Well, looks like I just got a new tank

[Franco]

I had bought a 125g glass tank as an upgrade to my 45g. I haven't had the time to buy all the equipment and get it cycling yet though.

 

Just stumbled across an insane deal though and hopped on it. Now I've got myself a 90g rimless acrylic tank with all the necessary equipment, which I'm picking up on Sunday. Woops. Assuming my roommates don't kill me, I may just set up this tank now and slowly keep working on the 125g, maybe make it a predator tank... Who knows. All I know is I'm excited for the new possibilities!

 

 

 

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[Franco]

Now I guess my big decision to make is lighting. I'm thinking I'd like to make this tank predominantly an SPS reef tank. The 125g long is 5' and came with a 5' T5 fixture, which I had planned on supplementing with some LEDs. I guess I could just throw that over the 90 gal for now, but it's not really a good long-term solution.

 

I saw a recent post here for a 4' T5/MH fixture. I know that's definitely provide sufficient lighting. My only reservations are that 1. LEDs are way more energy efficient and last longer, and 2. I'd probably need to invest in a water chiller with MH, or at least that's what I've heard. The advantage of course would be that it's cheap and a nice plug-and-play addition.

 

Thoughts?

 

 

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[Origami]

My experience with LEDs is that they are not always maintenance free. A lot of their longevity performance is going to depend on things like cooling, how hard they're being driven, etc. The LEDs themselves can burn out if they get too hot (and their temperature depends on how hard they're driven and how effective heat removal is in the design). And drivers can fail, too. For example, I've had to replace LEDs a few times on two Chinese-made Evergrow units in their 3-4 years of operation. In another case, I had to replace/retire a failed Meanwell driver on a DIY kit. And, in yet another, I've retired a larger Chinese-made 300W driver when the dimmer function began to fail and the unit began flickering. This is over a 7 year period, I figure. Just keep that in mind. Some people also don't like the uneven light distribution of LEDs that can lead to spots of color here and there. Decent lenses can help to distribute the color a bit more evenly and mitigate the offending effect.

 

As for being energy efficient, you'll find that T5HO lamps (fluorescent) are very efficient but you'll probably replace lamps every 9-12 months. You can adjust color with T5s by selecting different lamps. Trial and error can be expensive, though. So it's good to find color combinations that other people like in their tank that you feel match your tastes. Heat can be an issue with T5's retrofitted into a canopy setup, but is less of an issue with open-top setups. Energy efficiency can be improved with high quality reflectors the direct more of the light into the tank and less outside.

 

Metal Halide lamps generate a lot of light and heat. But all lighting generates heat. After all, a hundred watts is a hundred watts. However, if a 150W T5HO or LED light setup can put out the same light as a 400W MH lamp, then the MH is going to generate another 250W of heat that you'll want to vent away. In the winter time, you can think of it as free heating for the house. In the summer time, it's extra work for your AC to remove. Heat is less of an issue with an open-top design than, say, with a mostly-closed canopy. Still, MH has its advocates who say that its technology to grow corals well. Because they're point light sources, you'll also get nice glitter lines in the water column under metal halides. Lamp replacement is typically every 6 months to a year (on the outside). Efficiency can be improved with good reflectors that direct light down into the tank, reducing spillover, and can still vent heat away upwards and away from the tank. Not everybody who runs MH needs a chiller. I ran MH for several years and didn't need a chiller. However, that tank installation was in my basement and I had a fan running over the sump in my fish room for evaporative cooling (and to increase my kalkwasser dosing) when it was needed.

 

Of the three, I think that a lot of new people in the hobby and a few older ones have migrated to LEDs in part if not in full. Some have started supplementing LEDs with T5's. And some very well respected and successful reefers still hold to and attribute at least some of their success to metal halides. 

[YHSublime]

I would love to run Metal Halides, but I can't afford the extra heat in the summer. Already my 4 bulb T5 unit did enough of a job making sure I never had to turn my radiators on this winter.

[Franco]

I would love to run Metal Halides, but I can't afford the extra heat in the summer. Already my 4 bulb T5 unit did enough of a job making sure I never had to turn my radiators on this winter.

Yeah the heat is really my biggest concern. Granted, the tank will be located in my below-ground basement, which is always cool. For AC, we only run window units, but there isn't one downstairs. The room is huge, and there would be no other sources of heat, but I'm really hesitant about halides still just based on heat alone.

 

An aquarium chiller isn't out of the question, per se. But it's just another expense (welcome to saltwater tanks, me) and another piece of equipment that could potentially fail.

 

I think I'm talking myself into just running a T-5/LED combo.

 

 

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[YHSublime]

I think I'm talking myself into just running a T-5/LED combo.

 

Just make sure you're taking into account expenses with each one. Personally, my favorite combo is the T5/LED, I prefer an ATI/Reefbrite situation. You'll have to change the bulbs about once a year, but I get phenomenal growth, and I like the colors. I've also retrofit old hoods for T5 bulbs, and run LED's down the middle, there's more than one way to skin a cat. 

 

I'll shamelessly plug the fact that I have two brand new Ocean Revive T247's for sale, and with two more, you could cover that tank pretty nicely and be done with your lighting search!

[rvu1710]

I prefer the t5-led combo as well... you can easy to find some ati fixture out there for 8 bulb then add two more led in middle and your tank thrive:)

 

 

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[Franco]

I'll definitely explore the Reef Brite LED strips. My goal was to use the T5s as primary lighting with LED supplementing and adding that nice shimmer. I imagine for a tank that's 24" high and 18" deep, I'll go with 4x48" T5s plus LEDs.

 

The question then becomes placement - whether to place the T5s in the center and flanked by LED strips or on the sides with either an LED strip or a few Kessils in the middle.

 

As for the T247, I actually have one running on my 45g currently. If they weren't so wide, I'd have probably bought one of yours already and gone with the dual T247s flanked by T5s for my 120 long. No shame in promoting your stuff for sale, they're great lights, especially for the price!

 

 

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[YHSublime]

The question then becomes placement - whether to place the T5s in the center and flanked by LED strips or on the sides with either an LED strip or a few Kessils in the middle.

 

If you're going to explore that direction, do a 4 bulb 48" fixture, and get an XHO 48" reefbrite. 

 

On my 36"x18" tank, I'm running a 4 bulb 36" ATI. It covers the whole tank, and when I get the extra dollars to add an XHO 36" reefbrite, it'll just mount perfectly on the edge of the ATI and I can tilt it in. Honestly, I'd like to run x2 XHO Reebrites, and use those for the first 2 hours or so in the morning and evening, and then have my tank lights ramp up and down. It doesn't have to be ATI and reefbrites, there are other companies that make light fixtures that I'm sure will get the job cheaper. I know a few folks that are using these. 

[madweazl]

What is the purpose of the Reefbrites if you're already running T5s? They provide the same "look" (no shimmer); why not just stick with all T5 at that point? Is it purely for dimming or sunrise/sunset effects? BRS' recent T5 tests showed almost no impact to dimming T5s in regard to output or longevity so that is an option as well. 

 

I wanted to stick with all LED but my setup prevented that from happening. Initially I was keeping a mixed reef and drilled holes through the canopy for the Kessils. The tank had a center brace so I was largely stuck with two LEDs (or four spaced a little differently but that was overkill). I ended up adding a pair of T5s to supplement and the combo has worked great so I cant complain too much (other than disliking the hue cast but the T5s). 

 

Now I'm kind of at a crossroads in regard to lighting the 150g; I want to stick with all LED but everything I have is growing under a hybrid and I'm not a fan of changing things that are working well. 

 

There arent many LEDs I like because of the disco-ball effect. In the end, Radions with a diffuser or Kessils are about the only options in that regard unless the lights are mounted extremely high (lighting up the entire room) or you resort to a DIY diffuser of sorts. 

 

If you dont mind the boring look of T5s, you certainly cant go wrong as they'll grow anything. 

 

If I had a larger tank (6' and 200g+), I'd go MH without question due to cost. 

[YHSublime]

What is the purpose of the Reefbrites if you're already running T5s? They provide the same "look" (no shimmer); why not just stick with all T5 at that point? Is it purely for dimming or sunrise/sunset effects? BRS' recent T5 tests showed almost no impact to dimming T5s in regard to output or longevity so that is an option as well. 

 

Completely disagree. With an all blue Reefbrite it adds that LED "pop" that you don't get with just T5. I don't have a dimmable fixture, my lights just turn on and off. The only reason I haven't added a reefbrite yet is because it's not a necessity, but it is a far cry from "providing the same look." 

[malacoda]

Totally off topic, but ... that picture should win an award of the year for optical illusions.  At first glance, the reflection of the step ladder doesn't look like a reflection, it looks like an actual step ladder inside a really big aquarium. While not intentional, a very cool visual effect.

[YHSublime]

Totally off topic, but ... that picture should win an award of the year for optical illusions.  At first glance, the reflection of the step ladder doesn't look like a reflection, it looks like an actual step ladder inside a really big aquarium. While not intentional, a very cool visual effect.

 

I didn't even see that, well spotted!

[Origami]

Totally off topic, but ... that picture should win an award of the year for optical illusions.  At first glance, the reflection of the step ladder doesn't look like a reflection, it looks like an actual step ladder inside a really big aquarium. While not intentional, a very cool visual effect.

A reflection? You mean that's really not a sliding glass door on the left panel?

 

I hadn't noticed it at first - I mean, I did, but I saw it as a reflection - but the lines and perspective really line up well to create this offbeat impression.

[Franco]

So thanks everyone for the helpful comments on this (and the banter about the step ladder growing in my tank - kudos if anyone knows any fish that will naturally eat it, driving me crazy).

 

After way, way too much research on lighting over the past few days, I've decided I'm definitely sold on rolling with a 6x48" T5 ATI SunPower fixture with Reebrite XHO LEDs for supplemental light and shimmer. My main considerations in my decision were quality of light output, reliability, customer service/replacement part availability, and cost. I wasn't as much concerned with appearance of the unit itself, built-in customizable features, dimmability, fan noise, and whether the spread happens to fall outside my tank somewhat. Regarding dimming, because (1) I came across tons of stories about people having issues with the ballasts, and (2) it reduces T5 life, I'm completely disinterested.

 

I knew I wanted a combo fixture, but wasn't sure between T5/LED, T5/MH, or MH/LED. After reading a bunch of horror stories about MH resulting in fires and other overheating-related issues, MH passed my risk tolerance threshold.

 

After settling on T5/LED combos, I researched various fixtures to see which I liked best. I was surprised that there wasn't much in the way of studies comparing various T5 fixtures on the market, at least with respect to quantitatively measuring differences in PAR throughout the tank and over time. There's plenty of that info on individual bulbs, but not so much on fixtures. Most of the info I found was anecdotal or purely expression of opinion of which looked better. The four options I looked heavily into were the ATI SunPower, ATI Powermodule, Giesemann Matrixx II, and Pacific Sun Diuna.

 

Pacific Sun Diuna - I really, really liked this unit. I love its controlability and its appearance. Its reflectors appear to be top-notch. Also, cost isn't prohibitive at $850 on Amazon, but it's certainly not as cheap as the GMann or SunPower. However, there were a few  major drawbacks that kept me from going with it. First, it's way less available in the US, and I imagine that finding replacement parts down the road could be a serious headache. Also, the fixture only comes in 8- or 10-bulb options, and I'm looking for a 6-bulb fixture for my 90g. I'm definitely intrigued, especially for my 120g long build, but right now I have to very reluctantly pass. It's easily my second-favorite of the four fixtures though.

 

Giesemann - I'll start with the positives. It was by far my favorite-looking unit, and reviews tend to be in consensus that it's the most ruggedly-built unit of the four. Additionally, it's comparatively cheap at $760 on BRS. However, it appears to have the worst reflectors of the lot. Additionally, it appears that this unit is notorious for having issues with properly cooling. It also appears that it was designed to be kept closer to the waterline than the others, which combined with its propensity for heating issues, really concerned me. Lastly, I came across several accounts of people having serious issues with Gisemann's customer service. Hard pass.

 

ATI Powermodule - Not going to spend too much time on this. Two main things knocked it out of consideration for me - price ($1364 for 4x48" or $1790 for 8x48") and the lack of a 6-bulb option. I'm perfectly happy sacrificing some degree of controlability and a very slight amount of light quality for major cost savings.

 

ATi SunPower - Easily the best bang for the buck. Quality of output is great thanks to its reflectors. Seriously, check out this comparison between the Giesemann and it using the same exact bulbs about 30 minutes apart:

 

Giesemann - 

 

SunPower - 

 

It appears to have the best cooling system of the four, with the middle fans pulling the heat up and above the lights, where other fans then blow the hot air outside the sides. Also, somehow it's the cheapest of the four options, at $541 on BRS. It's not as sleek-looking as the options admittedly, but that's not a major issue. Really, my biggest complaint about the unit is that it only has two power cords - one for 4 bulbs and the other for the other 2 bulbs. I'd prefer that it have three so I could control each of the 2-bulb ballasts. Apparently, it's a pain to open up and modify, but I may go that route. Also, the fact that its fan power is static (versus dynamically controlled based on heat like on the Pacific Sun) is a minor drawback, but I mean, I'm basically nitpicking at this point. Six bulbs plus the Reefbrite LED will give me PLENTY of PAR for SPS, and if it's at all overkill, I can always raise the unit a bit. Overall, I feel that the SunPower offers the best bang for your buck, so I'll be putting in my order this weekend.

 

Anyway, this is probably basic information for most of you, but figured doing a full write-up might be useful for anybody else who stumbles across this who's in my position.

 

If anyone is interested in further information on lighting, some of the best resources I found were the following:

 

Thread about these fixtures

Article comparing PAR spreads between T5/MH/LED

BRStv video on PAR for ATI SunPower Fixtures - 4-bulb vs 8-bulb

[YHSublime]

Great write up, I could have been more helpful as I've gone down this path before, but it was a long time ago, and I couldn't be bothered to find the threads! 

 

I imagine you'll probably find out exactly what I did. The combo you want will be just fine on its own, and when you're ready to add that reefbrite, it'll be an easy addition Trust me, you won't really mind about the 2 channels, Just put all your blue'ish bulbs on one, and the rest on the other. 

 

My recommendation would be a combo of blue plus, coral plus, and fiji purple. Although, I think next go I might just do coral plus and blue plus.