Interesting problem....

[madmax7774]

I have a friend who just recently joined the boards (neofish) with a 5 year old 120g fowlr system. He faithfully does a 30g water change once per month. There is roughly 175-200lbs of live rock in it and the system has been relatively stable for over 4 years. The problem is that when he bought it and set it up, the LFS sold him a wet/dry filter, and nothing else. As you may already guess, after 4 years of use, he has extremely high nitrates and phosphates. (85-100ppm nitrates depending when the test is run)

I have been working with him to get him off the wet/dry, and onto a protein skimmer/refugium setup. We put some cheato in his sump last month, and it is growing like wildfire. Already his phosphates are undetectable. He bought an octopus 150 recirc skimmer, which we are plumbing in this weekend. My question is, what is the safest way to get the wet/dry out of the system without crashing the system. I am thinking that with the age of the tank, and the volume of live rock, that we should be able to just take the wet/dry out of the loop after the protein skimmer is broken in. We are going to be adding a denitrator coil to the system as well to slowly bring down the nitrates. phospahtes are not a problem at this time, as the cheato seems to have eaten it all up. Over the last 4 months, I have given him numerous frags of various soft corals, and they are all growing really well, as they obviously like the high nutrient levels. He also added a tunze 6045 to his tank to get some circulation gowing too. His lights are T5's and for the softies that he seems to like are working well. Can anyone give me insight as to what would be the best way to remove the wet/dry from the system safely?? anyone tried to do a filtration switchover like this before?? any help is greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

John

[jnguyen4007]

It sounds like his tank is already good to go to take off the wet/dry if his nitrate is down to 0 or close to 0 and his phosphate is negligible. I would take it down for a day or two and monitor the ammonia and nitrite level. If they remain at 0 even after several days, then you know that his tank is cycled and he's good to go. JMO.

 

James

[jamal]

i used to run a canister filter and took that off with no ill effect however your friend has been running this tank for quite some time and the bacterial cultures are much more established. i would say that there really is no slow way to take it off. its like a band aid its either on the sore or it isnt. the wet dry has to go and there is no way that i can think of to remove it gradually. unless you have bioballs in there in which case you can remove those first

[Rascal]

What is his bioload in terms of fish?

If not too great I think the 175+ lbs of live rock should be able to manage things. Regardless, it probably wouldn't be a bad idea to reduce feeding for a little while and be prepared to change a lot of water if he started to see any ammonia or nitrate. Might not be a bad idea to have some carbon rinsed and ready to go too, just in case.

[flowerseller]

What is his bioload in terms of fish?

If not too great I think the 175+ lbs of live rock should be able to manage things. Regardless, it probably wouldn't be a bad idea to reduce feeding for a little while and be prepared to change a lot of water if he started to see any ammonia or nitrate. Might not be a bad idea to have some carbon rinsed and ready to go too, just in case.

 

Along my lines of thinking as well.

I use a product called "cycle" as a boost in a case like this as well.

[jnguyen4007]

Along my lines of thinking as well.

I use a product called "cycle" as a boost in a case like this as well.

 

 

Did Cycle do anything for you? I find it didn't do anything for me. A lot of folks from another site also said it didn't do anything for them either.

 

James

[madmax7774]

His nitrates aren't at zero yet, just his phosphates. His nitrates are still up around 80 ppm which is why I want to help him get the wet/dry filter out. his bioload is actually relatively small for the size of his tank, and the volume of live rock. I am thinking that you guys have the right idea, that as long as we are ready for some water changes, he should be ok. We will also be pursuing a denitrator coil to help with the nitrates over the several months.

John

Edited October 17, 2007 by madmax7774

[st9z]

madmax

 

What are you going to be using instead of the wet and dry filteration? I was thinking of switching from a canister to a wet and dry (Advice from the lfs) apparently i am getting the sense that would be a bad move in the long run after reading this post.

[dandy7200]

Remove 25% of the balls and do a 25% water change once a week for 4 weeks.

 

madmax

 

What are you going to be using instead of the wet and dry filteration? I was thinking of switching from a canister to a wet and dry (Advice from the lfs) apparently i am getting the sense that would be a bad move in the long run after reading this post.

 

Don't take advice from Wally's.

[lletellier]

Remove 25% of the balls and do a 25% water change once a week for 4 weeks.

Don't take advice from Wally's.

 

I second that, buy what you need at the LFS, learn what to buy here... they don't know what they are talking 99.9% of the time.

[madmax7774]

he is going to be using an octopus 150 recirc protein skimmer. Sahould work quite well for what he needs.

John

[YBeNormal]

I second that, buy what you need at the LFS, learn what to buy here... they don't know what they are talking 99.9% of the time.

 

True, 99% of LFS' do not know what they are talking about 99% of the time. We do have a few fantastic LFS' in our area though that are owned by fellow reefers and WAMAS Vendor Members and they offer excellent advice and service to newcomers and experienced reefers. Check out the Vendor forum if you don't know which ones I am referring to (trying my best to keep my response impartial).

[st9z]

so i am guessing wet and dry filteration system are better than canister then? What about the eheim wet and dry canister are those any good?

[NeoFish]

Suppose I should chime in as this is about my tank... Thanks to John for bringing this up and seeing what comes of it. I've been into aquariums for around 5 years - this is my first tank - of any type - so I suspect I've made and will continue to make nearly every mistake there is.

 

I'm a bit nervous about removing the wet/dry as its been in the tank for nearly 5 years now. I was told that the more surface area you have for things to grow on is a good thing - and this contraption in my sump was a great way to do that. One thing I'm a bit fuzzy on is if its good to have live rock - AKA places for things to grow, then why is a wet/dry filter in the sump an assumed 'bad' thing?

 

My wet/dry filter is 16" high, 11" wide and 11" deep. the twin over-flows drop onto a 4x8 poly filter (replaced every water change), then the top of the drip tray has crouton sized cell pore media. Below the drip tray is what I assume is a standard filter media, coiled into an 8 - 9 " diameter circle. Below the drip try is an 8"x8"x4" cell pore block. The rest is as John explained it.

 

If we add the protein skimmer and leave the wet/dry in place - is there a risk of over-taxing the skimmer? Or will things simply still be out of whack?

 

Thanks for the feedback and advice.