LED Lighting

[Mando77]

Has anyone purchased any of the new LED lighting? I was looking at these on Nanotuners.com. I was thinking about giving this a try? No Heat, low energy and the LED's last 5-6 years? I wondered how some of the newer lights looked compared to HQI. I haven't seen any tanks that have this.

[zygote2k]

I have 3 of the PAR38's lighting my 60 cube. It looks fantastic. Come by and take a look.

[Coral Hind]

There are few members that are running LED systems, both DIY and market setups. You should update your profile with your address so members that are close to you can offer up a tank tour.

 

I have seen this setup in person and it is well built, very clean, and powerful.

http://www.wamas.org/forums/topic/33700-high-powered-led-pendent-pricing/

[bankyf]

After running an led fixture for about a year and a half I can say that I can't wait to switch back to a proven light source(my new t-5 hood). I originally ran a mh/t5 hood for about a year and had no problems, but I wanted in on the newest technology so I purcashed a Solaris I-5 fixture. The fixture has worked flawlessly and the features are very impressive. My chiller hardly ever runs, it is using less electricity, I can adjust the light color at the touch of a button, it controls sunrise/sunset and moonphase and my corals, sps included are all growing nicely. Now for the down side... All of my SPS colonies are bleached out on the base and underside. LED is a very direct light source with very little reflection. Shaded areas are very dark compared to other forms of lighting and the underside of sps just can't get enough light. I strongly believe that all led fixture either need to be supplemented with another proven light source or installed at multiple different angles to encourage some reflection and increase light on the underside of corals.

[El Camaron]

i just set up a LED fixture that Robert built me, i love it, corals seem to love so far.

[SkiCurtis]

After running an led fixture for about a year and a half I can say that I can't wait to switch back to a proven light source(my new t-5 hood). I originally ran a mh/t5 hood for about a year and had no problems, but I wanted in on the newest technology so I purcashed a Solaris I-5 fixture. The fixture has worked flawlessly and the features are very impressive. My chiller hardly ever runs, it is using less electricity, I can adjust the light color at the touch of a button, it controls sunrise/sunset and moonphase and my corals, sps included are all growing nicely. Now for the down side... All of my SPS colonies are bleached out on the base and underside. LED is a very direct light source with very little reflection. Shaded areas are very dark compared to other forms of lighting and the underside of sps just can't get enough light. I strongly believe that all led fixture either need to be supplemented with another proven light source or installed at multiple different angles to encourage some reflection and increase light on the underside of corals.

Thanks for the input,I have wanted some real inputs from people that have the leds and you have the best on the market.I need to upgrade from my powercompact's but the leds are so high and have not head many real reefers talking about them.

[El Camaron]

Thanks for the input,I have wanted some real inputs from people that have the leds and you have the best on the market.I need to upgrade from my powercompact's but the leds are so high and have not head many real reefers talking about them.

 

I would not go as far as saying they are the best in the market, yes they are good but lots has changed since solaris fixtures came out. Either way anything is an upgrade from PC.

[chucelli]

LED technology for use in captive reef systems is still a relatively new concept, as such, applications of this technology still needs to mature. Note, I am not saying the actual technology needs to mature. Because LEDs output light in a very different fashion when compared with traditional metal halide or T5 lighting, design and applications need to be customized to take care of differences and utilize advantages. The problem I see currently with LEDs is the countless variables involved when attempting to apply this technology. Many simply do not understand, or still are thinking in traditional terms, like wattage, reflectors, color temp, etc...

In terms of what's best when talking component specifications, a DIY fixture (assuming you have the know-how, ability, and tools) can always be more advanced than a commercial unit, simply because the resources available to us hobbyists have grown tremendously, and you have total control over the quality and relevance of each and every component. I don't know about the most current commercial units, but I have read on various forums and heard from a few LFS owners that the Solaris units had many issues, including but not limited to different parts used over several units, LEDs actually burning out, etc..

Of the many DIY'ers, There has not been one single report of an LED failure, which is more consistent with the technology. I believe it has to do with the quality components people tend to spec out for themselves when building their own unit. Commercial companies have less reason to do so and more reason to cut corners to save production costs.

Several important things to watch for (which are not always published by the manufacture) when shopping for any LED system, are:

1. LED type and Bin.

There are mainly two trusted LED manufactures, when it comes to reef lighting, as defined by majority of LED builds. Philips and Cree. Cree currently seems the winner, as they currently have claim to the most efficient production LED on the market (lumens per watt). They have also been extremely reliable. Within any brand LED, the emitters are sent through QA and separated into bins. These bins determine the overall quality of the LED within that company's line of LEDs. Differences between the lowest performing bin and the highest can vary by more than 50%. As such, price differences between the different bins also vary greatly. This does not mean very much when it comes to commercial lighting or cutting edge flashlights, but it will matter when we are talking about lighting for a reef tank.

2. Drive current.

The amount of light a particular LED can output is directly related to how much current is running though it. The higher the max spec'd current, the more current that particular LED can handle. However, with higher currents come higher temps. Keep in mind, this is not the kind of heat that would add anything to the ambient air, but it is this relatively small amount of heat that can shorten lumen maintenance (the amount of time the LED keeps specified light output). It takes more than a 50% decrease in light output, before the human eye will register a change, so keeping the LEDs cool is key to lumen maintenance.

3. Optics in design.

choice of optics can mean the difference between 50w metal halide or a 400w metal halide, all in one LED fixture. It is perhaps one of the most important and overlooked aspects of LED lighting. LEDs do not use reflectors, as it will do little good, since the light emitter wafer in these LEDs is a tiny flat square 1-2mm in diameter. There is absolutely no light beyond the 180˚ half circle, which is why optics are used to gather that light into something less than 180˚. The tighter the angle, the more intense the light. Optic angles play a direct role in intensity vs coverage.

4. PAR output at desired color temps.

Many of the complaints regarding earlier commercial systems were related to inconsistent PAR output at a given color. This is due to the fact that these manufactures allowed end users to change overall light color through the use of dimming. The problem with this approach is that once the user has settled on desired color, the total output can be very different then the unit's factory specs. Dimming is not an efficient approach to color manipulation, since it involves running certain banks of LEDs at less than ideal efficiency rates. Modification of LED ratios is a better approach to achieve color temp (example 1:1 blue/white vs 2:3 blue/white).

I think LED technology for captive reef use is here and ready, it is the application of this technology which still needs to be explored and refined.

-Robert

Edited February 25, 2010 by chucelli

[bankyf]

You are absolutely correct about the older Solaris models, but not the I-5. I-5 was the last one they made and was actually made in America. You will have a hard time finding even one reported failure of a true I-5(some people seemed to be confused about what they have). I do have a PAR meter and my readings are comparable to people running high power MH setups. Am I maybe missing something here? Is there some fault in the Solaris or even older LED technology that causes good PAR readings but for the underside of SPS to bleach out? The fact is that every picture I have ever seen of an LED setup is much darker in the caves and shadows than the pics I see of MH or t5 setups and that has been my personal experience as well.

 

 

LED technology for use in captive reef systems is still a relatively new concept, as such, applications of this technology still needs to mature. Note, I am not saying the actual technology needs to mature. Because LEDs output light in a very different fashion when compared with traditional metal halide or T5 lighting, design and applications need to be customized to take care of differences and utilize advantages. The problem I see currently with LEDs is the countless variables involved when attempting to apply this technology. Many simply do not understand, or still are thinking in traditional terms, like wattage, reflectors, color temp, etc...

In terms of what's best when talking component specifications, a DIY fixture (assuming you have the know-how, ability, and tools) can always be more advanced than a commercial unit, simply because the resources available to us hobbyists have grown tremendously, and you have total control over the quality and relevance of each and every component. I don't know about the most current commercial units, but I have read on various forums and heard from a few LFS owners that the Solaris units had many issues, including but not limited to different parts used over several units, LEDs actually burning out, etc..

Of the many DIY'ers, There has not been one single report of an LED failure, which is more consistent with the technology. I believe it has to do with the quality components people tend to spec out for themselves when building their own unit. Commercial companies have less reason to do so and more reason to cut corners to save production costs.

Several important things to watch for (which are not always published by the manufacture) when shopping for any LED system, are:

1. LED type and Bin.

There are mainly two trusted LED manufactures, when it comes to reef lighting, as defined by majority of LED builds. Philips and Cree. Cree currently seems the winner, as they currently have claim to the most efficient production LED on the market (lumens per watt). They have also been extremely reliable. Within any brand LED, the emitters are sent through QA and separated into bins. These bins determine the overall quality of the LED within that company's line of LEDs. Differences between the lowest performing bin and the highest can vary by more than 50%. As such, price differences between the different bins also vary greatly. This does not mean very much when it comes to commercial lighting or cutting edge flashlights, but it will matter when we are talking about lighting for a reef tank.

2. Drive current.

The amount of light a particular LED can output is directly related to how much current is running though it. The higher the max spec'd current, the more current that particular LED can handle. However, with higher currents come higher temps. Keep in mind, this is not the kind of heat that would add anything to the ambient air, but it is this relatively small amount of heat that can shorten lumen maintenance (the amount of time the LED keeps specified light output). It takes more than a 50% decrease in light output, before the human eye will register a change, so keeping the LEDs cool is key to lumen maintenance.

3. Optics in design.

choice of optics can mean the difference between 50w metal halide or a 400w metal halide, all in one LED fixture. It is perhaps one of the most important and overlooked aspects of LED lighting. LEDs do not use reflectors, as it will do little good, since the light emitter wafer in these LEDs is a tiny flat square 1-2mm in diameter. There is absolutely no light beyond the 180˚ half circle, which is why optics are used to gather that light into something less than 180˚. The tighter the angle, the more intense the light. Optic angles play a direct role in intensity vs coverage.

4. PAR output at desired color temps.

Many of the complaints regarding earlier commercial systems were related to inconsistent PAR output at a given color. This is due to the fact that these manufactures allowed end users to change overall light color through the use of dimming. The problem with this approach is that once the user has settled on desired color, the total output can be very different then the unit's factory specs. Dimming is not an efficient approach to color manipulation, since it involves running certain banks of LEDs at less than ideal efficiency rates. Modification of LED ratios is a better approach to achieve color temp (example 1:1 blue/white vs 2:3 blue/white).

I think LED technology for captive reef use is here and ready, it is the application of this technology which still needs to be explored and refined.

-Robert

[chucelli]

You are absolutely correct about the older Solaris models, but not the I-5. I-5 was the last one they made and was actually made in America. You will have a hard time finding even one reported failure of a true I-5(some people seemed to be confused about what they have). I do have a PAR meter and my readings are comparable to people running high power MH setups. Am I maybe missing something here? Is there some fault in the Solaris or even older LED technology that causes good PAR readings but for the underside of SPS to bleach out? The fact is that every picture I have ever seen of an LED setup is much darker in the caves and shadows than the pics I see of MH or t5 setups and that has been my personal experience as well.

I don't think I ever argued against your point regarding bleaching undersides, or darker caves and shadows. When I was running metal halide, some of the larger colony undersides started receding also when I removed my sandbed (due to removal of the reflective bottom surface).

You are correct in that LED output tends to be more directional, which is why system specific variables need to be taken into account when drawing designs for specific setups. The same recession will be experienced in any system if you simply tilt some of your larger colonies at different angles different than what they have grown accustomed to. This effect is not LED specific, but may be more exaggerated. This is another example of fault with application and not technology. This particular problem can easily be resolved with smaller multiple fixtures providing light from more than one angle. Smaller colonies and frags will never experience the problems you mentioned since they will naturally grow to maximize surface area exposure under directional LED lighting.

Finally, I also want to add that my apprehension with commercial units is not so much with where it is manufactured, but rather the components used, and the fact that detailed specs are not usually offered to the end consumer. In addition, the lack of customizable options results in an ineffective "one size fits all" model.

-R

Edited February 25, 2010 by chucelli

[zygote2k]

Mine are great so far. With the 40 degree optics, the light is focused on the coral and not on the sand or walls where it would grow unsightly algae. The corals and fish look much better due to the high contrast that occurs with these lights. If anyone cares to see them, drop by for a look.