposal path for it to only last in the system for a few days?
F&Fmgr October 18, 2011 October 18, 2011 Sean, Prazi seems to only last in the system for about 3 to 4 days so if you dosed it first and then followed it with the copper treatment, wouldn't that be a safer option? yeah it would be, but its not the prazi+CU that causes the toxicity, its the sequestering agent they use in "prqazi pro". ive used up to 4 times the amount of prazi that is in PraziPro's regular dose with no ill effects. try and double down on prazipro and your fish will die. if your going to use copper, and there is even a remote chance you would have to use and antibiotic or dewormer/delouser like prazi, do yourself a favor and use coppersafe or copper power.
Coral Hind October 18, 2011 October 18, 2011 There seems to be some bad info out there on the Net about using Cupramine/Prazi. I just saw on WWM that they are fine together. I disagree with that advice. http://www.wetwebmed...rmifugefaqs.htm
F&Fmgr October 18, 2011 October 18, 2011 I really like seachem, but cupramine sucks. copper power is my favorite. prazipro is really wierd, i have obtained much better results with pure prazi sequestered with grain vodka. eazy peazy
F&Fmgr October 19, 2011 October 19, 2011 Sean, thanks for all the valuable info!! how did the Prazi work for you? positive results yet?
Coral Hind October 19, 2011 October 19, 2011 It worked perfectly, no loses. I have a dedicated 100g rubbermaid tub for QT. I used to do the prazipond in it and then the coppersafe seperately after that but this is the first time I have run both prazi and copper together.
F&Fmgr October 19, 2011 October 19, 2011 It worked perfectly, no loses. I have a dedicated 100g rubbermaid tub for QT. I used to do the prazipond in it and then the coppersafe seperately after that but this is the first time I have run both prazi and copper together. NICE
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