Max Ivers February 9, 2011 Share February 9, 2011 Hello everyone, I am relatively new to WAMAS, but had a great experience at the winter meeting and met some great people in the club. I wanted to just start a thread with some ideas that I have for an upgrade that would take place in the relative future (by the end of summer?) from my current 55 gallon setup. I have learned so much since I started my first tank last august, and things are really doing well. My SPS are coloring up and growing well, my LPS the same, and this is without any sort of supplementation (soon to change to Kalk in my ATO container) other than water changes with good old Instant Ocean. But anyway, based on this knowledge that I've gained, I'm thinking about upgrading tanks once and for all (subject to change without notice of course ) before I head off to college in a little over a year. My parents have really fallen in love with my tank and these days I have to kick them out of my room where the tank is so that I can sleep. And hopefully this means that they will support me wrecking having in their house to build an even bigger tank and system. So I wanted to just post this up here and I'm hoping that y'all will question me and comment on the design process so that I can build a system that is absolutely beautiful. More actual details to come in the next post! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Ivers February 9, 2011 Author Share February 9, 2011 Ok so now the actual substance of the upgrade. I really like the 48" length of my current tank, but I hate the shallow museum look of having only 12" of depth. I'm thinking about going with 48" x 20" x 20" for the tank dimensions, with an external overflow to give me lots of real estate, as well as the ability to run a proper beananimal overflow as opposed to my full syphon no backup pipe current setup. I'm going to talk to Jeff (NAGA) later this week to get a quote on the tank and to figure out the details. The equipment I currently own is as follows: Current USA Sundial 48" 4x54w T5HO fixture Current 48" 110w PC fixture 2010 Model Reef Octopus NWB-150 (gate valve model) BRS reactor w/Maxi-Jet 1200 feed pump EcoBAK solid vodka pellets RIO 2500 return pump Digital Aquatics Reef Keeper Lite w/ATO, PC4, MLC Koralia Evolution 750 and 1050 powerheads 55lbs of LR Another 5lbs of LR with 20Lbs of BRS dry rock seeding/cooking/curing in a rubbermaid trashcan. I would prefer to keep this upgrade to the neighborhood of $1000 or so, but I have already made the mistake of buying crap equipment once and then the real deal again. I also am interested in LED lighting as I just find it crazy that I plopped down 100 bucks for 4 new T5 bulbs and would need to do so every 9-12 months. Also I'm really sick of the sandstorms that I have now in my tank with the flow I want for SPS and I'm seriously considering a BB tank with some sort of false sand bed. Anyone want to chime in on a SSB vs BB? Any and all comments/questions/concerns are more than welcome. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davelin315 February 9, 2011 Share February 9, 2011 Hey Max, not sure if you began with fresh sand back in August or not, but over time, sand tends to settle down as bacteria coats it and it doesn't swirl around as much. My tank took awhile, but the sand can be stirred up without clouding the tank for more than a few minutes as it's grown over and "heavier" so that it sinks down pretty much straightaway. I run both barebottom tanks as well as shallow sand beds and I prefer the shallow sand bed when I can keep it clean. I would ditch the Rio pump as I'm not a fan of their products, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Ivers February 9, 2011 Author Share February 9, 2011 Hi Dave, I started the tank using Carib-Sea Ocean Direct Reef Grade Live Sand, which is a little larger than oolite sand, and it stays on the bottom for the most part, but when I direct the flow away from the sandbed, I can't keep a thin film of brown and red cyano from appearing, but as soon as I put the powerheads back towards the sand, no cyano, but the sand is thrown all over the place. And I attribute the cyano on the sand to a lack of flow, because I dont have any other patches of cyano in the entire tank, just the sandbed. I wholeheartedly agree with you about the Rio pump, I know its not the greatest, but it doesn't give me any heat issues, is relatively silent and hasn't had any problems thus far. I'm considering an external for the upgrade, but the sound, cost, and "un-closing" of the system (water leaving the system to go to the external pump) all seem like pointers to just stick to what has worked for me thus far. Do you or any others have any ideas on lighting? I'd prefer not to go with halides due to the heat and operating expense. But any insight into LED or T5 would be great. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davelin315 February 10, 2011 Share February 10, 2011 The cyano will eventually run its course and go away, all tanks go through it and the sandbed is an ideal place for it. One thing you can do is boost your sand sifters so that the sand stays cleaner overall and less nutrients get embedded in it. As far as the lights, I don't use T5 or LED, so I can't be of much guidance here... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
epleeds February 10, 2011 Share February 10, 2011 (edited) If you plan on a custom tank, I would make it 24" wide if not 30" depending on the space u have. Makes things easier to aquascape. As for T5, if you want to get into more SPS, I would do a 6 or 8 bulb fixture. Maybe even a 10x39 watt ATI sunpower fixture and hang it over the tank. Reefgeek.com is a great resource for lighting. Edited February 10, 2011 by epleeds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supernova26 February 10, 2011 Share February 10, 2011 If you want to upgrade to LED's you will need something in a range of $600-800 for a diy fixture that can take care of SPS. (about 72LED's) I have a 8 bulb T5 TEK on my 90 that I have modded with some fans and I really like it. I can combine bulbs to get the color I want and the fixture runs cool now. I would change T5HO bulbs every 16 months if you have a good fixture that runs active cooling. Take a look at 120 gallon tanks. It will be cheaper than a custom tank and it will give you very decent real estate. You can drill it if you don't like build in overflows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Ivers February 10, 2011 Author Share February 10, 2011 The cyano will eventually run its course and go away, all tanks go through it and the sandbed is an ideal place for it. One thing you can do is boost your sand sifters so that the sand stays cleaner overall and less nutrients get embedded in it Ah, good to know, I currently have some nassarius snails and hermits as well as a brittle star to patrol the sandbed. What sort of sand sifters do you suggest? If you plan on a custom tank, I would make it 24" wide if not 30" depending on the space u have. Makes things easier to aquascape. As for T5, if you want to get into more SPS, I would do a 6 or 8 bulb fixture. Maybe even a 10x39 watt ATI sunpower fixture and hang it over the tank. Reefgeek.com is a great resource for lighting. I absolutely agree with you on wanting the 24" or 30" width, but unfortunately this tank is going in my bedroom which is located on the 2nd floor of my house, and I'm not sure I could support the weight of a 120-150 gallon tank. I am trying to get a bit more depth than 18" but less than 24" due to the weight issue, and also with an external overflow I think that the tank will stick out too far into the room allow for space to work around the tank. Do you think that I could get away with 6 or 7 T5 bulbs over a tank that was 20 inches wide? I currently run 4 54w bulbs over my 12" wide tank and I'm seeing great growth from my corals. If you want to upgrade to LED's you will need something in a range of $600-800 for a diy fixture that can take care of SPS. (about 72LED's) I have a 8 bulb T5 TEK on my 90 that I have modded with some fans and I really like it. I can combine bulbs to get the color I want and the fixture runs cool now. I would change T5HO bulbs every 16 months if you have a good fixture that runs active cooling. Take a look at 120 gallon tanks. It will be cheaper than a custom tank and it will give you very decent real estate. You can drill it if you don't like build in overflows. Thanks for the information regarding the LED's. Do you have your 8x54 TEK over a 48x24x18 90gal or a 48x18x24 90 gallon? My fixture right now has two fans that cool both sets of endcaps. I just placed an order to replace the original bulbs that came with the fixture with these bulbs: 2x ATI Blue Plus, 1x ATI Aquablue and 1x ATI Purple Plus. I was thinking about gutting the fixure and adding in a 2 or 3 bulb retrofit. But I also was curious about doing a T5/LED combo. Do you have any ideas about this? Thank you all for your interest and help, I really appreciate it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supernova26 February 10, 2011 Share February 10, 2011 My tank is 48x18x24. I don't place any SPS on the bottom due to the height but LPS do fine there. Doing a T5/LED combo could be really nice. RapidLED have 48" aluminum heat sinks that you can use. I think that if you place 2 LED strips (12 or 24 LED's per strip depending on your budget) in the middle and the T5s on the side of it it would look really nice. I was thinking of doing this once I get tired of what I have right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Ivers February 10, 2011 Author Share February 10, 2011 Wow, I'm impressed that you have fit 8 bulbs over a 18" wide tank...combined with those nice TEK reflectors and the retrofit fans, you must have a ton of PAR throughout your tank! I honestly don't have much knowledge on LED's other than their ability to replicate the PAR levels of MH lamps. What I think you're suggesting is a lighting setup that would look like this: -----T5----- -----T5----- 1.1x48" LED heatsink w/24 LEDs -----T5----- -----T5----- Is this correct? Maybe I could run all Royal Blue/Blue LED's to provide both that 20K color and a good amount of PAR and I could run T5 bulbs that had more of a 10~14K color to provide alot of PAR? On the topic of tank size, I really don't want the whole setup to stick out from the wall more than 24-28", and I think I'd be able to get a NAGA tank for around the same price as a 120 gallon tank and I really don't want to take the risk in fabricating my own external overflow on a standard glass tank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Ward February 10, 2011 Share February 10, 2011 If you're planning to do SPS, I highly recommend a glass tank instead of an acrylic tank. Scraping the coralline from acrylic without scratching it is very difficult and time consuming. You're in the neighborhood of a standard size tank, so I would definitely recommend going with a 120gal - that's 48x24x24 - either Aqueon (formerly AGA) or an Oceanic Tech tank. The Oceanic Tech will get you Starphire glass which has superior clarity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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