Boret February 1, 2008 Share February 1, 2008 Hello guys, Today I received the pH probe I ordered online for my Pinpoint pH meter. The meter has an adapter to plug in directly to an outlet so I don't have power issues. I also purchased the pinpoint pH calibrating solution (7, 10 and 4) I calibrated the meter as per the manufacturer's instructions. The water in my system gets a reading of 8.78!!! Since yesterday I added a Kalk stirrer (GSA) into the system and I'm using Mississippi Lime (kalkwasser). I have a bit less of 1" of Kalk in the stirrer. The kalk stirrer is connected to an auto top off and gets fed from the RODI water. I happened to have a container with Dschflier's water and I measured it with the pH meter and I get a reading of 8.20. What should I do?? I have a Ca Reactor I am not using per other member's recommendation. I have been reading online and one of the solutions is to add vinager. Now keep in mind that all the stuff in the tank is alive and looks to be thriving... but I am concerned that the SPS are suffering because of the high pH. This are my numbers> Temperature: 80 F pH: 8.78 Salinity: 36 SG ------ 1.0271 Alkalinity: 175 meq/l ----- between 9 and 10 Calcium: 380 ppm Nitrate: 0 mg/l Phosphate: 0 mg/l Nitrite: 0 mg/l Ammonia: 0 mg/l Any advice? Am I freaking out without a reason? Thank you, Boret Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phisigs79 February 1, 2008 Share February 1, 2008 First thing i would do is unhook the kalk reactor and let it come down on its own and then hook it back up and find out how much water your system is evaporating and then calculate how much kalk to add to the reactor. Sounds like you have alot of makeup water or there was alot of kalk that got dumped into the system when you topped it off. If the kalk reactor just added kalk to the system you will have a high ph but it should come down after a hour or so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boret February 1, 2008 Author Share February 1, 2008 First thing i would do is unhook the kalk reactor and let it come down on its own and then hook it back up and find out how much water your system is evaporating and then calculate how much kalk to add to the reactor. Sounds like you have alot of makeup water or there was alot of kalk that got dumped into the system when you topped it off. If the kalk reactor just added kalk to the system you will have a high ph but it should come down after a hour or so. OK Ill do that right now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dandy7200 February 1, 2008 Share February 1, 2008 You got some solid advice there. Also make sure your not dripping in the same area as the probe. I drip in sump and keep my probe in the display. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lletellier February 1, 2008 Share February 1, 2008 I happened to have a container with Dschflier's water and I measured it with the pH meter and I get a reading of 8.20. That makes me think something may be wrong with your probe... I don't think daves water would be that high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fab February 2, 2008 Share February 2, 2008 What is the pH of your freshwater source? ... and of your exchange saltwater? fab Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boret February 2, 2008 Author Share February 2, 2008 What is the pH of your freshwater source? ... and of your exchange saltwater? fab RO/DI Water pH 7.27 Exchange Saltwater pH 8.1 I did a 10% water change (ran out of salt) With the lights off and after removing the kalk stirrer from the loop I am at 8.68 I do have the B-ionic two part solution. Will adding just the alk one (a little bit of it) help lower the pH? Or is it the other way around? I am so confused!! Tomorrow I will try to put the fuge. That will add about 25g to the whole system. Maybe that will help. I will do another 10-20% water change and then add the fuge. That should give me close to 40g of 8.1 pH water in the system out of a total of 100~ gallons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YBeNormal February 2, 2008 Share February 2, 2008 Slow down and take a breath! Large water changes do little to correct PH issues and using additives can make the situation worse. You first need to figure out if the pH is actually that high or if the meter is reading incorrectly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lanman February 2, 2008 Share February 2, 2008 RO/DI Water pH 7.27 Exchange Saltwater pH 8.1 I did a 10% water change (ran out of salt) With the lights off and after removing the kalk stirrer from the loop I am at 8.68 I do have the B-ionic two part solution. Will adding just the alk one (a little bit of it) help lower the pH? Or is it the other way around? I am so confused!! Tomorrow I will try to put the fuge. That will add about 25g to the whole system. Maybe that will help. I will do another 10-20% water change and then add the fuge. That should give me close to 40g of 8.1 pH water in the system out of a total of 100~ gallons. And your water isn't milky?? I wouldn't panic... it's high - but I got up to 8.57 once after a small kalk error; and nothing died, nothing closed up - it was all fine within about 24 hours. But my water looked like I'd poured a glass of milk into it for a while. bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dandy7200 February 2, 2008 Share February 2, 2008 I wish I could keep my ph at 8.6 24/7 Stability is important, numbers are not so much though IME. I honest believe that people get WAY to caught up in ph values. Why is this? It is cheap and easy to electronically monitor, to bad it is not totally accurate Again, I agree with the Bob's advice and would slow down and get out the old test kit and verify the ph reading your getting. Wait a day then test again. Also, dip your probe in the kalk mixer (keep this running even if you are not dosing it) and see what the reading is of the saturated lime water. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boret February 2, 2008 Author Share February 2, 2008 I wish I could keep my ph at 8.6 24/7 Stability is important, numbers are not so much though IME. I honest believe that people get WAY to caught up in ph values. Why is this? It is cheap and easy to electronically monitor, to bad it is not totally accurate Again, I agree with the Bob's advice and would slow down and get out the old test kit and verify the ph reading your getting. Wait a day then test again. Also, dip your probe in the kalk mixer (keep this running even if you are not dosing it) and see what the reading is of the saturated lime water. Ok, I will do that. I kept the stirrer running anyway, even though I wasn't dosing just because I didn't want to have a build up at the bottom of the device. The reason I went with the pinpoint pH meter is because I couldn't figure out the color in the regular pH test kit. I didn't know if it was 8.2 or 8.4. Slow down and take a breath! Large water changes do little to correct PH issues and using additives can make the situation worse. You first need to figure out if the pH is actually that high or if the meter is reading incorrectly. Yeah I need to do that!!! This is getting too stressful!! And your water isn't milky?? I wouldn't panic... it's high - but I got up to 8.57 once after a small kalk error; and nothing died, nothing closed up - it was all fine within about 24 hours. But my water looked like I'd poured a glass of milk into it for a while. bob Nope, not milky. The meter could be off... I used the calibrating fluids, but I might have done something wrong, or the meter I got is all together out of whack. UPDATE As of 1:52AM pH is 8.47 it is slowly lowering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YBeNormal February 2, 2008 Share February 2, 2008 8.47 is not bad at all. If you haven't read it already, here is an excellent article about pH that was written by R.H Farley: The "How To" Guide to Reef Aquarium Chemistry for Beginners, Part 3: pH http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2007-05/rhf/index.php Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boret February 2, 2008 Author Share February 2, 2008 8.47 is not bad at all. If you haven't read it already, here is an excellent article about pH that was written by R.H Farley: The "How To" Guide to Reef Aquarium Chemistry for Beginners, Part 3: pH http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2007-05/rhf/index.php Great article! pH 8.32 now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boret February 2, 2008 Author Share February 2, 2008 I wish I could keep my ph at 8.6 24/7 Stability is important, numbers are not so much though IME. I honest believe that people get WAY to caught up in ph values. Why is this? It is cheap and easy to electronically monitor, to bad it is not totally accurate Again, I agree with the Bob's advice and would slow down and get out the old test kit and verify the ph reading your getting. Wait a day then test again. Also, dip your probe in the kalk mixer (keep this running even if you are not dosing it) and see what the reading is of the saturated lime water. The reading of the saturated lime water is 12.53 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fab February 2, 2008 Share February 2, 2008 (edited) The "How To" Guide to Reef Aquarium Chemistry for Beginners,Part 3: pH http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2007-05/rhf/index.php Extremely clear, practical and useful article. Thanks for passing it on. This one is a keeper. I printed it out. This article alone is worth my entire membership fee for the year. fab Edited February 2, 2008 by fab Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boret February 2, 2008 Author Share February 2, 2008 Extremely clear, practical and useful article. Thanks for passing it on. This one is a keeper. I printed it out. This article alone is worth my entire membership fee for the year. fab I completely agree Fab. After reading the article I have a much better understanding of the chemistry involved and I am not freaking out anymore about my pH. It is stable at 8.32 now, so I am going to watch it for the next few days for stability. Instead of worrying about the actual number I have to worry about controlling pH swings. Yesterday, trying to lower the pH I was really hurting my tank more than anything. Also, after reading it, it explains that water changes do very little to mod pH in the tank. Quite an interesting read indeed!! Thank you YBeNormal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fab February 2, 2008 Share February 2, 2008 I think the article says not to be hung up too much on stability within a daily cycle. Rather make sure you have good buffering and aeration. Then look for long term stability, day-to-day stability, allowing for intra-day swings. Interestingly the article suggests that even fairly large intra-day pH swings can be perfectly acceptable. fab Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YBeNormal February 2, 2008 Share February 2, 2008 My read on pH stability and the point I believe is implied in the article is that pH varying throughout the day is not an issue since it is gradual (and BTW, fish cannot "read" pH anyway). This does not mean that very wide and very quick swings are OK though. If your water chemistry is in order and especially if you have high alk and alternate lighting between your tank and refugium, pH swings should be relatively minor--let's say within two to four tenths. Wide swings, even if within the tolerable min and max pH ranges suggested in the article, are a sign that something is not balanced and is may be cause for further research but not necessarily grounds for panic. This is just my opinion and based on my experiences though. I'd love to hear other thoughts on this topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dandy7200 February 2, 2008 Share February 2, 2008 For more information on kalk and ph you can look at the bottom of my kalk stirrer page on my website and see the linked articles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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