Why isn't my one tank just like the other tank??

[lanman]

Okay - back to the 'new to hobby' forum.

 

Back to basics - what am I missing? (this is long - but everyone always wants to know everything in order to make a good guess)

 

I have a 24-gallon aquapod that is perfect. The water is crystal clear, all of the readings are center-range (zero for ammonia and nitrites) - nitrates stays VERY steady at 5 ppm - no skimmer, alk perfect, pH perfect, 380 CA, etc... etc... I use B-Ionic - 6ml of each every night. Tank put together in December - long cycle for fresh live rock. Everything does well in there; My favorite monty cap has grown 1/2" in all directions since late January when I figured I could finally put some stuff in there. It gets a tiny bit of powdery algae on the sides of the tank, which I brush off easily with the scraper every few days. The good tank.

 

I have a 45-gallon tank that is a couple of months newer - but I used well-cured live rock; so it's functional age is not much less than the 24-gallon. It has a 4" sand bed and 50-60 pounds of live rock. It has a 20-gallon sump with refugium, lots of chaeto and grape caulerpa, 3" sandbed, a couple pieces of live rock (maybe 10 pounds), some snails, one mangrove that is growing nicely, etc. I added a 30-gallon frag tank to the system a few weeks ago. It has another 20 pounds of live rock in it, a fairly shallow (1") sand bed, and a bunch of frags and small corals. It has a skimmer designed for about 60-gallons, but I only have three small fish in the system. Everything seems to be growing well in this system, too. One aggressively encrusting monti digi has spread out a TON, fast-growing zoa's have grown fast, etc.

Ammonia 0-0.25, Nitrites 0.05, Nitrates ZERO (just measured everything to be sure)... But - Alkalinity is always low (1.7-2.0 meq/l (5.6dKH). pH is always a bit high (8.4). Calcium is good; 380-400. I have the main lights on for 9 hours and the actinic/actinic+ on for 11 hours. I use 20 ml of B-Ionic each evening. Lately I have increased the ALK part to about 25 ml, in hopes of raising ALK - it might be working, because it's up to 2.0 from 1.7. I use RO/DI water for top-offs and changes. I take my measurements in the evening when lights have been on for about 6-8 hours.

**I have a moderate amount of brownish-green, slimy, filamentous algae growing on anything plastic, on my gorgonian, and now I see it on the shells of most of my snails. The sides and back of the tank get it in quiet areas - the snails usually end up knocking it down. I never see it on the tank bottom (substrate), or on the rocks or other corals. The water is clear - but not as 'crystal' as the 24-gallon tank.

 

A. What might I do to get rid of the brown algae.

B. What might I do to increase my ALK and slightly lower my pH??

 

 

Thanks!

bob

[jason the filter freak]

Increase flow with a powerhead with a dispersal nozzel in the tank for the brown algea

[dandy7200]

Nothing wrong with 8.5 ph stony corals can metabolize the calcium easier at a higher ph (read grow fast).

 

Sounds like phosphates. Try feeding less or Po4 removal media.

[YBeNormal]

Algae requires (among other things) light of the proper spectrum, nitrates and phosphates to grow. Given an abundance of all three, it will take over. Starve it of one or more of these requirements and it will either grow more slowly or not at all (at least not that you will be able to see). If algae is growing in abundance, you cannot rely on the readings from test kits to determine if the cause is phosphates or nitrates as the algae is using these substances up as it grows. Assume that one or both are present.

 

I agree with Dan. Since you only have a cleanup crew and three small fish in the tank, and assuming you are not overfeeding the tank, the most likely culprit is phosphates. Try Phosban or a similar product for a while and see what happens.

[lanman]

Algae requires (among other things) light of the proper spectrum, nitrates and phosphates to grow. Given an abundance of all three, it will take over. Starve it of one or more of these requirements and it will either grow more slowly or not at all (at least not that you will be able to see). If algae is growing in abundance, you cannot rely on the readings from test kits to determine if the cause is phosphates or nitrates as the algae is using these substances up as it grows. Assume that one or both are present.

 

I agree with Dan. Since you only have a cleanup crew and three small fish in the tank, and assuming you are not overfeeding the tank, the most likely culprit is phosphates. Try Phosban or a similar product for a while and see what happens.

 

How does one go about using Phosban? I'm looking on the internet, and it appears I need a 'reactor' of some sort?? Guess I'll stop by MS tomorrow and see what they have for me. But over the long term, I guess I need to figure out where the excess phosphates are coming from.

 

Thanks,

bob

[YBeNormal]

You need something like this and a small pump such as a MJ 400 or 600. The phosphates could be coming from your water supply, in the food you feed, bound to your LR, etc.

[lanman]

You need something like this and a small pump such as a MJ 400 or 600. The phosphates could be coming from your water supply, in the food you feed, bound to your LR, etc.

 

RO/DI water - new filter - Dainichi pellets? Frozen mysis shrimp?

 

Thanks for the info; I think I might have a pump that size sitting here. I'll check on phosban and reactor tomorrow - algae gone by the weekend!

 

bob

[dandy7200]

Take it slow when using phosphate removers. The lower your alk and do funny things to water chemistry when used at full dose on a poluted system. Start with 1/3 dose and increase by a 1/3 everytime you change out the media. More than one tank has crashed when not following these steps.

[lanman]

Take it slow when using phosphate removers. The lower your alk and do funny things to water chemistry when used at full dose on a poluted system. Start with 1/3 dose and increase by a 1/3 everytime you change out the media. More than one tank has crashed when not following these steps.

 

I picked up some ROWAphos and a little filter bag to put it in. I figure I can't go much easier than that. I always try to make very gentle changes to the system. The idea of a reactor - and all of that phosphate-removing media floating around seemed kind of like overkill.

 

I hope the system wouldn't be considered polluted. It's only a modest amount of algae; and only on glass, plastic, snail shells, and my yellow gorgonian. Basically, anywhere the hermits can't scrub it off

 

I'll run a full water check tomorrow evening, after it's been in there 24 hours and see what's happening. I can't handle any lower alk - I've been working to slowly get it higher.

 

bob

[quazi]

How often are you doing water changes? Agressive water changes solves most problems by its self.

[lanman]

How often are you doing water changes? Agressive water changes solves most problems by its self.

 

Well... it's been kind of a while - because two weeks ago I added a 30-gallon frag tank to the 45-gallon tank and 20-gallon sump. With all new, fresh water. So I figured that would be a pretty good 'water change'. I am making water right now for a change tomorrow or Sunday - my first 10-gallon change. I had to go out and buy a larger container. It was easier when the system was only 60 gallons. I did a 5-gallon change weekly. Makes me appreciate the 2.5-gallon water changes in my aquapod.

 

bob

[lanman]

Just an update. I put in the filter bag full of Rowaphos about a week ago. I also cut back my lights by an hour (they were on longer than I thought). I cleaned all of the brown algae off of my frag rack, and off the powerheads yesterday - and it shows no sign of coming back today. There is none on the backs of the snails and hermits anymore - and just about the only place with brown algae is my yellow gorgonian. I'll figure out how to get it cleaned off soon - and hope it doesn't come back there, either.

 

Thanks for all of the suggestions - something seems to be working!

 

bob

[Lee Stearns]

Good news,

Bringing the alk up slowly with baking powder should also help- see the other thread on alk that I wrote in today for the formula.

I am like you- when I use rowa phos or phosban I put a lttle in a filter bag and put it in the flow area of the sump- you really do not need a reactor like many larger tanks use.

My only other comment is to make sure you are using distilled water or RO/DI water in your make up- And if RO/DI have someone nearby check the TDS (total disolved solids) of it to make sure all your filters are working correctly.

Regards,

[lanman]

Good news,

Bringing the alk up slowly with baking powder should also help- see the other thread on alk that I wrote in today for the formula.

I am like you- when I use rowa phos or phosban I put a lttle in a filter bag and put it in the flow area of the sump- you really do not need a reactor like many larger tanks use.

My only other comment is to make sure you are using distilled water or RO/DI water in your make up- And if RO/DI have someone nearby check the TDS (total disolved solids) of it to make sure all your filters are working correctly.

Regards,

I have an RO/DI filter, and the output water says 000 on the TDS meter. The algae is coming back - but it grows more slowly now - and only on plastic parts - frag rack, powerheads, etc.; and of course on gorgonians.

 

Did my first 10-gallon water change last weekend. No problem!

 

Thanks for info!

 

bob

Edited April 13, 2007 by lanman