Jstahli March 21, 2012 Share March 21, 2012 So with the warmer weather upon us I decided to get the chiller up and running. After plugging in the chiller I went to stick my hand in the tank and felt a light tingle, unplugged the chiller and no tingle. The chiller wasn't in the "chill" cycle just powered on. Can anyone offer any advice as to what I should look for? Pleas don't tell me I need to replace my 1/2 hp chiller, my wallet can't handle that right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Der ABT March 21, 2012 Share March 21, 2012 Hope its not a Teco, my inlaws are going through a VERY hard time getting theirs fixed under warranty, its not even a year old and already not working will help other find a fix if you let us know what type model etc..(obviously 1/2 hp) but who makes it, inline/drop in etc best of luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Hind March 21, 2012 Share March 21, 2012 A few questions for you. Were you using a grounding probe? Are you sure it was the chiller and not something else? If you plug the chiller into a GFCI and turn it on again do you still feel the tingle? Were you touching anything like metal that grounded you out? Do you have multimeter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jstahli March 21, 2012 Author Share March 21, 2012 It's an older inline coralife aqua chill that has only been used for one heating season. No grounding pobe, I was on an aluminum later ( I know, not the smartest) its definitely the chiller, I plugged it back in and got the tingle again. Just plugged it into a GFCI and it doesn't appear to be giving me the tingle. So not really sure what that means?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Hind March 22, 2012 Share March 22, 2012 What did you have it plugged into when you got the tingle? It sounds like that outlet is not properly grounded which is allowing the leakage to find another path to ground, you. I would investigate the outlet and also get a grounding probe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErikS March 22, 2012 Share March 22, 2012 ............ I would investigate the outlet and also get a grounding probe. Ooooh, he said grounding probe................where's my popcorn I suppose anything could happen but generally it's devices with the motor/electric element in the water that cause these problems. A chiller's motor should be isolated from the exchange coil........... The only way to know for certain is to do as outlined. Use a multileter, ground it, check the water - unplug every device until voltage goes to zero (you can go the other way, start with all off & add until you find it). In you case you may need to start with all off & use a known (or assumed) good circuit (one before the symptoms began) - rotate all devices through this outlet until it's found. If you can't find/isolate the problem it's time to start checking the circuit(s)...................you do have it on a GFCI? Right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Hind March 22, 2012 Share March 22, 2012 I suppose anything could happen but generally it's devices with the motor/electric element in the water that cause these problems. A chiller's motor should be isolated from the exchange coil........... The chiller's motor or compressor is linked to the titanium heat exchanger with copper lines. The unit is in direct contact with the water there, no isolation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Hind March 22, 2012 Share March 22, 2012 I just found the statement below from Current. I know it isn't the same maker but the problem sounds the same. Thank you for contacting Current-USA.We don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jstahli March 22, 2012 Author Share March 22, 2012 Ooooh, he said grounding probe................where's my popcorn I suppose anything could happen but generally it's devices with the motor/electric element in the water that cause these problems. A chiller's motor should be isolated from the exchange coil........... The only way to know for certain is to do as outlined. Use a multileter, ground it, check the water - unplug every device until voltage goes to zero (you can go the other way, start with all off & add until you find it). In you case you may need to start with all off & use a known (or assumed) good circuit (one before the symptoms began) - rotate all devices through this outlet until it's found. If you can't find/isolate the problem it's time to start checking the circuit(s)...................you do have it on a GFCI? Right? Everything is/was GFCI protected except for the chiller. I now have the chiller on a GFCI protected circuit as well and do not have the "tingle" in the tank anymore. If the chiller was sending out stray current, shouldn't it trip the GFCI? I tested the circuit and it seems to be working. I did unplug everything and Plug everything back in one at a time to come to the conclusion that it was the chiller creating the issue when not plugged into a GFCI. I do have a multimeter, but would need some advice on how to check the current in the tank( what setting to put it on, and do you just ground one end of the probe and stick the other one in the water?). Thanks for all the help. One other question, does the stray current effect the fish or corals at all? Thanks again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jstahli March 22, 2012 Author Share March 22, 2012 I just found the statement below from Current. I know it isn't the same maker but the problem sounds the same. Taken from: http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forums/equipment/64305-chiller-causing-electric-shock-aquarium.html#post882345 Coral hind-- Thanks for the post, I must have been typing when it came through. My chiller is inline with my return pump(genX pcx70hp), if my return pump was causing the stray current wouldn't I always have it, not just when the chiller is plugged in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Hind March 22, 2012 Share March 22, 2012 Coral hind-- Thanks for the post, I must have been typing when it came through. My chiller is inline with my return pump(genX pcx70hp), if my return pump was causing the stray current wouldn't I always have it, not just when the chiller is plugged in? I agree, I doubt it is your pump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErikS March 22, 2012 Share March 22, 2012 (edited) The chiller's motor or compressor is linked to the titanium heat exchanger with copper lines. The unit is in direct contact with the water there, no isolation. ...........For the chiller to start trasmitting electricity to its titanium coil, which is the only part that comes into contact with the water, would mean that there would be some sort of short in the compressor....... Exactly, there should be no electrical connection between the compressor & the coil - if there is it's a failure. It should be isolated. Everything is/was GFCI protected except for the chiller. I now have the chiller on a GFCI protected circuit as well and do not have the "tingle" in the tank anymore. If the chiller was sending out stray current, shouldn't it trip the GFCI? No, not without a completed circuit (path to ground) Thanks for all the help. One other question, does the stray current effect the fish or corals at all? No, just like you if you're isolated (no path to ground) fine. Like a bird on a wire, or the guys who work on really high voltage lines........path to ground? They'd be dead (well really depends on the path, but in general). They might feel the "tingle" but given the brain of a fish??? Doubt they'd notice. I do have a multimeter, but would need some advice on how to check the current in the tank( what setting to put it on, and do you just ground one end of the probe and stick the other one in the water?). Set it on volts & yes.......one to ground, the other in the tank. Reading should be near zero. Plug in or unplug devices, watch reading change = you found the culprit. Everything is/was GFCI protected except for the chiller. I now have the chiller on a GFCI protected circuit as well and do not have the "tingle" in the tank anymore. Sounds like a faulty circuit, I'd check it. Edited March 22, 2012 by ErikS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Hind March 22, 2012 Share March 22, 2012 If the chiller was sending out stray current, shouldn't it trip the GFCI? You can still feel a slight tingle if the current is below what the GFCI trip rating is. The body can feel something around 1mA but fibrillation will start to happen around 60mA. A GFCI is designed to trip at 6mA for class A and 20mA for class B. So you can see that a GFCI will save your life but there is still a range below 6mA when you would feel a mild tingle. I do have a multimeter, but would need some advice on how to check the current in the tank( what setting to put it on, and do you just ground one end of the probe and stick the other one in the water?). Put the meter on voltage and place the tip of one probe in the water and the other on a known ground. Thanks for all the help. One other question, does the stray current effect the fish or corals at all? Thanks again. Some think that HLLE is caused by stray voltages in the tank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErikS March 22, 2012 Share March 22, 2012 You can still feel a slight tingle if the current is below what the GFCI trip rating is. The body can feel something around 1mA but fibrillation will start to happen around 60mA. A GFCI is designed to trip at 6mA for class A and 20mA for class B. So you can see that a GFCI will save your life but there is still a range below 6mA when you would feel a mild tingle. Only with a complete circuit, it will not trip without one.......period. You can take two raw leads & put them in the tank - if there is no path to ground it will not trip. I do not give a rats patootie what anyone says it ain't going to happen. I've done my darndest to prove it...........& I ain't saying how. With a path to ground they'll save your arse.......done my best to prove that also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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