eddiev0008 May 18, 2015 Share May 18, 2015 Guys need help. My powder blue got ich I was able to catch all the other fish and QT with copper. I have them about a week in the qt, they have no sign of ich the bad thing is that my tang died. So wondering how long I should keep my fish in QT to make sure all the ich dies off in the DT and to make sure my fish are not carrying any more ich Ed Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YHSublime May 18, 2015 Share May 18, 2015 8 weeks is a good rule of thumb. Understand that if your end goal is no ich, you must QT EVERYTHING. Corals, snails, fish, water, sand, rock, cheato, you understand... Everything! I don't mean now, if you have removed your fish, then your display is essentially a QT for all the other things. But going forward, you would have to ensure all steps were continually followed to keep ich free. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddiev0008 May 18, 2015 Author Share May 18, 2015 Wow so if I decide to get more snails and eventually more fish since my pair of clowns didn't make it either :( I should run them on copper for 8 weeks Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddiev0008 May 18, 2015 Author Share May 18, 2015 All my corals I dip with coral dip is that enough to kill ich if the coral has it? I've never heard that coral could carry ich mm:( Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YHSublime May 18, 2015 Share May 18, 2015 All my corals I dip with coral dip is that enough to kill ich if the coral has it? I've never heard that coral could carry ich mm:( Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Anything can carry on ich, depending what stage of its life cycle it is in. No, it is not enough to just dip, that is still great best practice, and continue to do so, there is no guarantee on the ich part though. Wow so if I decide to get more snails and eventually more fish since my pair of clowns didn't make it either :( I should run them on copper for 8 weeks Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Not copper, but QT, yes. Read about the life cycle of ich, there is lots of info on WAMAS about it. Your fish will host for the ich, which is why you use copper when you QT fish for ich. A snail, for example, will die from copper, but without a fish host, the ich parasite will die, so just a qt is needed. This is why it's suggested to have separate equipment for each tank to prevent cross contamination. It's hard work, which is why I only know of 3 hobbyists that actually follow a strict, but efficient protocol. It's possible, just hard. I was in a similar situation to you, I QTd all my fish for 8 weeks. I didn't qt much of anything I added after that, but I believe it really helped. I just do t have the space, time, or patience. I find spending the money to buy from a vendor that QTs increases the odds. That being said, I have had great success with non QTd fish frequently, you just need to decide how you plan to mitigate your risks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddiev0008 May 18, 2015 Author Share May 18, 2015 Ok sounds good Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ridetheducati May 18, 2015 Share May 18, 2015 Quarantining fish is a critical step that most hobbyist do not follow. As mentioned above, a certain level of fortitude is required and I understand why following a strict QT process is the exception and not the rule. I follow a 8 - 10 week process and it takes time to fully stock an empty tank. I currently have five fish with 25 more to go. I have one QT for inverts and three QT available for fish and always have one 10g QT for fish running. It helps for those impulse buys. FWIW, I quarantine fish purchased from vendors that offer quarantined livestock. Paranoid, absolutely, I have zero patience for disease. Who is responsible for replacing livestock that were infected by a fish that came from a vendor that quarantines livestock? Also, consider the different vectors that disease can enter a system, such as inverts and sharing of sand. About 10 years ago, I had a mature 10g anemone and clownfish nano. Ordered a few snails and macro algae to add diversity; I did not quarantine the macro algae or snails. You guessed it, had ich within a week of adding the algae and snails. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jstremple May 21, 2015 Share May 21, 2015 Yes, I strongly agree with quarantining everything from all vendors. So as to not take responsibility that a vendor's tank are clear sources of white spot, some will actually tell you that white spot is always present and that your fish will only show it when they are somehow stressed. So, if your tank has a brake out, they will say it must be something you did to stress out the fish. Don't believe them if white spot present your fish WILL show some signs. If your fish don't show white spot, IT IS NOT THERE! An awesome way to QT your fish is to simply place them in hypo saline (SG 1.010 to 1.012) water for 2-3 weeks, no copper required. If your using 1.010 and the fish your QTing are not doing well just bring them up to 1.012 to 1.013 and hold them there for the QT period. Some species are very sensitive to copper like flame angles. You can just add them directly to the low saline water; no problem. Use a refractometer to get an accurate measure of your water. Once your QT period is over, your need to bring them back up to normal salinity over a period of about 4 days. Just bring them up about 0.003 per day. As far as the inverts go, just keep them in their own tank free of fish for 2 or 3 weeks. White spot's life cycle can't handle a tank with "no fish", its got to have fish for its life cycle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YHSublime May 22, 2015 Share May 22, 2015 If your fish don't show white spot, IT IS NOT THERE! This is false information. The only stage in which marine ich can be observed is during the trophont stage, which usually lasts for 3-7 days, but this does not equate to out of sight, out of mind. Marine ich also has the Tomont, Trophont, and free swimming stages, all of which you can not visibly see the Cryptocaryon Irritants (aka, marine ich.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jstremple May 23, 2015 Share May 23, 2015 It's not false information. Sorry you've missed my point. I'm talking about if the parasite is in your system, over time you will see cysts on fish AT SOME POINT, the parasite needs the fish as some point. I know they are not always visible. You've got the three stages and only one is visible. I'm saying, if you go 3 or 4 weeks and not see a cyst on a fish (especially a Regal Tang) then its not in your system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkiboy May 23, 2015 Share May 23, 2015 It's not false information. Sorry you've missed my point. I'm talking about if the parasite is in your system, over time you will see cysts on fish AT SOME POINT, the parasite needs the fish as some point. I know they are not always visible. You've got the three stages and only one is visible. I'm saying, if you go 3 or 4 weeks and not see a cyst on a fish (especially a Regal Tang) then its not in your system.this is inaccurate, sir. if willing, there are some great primers on R2R for your reference or feel free to PM me and I'd be glad to speak in detail. I do not wish to see any more folks having to deal with the unfortunate circumstances of misinformation and am always happy to assist when it comes to proper treatment procedures and protocol establishment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jstremple May 28, 2015 Share May 28, 2015 What's inaccurate?? I'm talking about white spot here. Cryptocaryon irritans is a ciliated protozoan that has to spend time on a fish a some point. If your skilled enough, you can take a small scraping of an infected fish, creating a wet mount slide that can be viewed under a microscope or if the cysts on the fish are mature enough, you'll see them with the naked eye. The different chemical treatments available tend to key on the free swimming stage, so you've got to wait for that to happen. Increasing water temperate will speed their life cycle up. After you treat the fish by what ever means you choose (copper, hypo salinity, whatever) for a full treatment period, and can't detect them AFTER several weeks after treatment they are likely gone. That's all I'm saying here. What's inaccurate about that? Are you one of those that think Crypto. is always present all the time and you can't ever get rid of it? I've been keeping marine fish since 1974. I've never seen an outbreak of this parasite unless some macro algae, live rock, invertebrates or fish were added without quarantine; generally you'll see the cyst stage on a fish within 2 to 3 weeks AFTER you've added the non quarantined animals, rock or macro algae. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkiboy May 28, 2015 Share May 28, 2015 (edited) What's inaccurate?? this is, sir: ...if the parasite is in your system, over time you will see cysts on fish AT SOME POINT. Are you one of those that think Crypto. is always present all the time and you can't ever get rid of it?no, I am not, sir. this is why we do all the hard work we do with prophylactic treatment and quarantine of fish for our customers. read up on us and our quarantine and treatment protocol when you have a moment if interested. (wamas.org/forums/topic/67727-you-scream-i-scream-we-all-scream-for-quarantine) (exoticreefcreations.com/qt-process) Edited May 28, 2015 by monkiboy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sen5241b May 29, 2015 Share May 29, 2015 One other bit of relevant information: ich is not just one parasite. There are many species, sub-species and some are far worse than others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ridetheducati May 29, 2015 Share May 29, 2015 One other bit of relevant information: ich is not just one parasite. There are many species, sub-species and some are far worse than others. Please provide sub-species and degree of difficulty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sen5241b May 29, 2015 Share May 29, 2015 Please provide sub-species and degree of difficulty. "Strain" is perhaps a better word than sub-species. "However, the extent of pathology will differ depending upon the strain of parasite, the species of fish, previous exposure to the parasite, and the temperature of the water." http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/fa164 Some strains will reproduce much faster than others which makes them worse. http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2003/12/mini Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YHSublime May 29, 2015 Share May 29, 2015 For those looking, the info cited by senB is at the end of the article to the link, and appears to be isolated incidents, none the less, a good read: Several new strains of Cryptocaryon irritans have been identified in Taiwan and other locations (Burgess & Mathews, 1995. Diggles and Adlard,1997). Highly aberrant and divergent isolates from Chiayi and Kaoshiung are of particular interest (Yambot, et al., 2003). The Chiayi isolate was discovered in a pond with a salinity of only 5ppt. This was the first recorded incidence of a Cryptocaryon irritans outbreak at such a low salinity. The Kaoshiung isolate was obtained from 12th-generation tomonts that originated from a cage at 10ppt salinity (Yambot, et al., 2003). Diggles and Lester, (1996a) suggested that the range of Cryptocaryon irritans has extended into estuaries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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