Prime's 75 gallon build

[Integral9]

black silicon, oh yeah. Somehow, I forgot about that stuff. That would look better.

 

Use a fine tooth blade to cut the plastic, like one for cutting metal. A larger toothed blade, like one meant for cutting wood will probably crack the box and ruin it. I personally don't like the table saw for this. Generally table saws are for ripping boards, not fine cuts, so they have large toothed blades and changing the blades is a pita. So if you try to cut the whole back off, then I think you stand a good chance of over cutting the box and cutting a portion of the bottom of the box off. I'd use a router or dremel tool or a hand saw and just cut the box above the hole so you can slide the bulk head in.

[hypertech]

You guys must have really crappy table saws. Changing the blade on mine takes 30 seconds or less. I use an 80 tooth blade like you would use for finishing work not ripping plywood. Works great.

[.OptimusPrime.]

Went to graingers for the black stuff. They were out so ill be picking up a tube tomorrow.

 

Cut the whole clear side off. I think it went rather smoothly. I will post pictures later.

 

Apparently there was a storm around 2pm today and my neighborhood does not have power.

 

I have a generator but i was looking for a battery powered pack for small issues like this where the power is out only temporarily( a few hours vs days) so i dont have to go through the trouble of getting extension cords and starting the generator.

 

My neighborhood is highly prone to mild to extensive outages no matter what kind of weather we have.

 

Are there any options outside the ecotech pak?

Edited September 29, 2011 by .OptimusPrime.

[Integral9]

Somewhere in the DIY section here or on RC there is a guide on how to make your own UPS from a deep cycle marine battery and a few other parts. Given your power issues, you might want to consider that.

 

Alternatively, you can use a UPS for a computer, but if you go that route, my advice is to get the biggest one you can. Just keep in mind that a SOHO (Small Office, Home Office) computer UPS is really only designed to give the computer enough time to shutdown cleanly, not keep it running.

 

At some point though, a generator is probably more cost effective. You just have to be there to turn it on.

[.OptimusPrime.]

As promised:

 

 

Not too shabby. Will hopefully silicone in tomorrow after work when I stop by graingers.

 

Side note: into looking into controllers, Ive settle on a Neptune.

 

Is the full kit the way to go just because it offers expansion? or would I be ok with the Lite version?

 

Also, is my understanding correct in that I would not need a hydrometer if I get the controller with the salinity probe module??

[hypertech]

That's a ton of money to spend to check your salinity. Just get a refractometer. BRS sells them with calibration fluid at a good price and there is a group buy next week.

 

If you plan on running a ca reactor or something that needs the variable outputs (pumps lights) then get the full apex. Otherwise the light is fine. Other than the ports and one probe instead of two they are the exact same.

[.OptimusPrime.]

That's a ton of money to spend to check your salinity. Just get a refractometer. BRS sells them with calibration fluid at a good price and there is a group buy next week.

 

If you plan on running a ca reactor or something that needs the variable outputs (pumps lights) then get the full apex. Otherwise the light is fine. Other than the ports and one probe instead of two they are the exact same.

 

Well it wouldn't only be for the salinity probe. It would be for the ph/lights/temp/powerheads/ATO/heaters. Would the Lite still be sufficient for those? I have a refractometer from BRS, sorry shouldn't have said hydrometer, just thought it'd be nice to have it with the APEX. but I guess I can manage without the sal. probe.

 

Is the Variable/Dimming module only for LED lights?

 

Does the Lite have PM1 already on the system all I would need to do is buy the pH probe separate?

 

 

 

 

[hypertech]

The light has a single probe built into the unit. The full has 2 so you can do ph and orp or two ph. There really isn't a need for two probes unless you are running something like a calcium reactor or ozone.

 

The variable outputs can be used to control variable speed pumps (like tunze 6055s) or to control a dimmer on lights.

[hypertech]

The light has a single probe built into the unit. The full has 2 so you can do ph and orp or two ph. There really isn't a need for two probes unless you are running something like a calcium reactor or ozone.

 

The variable outputs can be used to control variable speed pumps (like tunze 6055s) or to control a dimmer on lights.

 

Almost missed it.

 

The lite has the plug but does not come with the probe. BRS sells them cheap. My BRS probe seems to need recalibrating a little more often than my Neptune probe but otherwise works fine.

Edited September 30, 2011 by hypertech

[.OptimusPrime.]

So the lite comes with the temp function and probe.

 

It has the function to do ph out the of box but id need to buy the probe separate.

 

Sorry for all the questions. Just trying to make sense of it all.

[hypertech]

Yes. It comes with the temp probe and can do ph monitoring/control if you add a ph probe.

 

BRS probes are cheap and work though the Neptune probes do seem to be a little better.

Edited September 30, 2011 by hypertech

[.OptimusPrime.]

Yes. It comes with the temp probe and can do ph monitoring/control if you add a ph probe.

 

BRS probes are cheap and work though the Neptune probes do seem to be a little better.

 

Thanks for the help. Looks like the Apex Lite it is.

 

I picked the black silicone from Grainger this morning, so once I get home from work I'll silicone the box in. And move onto piping this bad boy.

 

Bulkheads are threaded so can I just go to HD and buy the regular slip pipe sched. 40 and just glue it in? or do I need to buy threaded. or is there some kind of adapter that makes it go from thread to slip?

[hypertech]

If they are threaded, then you need a fitting. They have them at hd.

[.OptimusPrime.]

Thanks I will look into it when I go shopping for pipe.

 

What options do I have in terms of the drain? Would a durso work best? Could I use something like the gurgle buster? I would like it to be as quiet as possible since this is set up in the bedroom.

 

Some setups seem to have a valve on the drain, but ive heard thats a big no no.

[hypertech]

Both of those drains can be quiet, but sometimes they aren't. Go with a Herbie and you are basically guaranteed it will be quiet. To do that, you use both as drain lines and go over the back with the return. You put a gate valve on one drain. I do have a 1" gate valve I cut out of my system when I thought it had failed, but it turned out to be something else. Don't use the gate valve at Home Depot. You want one like BRS sells that's all plastic.

[.OptimusPrime.]

Both of those drains can be quiet, but sometimes they aren't. Go with a Herbie and you are basically guaranteed it will be quiet. To do that, you use both as drain lines and go over the back with the return. You put a gate valve on one drain. I do have a 1" gate valve I cut out of my system when I thought it had failed, but it turned out to be something else. Don't use the gate valve at Home Depot. You want one like BRS sells that's all plastic.

 

I thought about the herbie, but that requires me to drill another hole for the second drain. Also, you mention going over the back. Already drilled for bulkhead returns inside the tank.

 

the bean style would require me to do a coast to coast and drill more. something i really dont want to do.

 

 

Are the durso and the gurgle my only options then? If so, I'll just pick one of the two.

 

Sorry not trying to sound unappreciative just saying. WAMAS has/is probably the best 20 bucks ive spent on the hobby so far.

 

 

[Integral9]

Perhaps not as important as your needs, but I sit right next to the tank on my couch and watch TV there every night, so a quiet tank is important to me as well. I have always used a durso style standpipe on my tanks w/ the inlet flipped up to skim the surface. I find that with the addition of what I call "the silencer" [1] at the bottom, they are very quiet. The trick to a durso setup with the inlet flipped up is to get the air to be pulled only from the hole in the stand pipe, not allowing a vortex to form, which is what creates the slurping sound. There will still be a slight slurp / gurgle from the air hole on the stand pipe, but that is usually inaudible over 5 ft away; if need be an air silencer works very well here.

 

With my 135 setup, I have 2 durso stand pipes running on 2 drains. I currently have more noise coming from my pump, fan, and just plain water sloshing down the drain pipes than I get from the drains. Occaisionally though I'll get a burp a little while after restarting the pump.

 

[1] "the silencer": I drill several dozen 3/8" or 1/4" sized holes in the drain pipe just above the water line (but below the sump wall) and all the way down the pipe into the water. sometimes a little water will squirt out of the holes above the water line. I also extend the drain down to about an 1" above the bottom or as far as I can go into the sump. The holes above the water line break the siphon there and the holes below the water line force the air bubbles to form smaller ones which changes the "blub-blub" of larger bubbles into the sound the sound of a sponge being squeezed. The problem then becomes lots of smaller air bubbles in the sump, but I have found these are easily managed with a filter sock.

[.OptimusPrime.]

Perhaps not as important as your needs, but I sit right next to the tank on my couch and watch TV there every night, so a quiet tank is important to me as well. I have always used a durso style standpipe on my tanks w/ the inlet flipped up to skim the surface. I find that with the addition of what I call "the silencer" [1] at the bottom, they are very quiet. The trick to a durso setup with the inlet flipped up is to get the air to be pulled only from the hole in the stand pipe, not allowing a vortex to form, which is what creates the slurping sound. There will still be a slight slurp / gurgle from the air hole on the stand pipe, but that is usually inaudible over 5 ft away; if need be an air silencer works very well here.

 

With my 135 setup, I have 2 durso stand pipes running on 2 drains. I currently have more noise coming from my pump, fan, and just plain water sloshing down the drain pipes than I get from the drains. Occaisionally though I'll get a burp a little while after restarting the pump.

 

[1] "the silencer": I drill several dozen 3/8" or 1/4" sized holes in the drain pipe just above the water line (but below the sump wall) and all the way down the pipe into the water. sometimes a little water will squirt out of the holes above the water line. I also extend the drain down to about an 1" above the bottom or as far as I can go into the sump. The holes above the water line break the siphon there and the holes below the water line force the air bubbles to form smaller ones which changes the "blub-blub" of larger bubbles into the sound the sound of a sponge being squeezed. The problem then becomes lots of smaller air bubbles in the sump, but I have found these are easily managed with a filter sock.

 

Do you have pictures of said setup?

[Integral9]

I have been meaning to get new pics for my build thread anyway. I'll see if I can get them up for you.

[Integral9]

Here is the pipe that leads into my sump, on right. I have dropping into a filter sock to the bubbles get captured and anything else larger than 200microns. Also, most of the hole are below the water line, so all you can see it the one.

 

Same on the other side, far left. Looks like its time to clean this filter sock.

 

 

 

 

edit: Oops, almost forgot, here are the double durso stand pipes behind the tank that lead to common drain line delivering water to my sump and fuge:

 

You can't see it, it's out of frame, but there is ball valve, like on the other side that I have slightly closed off to control the flow into the fuge.

Edited October 5, 2011 by Integral9

[.OptimusPrime.]

Thanks for the pics. It helps alot! - Where did you get your schedule 40 valves? Do I want something like this??

http://www.homedepot...catalogId=10053

 

I checked BRS and they only had sched. 80.

 

Is there a major difference in using ball v. gate valves?

 

Also, after drilling and putting the loc line in the threaded heads...i cant get them to thread all the way in(flush) with the head. Can I leave it as is? should I use teflon tape? Or should I use a wrench or something to tighten them all the way down??

 

So far for the drain (durso) parts list:

 

x ft - 1.5" PVC schedule 40

1 - 1.5" thread x slip male adapter (since i have 1.5" bulkhead SxT with thread on the outside of the tank)

1 - 1.5" Sanitary Tee

1 - 1.5" Gate or True union ball valve

1 - 1.5" Cap

6" - 1/4" airline tubing

2 - 1.5" 90 elbows (shouldn't matter since its drain lines - as i was told earlier)

 

Return part list

 

x ft - 3/4" PVC sched. 40

2 - 3/4" pvc male adapters (return heads are threaded on both sides)

1 - true wye tee

1 - 3/4" ball valve / gate

1 - 3/4" MPT X Slip adapter

1 - 3/4" union

1 - 3/4" 90 elbow

 

This is just a rough idea off the top of my head. If I am missing anything anyone can think of let me know.

 

I am lucky in that all my pvc will be free! So if i need to add stuff or redo no extra costs!

 

 

Also, what are you using to keep your sock up??? I see a piece of black plastic with a cut out. I've see multiple set ups for with socks so I might invest in a few.

Edited October 5, 2011 by .OptimusPrime.

[Integral9]

Thanks for the pics. It helps alot! - Where did you get your schedule 40 valves? Do I want something like this??

http://www.homedepot...catalogId=10053

I got most of my fittings from flexPVC.com; they have an incredible selection of fittings that is just unmatched. And if you can't find it on their website, chances are they have it, just give them a call.

 

I checked BRS and they only had sched. 80.

I don't know why reefers are using sched. 80 now. That's typically meant for high pressure situations. Perhaps there is a higher margin on sched. 80 fittings.

 

Is there a major difference in using ball v. gate valves?

It's a completely different mechanism. The gate valve, lowers a gate across the pipe to block the flow; like a portcullis. A ball valve, turns a ball to close off the flow; like a vault door. The gate valve has a much finer degree of adjustment than a ball valve and can reliably set back to where you had it should you change it setting. Ball valves typically can handle higher pressure and IME: leak less often than gate valves. My preference is to use a gate valve when I need to dial something back, and a ball valve when I need to be sure it's closed off.

I don't have any gate valves.

 

Also, after drilling and putting the loc line in the threaded heads...i cant get them to thread all the way in(flush) with the head. Can I leave it as is? should I use teflon tape? Or should I use a wrench or something to tighten them all the way down??

Assuming the threads are the same either fine or coarse, they just may not thread all the way in or the threads may need some loosening or they could simply be too long. It's more of an asthetic appeal to get them flush. I would just use some teflon tape to get a tight seal on the threads to prevent back siphoning from there should the power go out.

 

So far for the drain (durso) parts list:

 

x ft - 1.5" PVC schedule 40

1 - 1.5" thread x slip male adapter (since i have 1.5" bulkhead SxT with thread on the outside of the tank)

1 - 1.5" Sanitary Tee

1 - 1.5" Gate or True union ball valve

1 - 1.5" Cap

6" - 1/4" airline tubing

2 - 1.5" 90 elbows (shouldn't matter since its drain lines - as i was told earlier)

I regret using the sanitary Tee as it seems to allow the air vortex to be easily redirected over to the tank side which causes the slurping. if I replumbed that part of my tank, I'd just use a regular Tee. The rest looks good though. If you have to dial back your drains, you might want the gate valve for the fine adjustment. when you plumb your system, put the valve handles towards the tank, so if you drop something, it's less likely to catch the valve handles and break them off.

 

a bit of advice for the least amount of noise: don't go straight to a 1/4" hole in the caps to allow air in. Start small and work your way up. Also, and this is not related to noise, but I wouldn't glue the caps on as you may need to get into the drain lines one day; to poke some algae down or push a pipe cleaner down or try to rescue a lost fish. The down side is salt will creep out.

 

Return part list

 

x ft - 3/4" PVC sched. 40

2 - 3/4" pvc male adapters (return heads are threaded on both sides)

1 - true wye tee

1 - 3/4" ball valve / gate

1 - 3/4" MPT X Slip adapter

1 - 3/4" union

1 - 3/4" 90 elbow

 

This is just a rough idea off the top of my head. If I am missing anything anyone can think of let me know.

 

I am lucky in that all my pvc will be free! So if i need to add stuff or redo no extra costs!

That looks good to me.

 

Yes you are. I probably spent over $100 on my fittings. The valves start to get expensive as the pipe side increases.

 

Also, what are you using to keep your sock up??? I see a piece of black plastic with a cut out. I've see multiple set ups for with socks so I might invest in a few.

I am using a BRS filter sock holder that I cut down with a hack saw to fit in my sump. The holder comes with 4" and 7" sock holders, so the bracket is 7" long to accomodate both. Hard to believe, but space is at a premium, even with almost 5 ft of sump / fuge.

[.OptimusPrime.]

Been way busy at work lately and haven't had a chance to get to working on the tank.

 

I will be picking up my plumbing and setting it up in place tonight.

 

Does the primer and glue need to be reefsafe (potable) or just the glue??

 

What comes next after plumbing is tested and the tank drained? I'm guessing Aquascaping but probably not.

 

Although, I don't really want to glue the rocks together because I might want to change the scape at a later time would I be fine if I just placed the rocks on top of each other? (I've already played with the rock outside the tank and cant make anything I like, so I know i will be changing the scaping a few times)

 

If not, anyone have any recommendations for epoxy for my rock or have some locally that I could borrow?

 

I bought some fiberglass rods (the driveway markers from HD) , but the BRS reef saver seems like it would break in half if i tried to drill a hole for the rods to slip through.

[Integral9]

I use the purple primer and the low VOC glue, but only because I have a little one in the house. I think once the glue cures, it won't leach anything. Sometimes shortly after starting up some excess glue will detach from the plumbing and make its way into the tank. You'll want to catch that in a filter sock or sponge or net if you can. It will usually make it's way into the filter sock or sponges if you have them, otherwise get a net and go fishing.

 

After your plumbing is tested, and I'm assuming you are going to have a sand bed and might possibly want a fish or invert that burrows, so you'll want to put down your rock first to prevent any undermining from burrowers. It is ok to just stack it, but take care to "lock" the peices into place so they won't fall down and create a landlside should a fish decide to give it a wack with it's tail or a heavy snail climb up it. I don't glue my rock together or use rods. After a few years you may need to use some epoxy to hold rocks down if the corals get large enough. Once you have the rock in and stacked the way you want it, you can add the sand and push it around to fill in around the rocks. However, I recommend you take your time and stack the rocks the way you want them stacked the first time before adding any sand. Re-aquascaping after a tank has been up for a while is difficult if not impossible w/out destruction due to corals growing over rocks and attaching them. Also, reefs don't change that much or often, so re-aquascaping upsets the balance in the tank which can cause aggression not to mention you can release deadly toxins by pulling up rocks out of the sand bed.

 

I have never used the BRS rock or any artificial rock. It looks like it would lock together nicely though. Drilling into natural LR is like drilling into a gritty soap bar.

[.OptimusPrime.]

Heres what I got done tonight so far.

 

I realized I didnt have enought 3/4" pipe to do the return so I left that unfinished for now. Should be able to finish it up tomorrow.

 

 

 

 

I probably should have had picture before I glued so I could have gotten feed back but ill save that for the return i guess....

 

A couple questions I had..the pipe inside the sump..what height should it be at? I made it at baffle height... and didnt glue it just in case...do I need to glue it in???

 

This is basically what my return will look like.

 

Any feedback before I glue it in tomorrow would be much appreciated. It looks like a few too many 90s but thats just me.