cyano burst & sick clown - are they connected?

[treesprite]

This is my 40 hex clownfish tank, not the main display (main tank gets a lot more attention). I'm going to list this in numbered facts, because it's too confusing to explain in paragraphs.

 

Fact 1: I changed part of the mishmash of lighting over my 40 hex several days ago, to something a whole lot brighter (changed it back yesterday because of this problem).

Fact 2: The past 3 days have had the biggest cyano outbreak I've ever seen in my life.

Fact 3: I am guessing that this has affected other types of bacteria as well, including the kind that gets on fish.

Fact 3: My understanding is that a bacteria burst can deplete oxygen.

Fact 4: Lack of oxygen can lead to fish stress and illness.

Fact 5: About 3 or 4 times over a several year period, when my female clown has been stressed, she has gotten white fuzzy stuff on her body, which always goes away with no treatment at all other than removing the stress factor.... male has only had it once. I believe the stuff is a bacteria (aka, from what I've read, "false fungus").

Fact 6: Yesterday morning I looked in the tank and the female clown had this stuff, which I'm thinking is from physical stress related to the light/cyano/bacteria/less oxygen process and conditions.

Fact 7: I did a 40% water change yesterday and will be doing it again today.

Fact 8: I am hoping that the water changes will remove the problem that caused this illness so that it will again go away on its own.

 

I am very concerned because this time the stuff is not just on her body, it's partly on her eye. I am considering taking her out of the tank to actually treat her with an antibiotic (I have some Maryacin Two, one of the recommendations I read), BUT the reason she has gotten this stuff in the past is the very simple fact that I caught her and removed her from the tank.

 

So I'm looking for opinions and.or suggestions here. Do you think I should I risk making the condition much worse by removing her, or just wait to see if it goes away again on it's own in spite of the concern about her eye? Is there any kind of in-tank treatment that won't kill off either inverts or the tank's notifying bacteria? Would a medicated food work without hurting inverts that might ingest it?

[Sikryd]

I would just make sure you have enough water on hand to do an 80% water change.

40% isn't enough to make a large enough difference when you have a bacteria bloom like that.

[Jon Lazar]

treesprite,

 

I would try to figure out what the condition is before you can decide how (and whether) to medicate. If your fish has had this 3-4 times before, I wouldn't rush to do anything.

 

I also recommend people keep a few basic fish medications on hand (formalin, gram positive and negative antibiotics, copper, etc.) so they can treat common problems that spring up...invariably at night or 3-day weekends when your car is in the shop.

 

Good luck,

Jon

[watson_barrett]

how long has this been set-up? the new lights can def spark an outbreak if there is high nutrients or if the bulbs are old.

 

I would try to cut back on feeding until the problem starts to get better.

 

Put as much marco in your fuge that you can fit.

 

Increase flow in problem areas if you can or remove any rocks that are restricting flow, possibly putting them in sump/fuge.

 

Do a water changes every 4-5 days. When you vacume out water, pull out as much of they cyno as you can.

 

Cyno can be very fikle, arriving in force and leaving for not real appearent reason. I had issues in all my tanks until they were 1 yr + in age.

 

I wouldn't think the outbreak is related to the sick fish but i havn't read much on this.

[watson_barrett]

AS far as the fish goes, are you running UV? If not, that could help.

 

Not sure if UV works on fugus issues though???

[treesprite]

Thanks for the replies!

 

I can change that much water at a time as far as volume goes, but after 1/3rd down, the corals that are attached to the rock are in air; yesterday I kept pouring tank water over them to keep them at least wet, but it would take twice as long to do a change twice that size. How long can these be in that situation: frogspawn, colt coral, gt toadstool, anthelia, yellow polyps?

 

I have the following:

Maracyn Two (gram negative), formalin, copper, and API "Super Ick Cure". I don't have any gram positive.

 

I can put a 9 watt UV sterilizer up if I can find the pump for it - I usually only use it for new fish in QT. This is more likely a bacteria that is often mistaken for fungus, hence sometimes noted as "false fungus". Lights in teh tank are off.

 

This tank has been up for I can't remember - at least a year. It was in the 38 that was used for drill practice at frag fest, then in the un-drilled hex, then moved to this 2nd hex after I drilled it.

 

I didn't think about it until now, but when I moved the tank a few feet away a few weeks ago, having to remove all its contents including the clowns, I basically expected the female to get this and she did not. Maybe her immune system was already compromised and this water issue was just enough to bring on what I expected to happen a few weeks ago.

Edited February 14, 2010 by treesprite

[watson_barrett]

I have never had any problems keeping corals out of water for up to about 5 min. in past. i would just GENTLY squirt tank water on them every minute or so to keep them wet.

 

I would be more worried about making sure the water you are adding has same perameters as when you started, especially with the large water changes.

 

Also, just make sure you do adequete research before you make / take any major steps. all of my major problems in the past came from over-reating, just something to keep in mind.

 

If you have had the problem in the past and it went away i doubt the sick fish caused the cyno problem.

[www.fishnreef.com]

Be careful when changing water also. Make sure it is WELL AERATED. Else you will be adding water will even less oxygen. You should be fine. Aeration. Smaller and constant water changes. Try not to change too many factors as you will stress out your inhabitants even more. Most likely your clown got stress and reacted to it. That does not mean that the stressor is still there. Only the reaction from the stress. Stable is better now.

[watson_barrett]

BTW if you need some cheato i have a sump full of it, you can grab as much as you need. This would help to deplete excess nutriets that potentially led to cyno bloom. LMK.

[pco1988]

You can let coral be out of water for long periods of time with no bad affects. In the ocean the tops of the reefs are out of the water for 6 hours or so during low tide. So corals outside of water during a water change should be more than fine, even without squirting them with water every few minutes.

 

Just my $.02

[treesprite]

I've been out since 3:30 until like half an hour ago, so didn't have a peak back at the fish until now - she has a lot less on her body already, but her eye is covered. I hope by the time the body is cleared up the eye is better as well.

 

Thanks for the chaeto offer - Waldorf is kind of far just for that. My hex's overflow is a full-length glass wall in which the macros go, rather than having the macros in the little 10g sump. Unfortunately, the caulerpa hasn't been growing because I thought it would have enough light from the tank and does not. I scraped the lower half of the black paint from the back of the tank, and will be putting a small light back there so the stuff will grow and do its job.

 

Water has enough aeration.

 

Great point to make about reefs!

[hbh]

Do you need more Chaeto? I'm about to toss some. Call me and Mark or I can come over to TJ's/H mart area and meet up w/ you.

[pisces_steve]

I did an AC70 mod and could use some chaeto. All the LFS seam to be out of stock. Let me know if anyone can spare a little. Thanks!

[treesprite]

Her body is cleared up, but eye is no better. I'm giving it another day before I move her to QT for treatment. I broke my QT against the side of the tub when I was rinsing it, so I guess I'll have to find a new one.

 

That second water change, I didn't want to use all new water shocking the system or starting a mini-cycle, so I used mostly water from the main system which is dosed with Prodibio - the clown tank nitrate was cut from about 40 to about 15 in just 2 days.

[treesprite]

She has completely recovered

[TCC]

BTW if you need some cheato i have a sump full of it, you can grab as much as you need. This would help to deplete excess nutriets that potentially led to cyno bloom. LMK.

If you still have some cheato to spare, we could use some. Thx

By the way, does anyone has long term experience with Rod's food? The fish and inverts seem to like them, but I'm not sure about any kind of cumulative effects.

[treesprite]

TCC, welcome to WAMAS!

If you post in the For Sale/Buy/Free section that you are looking for free chaeto, you will certainly get someone to give you a bunch.