Phospate and Nitrate Control

[Shadowbearwv]

My Phosphates have been running high since I setup my 75g tank. I've tried a couple things to reduce it but haven't had much luck. I have no algae problem currently in the display, actually have to add algae for the snails. I have both chaeto and caulerpa running in the fuge. As for nitrates I've run two different test with different results one reading high but not unsafe(strip test) and one reading zero(API).

 

I'm looking on suggestions to reduce the levels. Most of my LPS hard coral seems to be doing ok, but my SPS just don't seem well, loss of color and zero growth.

 

I have a Coralife calcium reactor that I'm currently not using since my calcium levels stay around 450. Can I use this as a media reactor maybe for GFO or solid vodka dosing?

 

Has there been enough success with standard vodka dosing that maybe I should try that?

 

I'm open to any and all suggestions.

 

Thanks

 

Tony

 

I forgot to add that I do not see this problem in my 28g. I feed the tanks the same.

Edited May 16, 2010 by Shadowbearwv

[Nate]

Have you tried running GFO?

[Shadowbearwv]

Have you tried running GFO?

Sure haven't, I bought some RowaPhos today from BRK. Now I just need a reactor. Crossing my fingers this will work.

 

Tony

[sen5241b]

How big is your cheato fuge?

[Jon Lazar]

Do you use an RO/DI? Tapwater can be a source of nitrate and phosphate.

[Shadowbearwv]

How big is your cheato fuge?

The cheato fuge is about 2/3 of a 20g long tank.

 

Do you use an RO/DI? Tapwater can be a source of nitrate and phosphate.

Yep using a RO/DI, was the first purchase I made after all the reading. I just find it very weird that my 75g has the problem and my 28g doesn't. To be truthful my 28g looks a lot better than my 75g and the 28g has only been setup since MACNA 2009.

 

I'm working on upgrading the 75 to a 180g, I'm hoping a 55g sump will give me more room for equipment and fuge area. Under the 75 is just sooooo packed.

 

I did just ordered a reactor from BRS. Hope to have that up and running by the weekend with my RowaPhos.

 

Thanks for all the help, just really baffled.

 

Tony

[Jon Lazar]

I routinely score 20-30 on the API nitrates test, but have great coloration and good growth with my sps.

 

What kind of sps are you having problems with? Phosphate may be the issue, but I whenever people say their acros (including millepora) are losing color and have poor growth, I recommend they check for red bugs and AEFW. Neither are obvious to the casual observer, and RB are downright hard to see if you haven't seen them before. And it doesn't matter where you got your corals or whether you dipped them during acclimation. Unless you went through a comprehensive protocol for both pests, they're likely to survive.

 

Could just be phosphate though

[Shadowbearwv]

I routinely score 20-30 on the API nitrates test, but have great coloration and good growth with my sps.

 

What kind of sps are you having problems with? Phosphate may be the issue, but I whenever people say their acros (including millepora) are losing color and have poor growth, I recommend they check for red bugs and AEFW. Neither are obvious to the casual observer, and RB are downright hard to see if you haven't seen them before. And it doesn't matter where you got your corals or whether you dipped them during acclimation. Unless you went through a comprehensive protocol for both pests, they're likely to survive.

 

Could just be phosphate though

On my Phosphate test it is unreadable because it so high on the test I'm using. I wouldn't doubt that I do have some type of infestation of pests. The issue I'm seeing is with montipora and a birdsnest. Those two seem to be taking the brunt of the problem. All my other SPS corals have good color just very slow growth, don't have any acro's yet.

Edited May 18, 2010 by Shadowbearwv

[Tony Vargas]

What do you feed your tank, including fish?

[dschflier]

It sounds to me like it is the Phospahtes. I think Birdsnest are pretty sensitive to high Phosphates. A media reactor and using GFO should help. How often do you do water changes? This in my opinion is another important place to attack the problem. I also feel using Kalkwasser is an excellent way to lower your Phosphates. Kalk will bind with Phosphates. How is your turnover and general water movment?

[gmubeach]

I don't grow sps but I do use a bag of phosban near the exit to my refuguim seems to be working I do weekly water change or two weeks... I had really bad hair algee and its nearly all gone now!

[Shadowbearwv]

What do you feed your tank, including fish?

Feeding that I do. I rotate through different foods about every 3 days. Day 1 is flakes/pellets and reef chili or frozen plankton and mysis. Day 2 is 2 cubes of frozen food and Reef Nutrition Phytofeast and Oyster feast. Day3 is either my own frozen concoction or Rods. I forgot to add this is divided between my current two tanks.

 

It sounds to me like it is the Phospahtes. I think Birdsnest are pretty sensitive to high Phosphates. A media reactor and using GFO should help. How often do you do water changes? This in my opinion is another important place to attack the problem. I also feel using Kalkwasser is an excellent way to lower your Phosphates. Kalk will bind with Phosphates. How is your turnover and general water movment?

I currently do 10% water changes weekly on all the tanks. I was thinking of doing the Kalk route but was a little afraid to use it as well as my Calcium has always been in the high 400s.

 

I don't grow sps but I do use a bag of phosban near the exit to my refuguim seems to be working I do weekly water change or two weeks... I had really bad hair algee and its nearly all gone now!

I tried the Seachem Phosphate removal in a bag. It lowered it a bit but was still reading high after using on of the larger containers.

 

My reactor from BRS will hopefully be in today or tomorrow. It says you can run carbon and GFO. I'll probably just run GFO for the time being. Does phosphate stop coraline algae growth? I'm guessing it does since my 28g is covered in it and my 75 is complete devoid except a few spots in the sump.

 

Tony

Edited May 19, 2010 by Shadowbearwv

[gmubeach]

I'm not sure about the coralane algee but it should help... Do you fish need that much food... I feed my 46g a cube a day and 15 pellets micro sized... I don't have a ton of fish though just alot of corals!

[Shadowbearwv]

I'm not sure about the coralane algee but it should help... Do you fish need that much food... I feed my 46g a cube a day and 15 pellets micro sized... I don't have a ton of fish though just alot of corals!

I don't really have that many fish either. Current stocking is 3 anthias, 2 clowns, 1 cleaner goby, 1 6-line and a new blenny in the 75. In the 29 I have 2 mollies(mom and 1 baby), 2 clowns, 1 clown goby. I also have lot of little critters that help out with that, 10-15 porcelan crabs that came on the live rock and all my softies tend to grab up alot of the food as well. I have always overfed any pet I have, you should see the cats. I probably should look at reducing the amount that I feed but since the nitrates haven't been too much of a problem in either tanks I haven't worried too much about it. Once the 20g gets cycled the amount that I use will be split between 3 tanks.

[gmubeach]

One day I will have 3 tanks Anyway slow down the feeding will reduce some of your problems.... as for feeding fish a happy fish is a hungry fish... they can literally eat themselves to death.... the trick is feeding them varried diet and avoid MICKY D's hahah jk anyway I think your doing great and wamas is a great place for advice... I'm currnelty looking to make black reef rock.

[dschflier]

I think both carbon and GFO help the overall picture. Even though carbon does not pull out Phosphates it does pull out organics which can feed algea as well. Good water movment is important so food doesn't settle and just slowly release Phosphates into the water column. When you are trying to attack the problem I would do larger water changes. The water change is probbably the most effective and most cost effective way to clean up your tank. Do you have a deep sand bed? Do you have algea growth in your refugium? I think you said you have a refugium.

 

Generally I like finding anything which can be causing the problem and attack everything hard and consistently over a couple of months. I have had good success when I have had the time to be consistent.

[Shadowbearwv]

I think both carbon and GFO help the overall picture. Even though carbon does not pull out Phosphates it does pull out organics which can feed algea as well. Good water movment is important so food doesn't settle and just slowly release Phosphates into the water column. When you are trying to attack the problem I would do larger water changes. The water change is probbably the most effective and most cost effective way to clean up your tank. Do you have a deep sand bed? Do you have algea growth in your refugium? I think you said you have a refugium.

 

Generally I like finding anything which can be causing the problem and attack everything hard and consistently over a couple of months. I have had good success when I have had the time to be consistent.

 

That would be a no to the DSB. I bought "The Package" from TBS and wasn't up to speed on the DSB for the refugium. I'm trying a DSB in my 20g to see how that works. The Cheato in the refugium didn't grow for the longest time. It has started to grow more recently. I have also started to add some Caulerpa from my 28g that seems to grow much faster. I've started to cut back my feeding as well. I might try a larger water change this weekend.

 

Tony

[gmubeach]

Take the culerpa out of your 28... I had a nano die to culerpa grape culerpa killed my nano. You can't get a fish big enough to control the culerpa and its worse then pulling weeds grows twice as fast and will choke out corals