jason the filter freak January 29, 2018 Share January 29, 2018 I read though a lot of the Randall Holmes articles and I'm a bit lost... a lot lost. I've been doing 25% water changes roughly monthly and can't seem to get my pH much over 7.7 (according to API test kit and <1 no old dbl junction and calibrated pH probe on an apex.) My Ca and Alk are also a bit low. It's an IM Fusion 40 gal with a small amount of SPS and LPS that I'm hoping to increase. I wasn't going to dose mag figuring my water changes would fix that in a small tank. My ATO is run by a peristaltic pump and I have two 1.1mL BRS pumps for my two part. I have sodium carbonate and calcium chloride because that was what I was told was needed. I probably see 3ish gal of evap a week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbyatv January 29, 2018 Share January 29, 2018 I read though a lot of the Randall Holmes articles and I'm a bit lost... a lot lost. I've been doing 25% water changes roughly monthly and can't seem to get my pH much over 7.7 (according to API test kit and <1 no old dbl junction and calibrated pH probe on an apex.) My Ca and Alk are also a bit low. It's an IM Fusion 40 gal with a small amount of SPS and LPS that I'm hoping to increase. I wasn't going to dose mag figuring my water changes would fix that in a small tank. My ATO is run by a peristaltic pump and I have two 1.1mL BRS pumps for my two part. I have sodium carbonate and calcium chloride because that was what I was told was needed. I probably see 3ish gal of evap a week. Jason, Here is a link to an article I wrote that might assist. If you read through it, I talk about good ways to achieve stable parameters with Kalk only on a small tank. https://reefs.com/magazine/the-kalk-calc-combo-method-185.html/ Good Luck, Bruce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason the filter freak January 29, 2018 Author Share January 29, 2018 Params Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami January 30, 2018 Share January 30, 2018 I can't make heads or tails of your parameters because the image is like a thumbnail and won't blow up enough when selected. Low alk can be behind your low pH. I'd be more concerned that your test kit is at fault, though. Sodium Carbonate dosing can help raise the pH because it vacuums up free dissolved CO2 in the water. Kalk will do the same. Kalk in your ATO is a standard means of adding calcium and alkalinity in balanced proportions to a tank. However, Bruce's method offers additional failsafes and more predicatable dosing that is not as susceptible to seasonal variations in evaporation. Before making too many adjustments, I'd recommend that you seek to get an accurate pH measurement and possibly another alkalinity test kit. Magnesium is probably not the issue here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami January 30, 2018 Share January 30, 2018 Low pH may also come about in a well sealed indoor environment with an elevated concentration of CO2. BTW, what about RHF's articles is confusing you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Country January 30, 2018 Share January 30, 2018 How much two part are you dosing on a daily basis? You may actually be overdosing and driving your calcium and alkalinity levels lower. With just a few corals just starting I would guess the dose should be around 10 - 15ml per day of 2 part for a 40g tank Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason the filter freak January 31, 2018 Author Share January 31, 2018 I have not started 2 part dosing at all. I was trying to figure it all out before jumping in. But some of my corals are looking pretty unhappy when the rest of my params are good. I have a essentially non buffering sand bed which may be part of the problem (black non carbonate sand) How much two part are you dosing on a daily basis? You may actually be overdosing and driving your calcium and alkalinity levels lower. With just a few corals just starting I would guess the dose should be around 10 - 15ml per day of 2 part for a 40g tank Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason the filter freak January 31, 2018 Author Share January 31, 2018 The tank is out in the most open part of a 2000sq/ft house near the front door actually and it is definitely not a well sealed house. Florida+summer AC bills suck:(. Low pH may also come about in a well sealed indoor environment with an elevated concentration of CO2. BTW, what about RHF's articles is confusing you? Low pH may also come about in a well sealed indoor environment with an elevated concentration of CO2. BTW, what about RHF's articles is confusing you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason the filter freak January 31, 2018 Author Share January 31, 2018 Before making too many adjustments, I'd recommend that you seek to get an accurate pH measurement and possibly another alkalinity test kit. Magnesium is probably not the issue here. I will try and repost the params. I'll retest again today or tomorrow. I am using both a Redsea foundations test kit and Hanna Checkers and letting the apex software plot both and give me an average. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami January 31, 2018 Share January 31, 2018 For pH, do the following extra test if you're able: Take a water sample. Test and record the (before) pH. If you have an air pump and air stone, aerate the sample for 15 minutes outdoors. If you don't have those, find another way to aerate it (blender?) in a fresh air environment. Now, test and record the (after) pH. Note the difference and report back. If your low pH is coming from the tank being in a high-CO2 environment, then that will point us one way. If not, it may indicate something else. Also, if you've got some premixed saltwater sitting around, measure the pH of that as well under the same conditions as listed above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason the filter freak February 1, 2018 Author Share February 1, 2018 PH not appreciably different. I only mix saltwater the night before changes with an old maximod on a mj1200 so it causes plenty of mixing/agitation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason the filter freak February 1, 2018 Author Share February 1, 2018 So my Ca and Alk are roughly in range, though I should try out a bit farther from a water change. But my pH is low and my SPS and LPS have recently started receeding/one month is losing tissue. The rest of my chemistry params are in range :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami February 1, 2018 Share February 1, 2018 PH not appreciably different. I only mix saltwater the night before changes with an old maximod on a mj1200 so it causes plenty of mixing/agitation You're agitating in fresh air (outside)? The test is to determine if the pH is low because of high ambient CO2, which would normally be a condition found indoors. Agitating (aerating) outdoors (for the test) is a diagnostic test used to help identify causes of low pH in tank water. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami February 1, 2018 Share February 1, 2018 I've recently discovered high nickel content (20x max, 40x normal seawater) in my tank. Apparently, I have a rare-earth magnet deteriorating somewhere. That's my guess at least. Lost a few corals, too. That's what got me looking. I'm still not sure if nickel is harmful to corals. As a heavy metal, I'm guessing that it is for some, at least. Still haven't found the nickel source but have been trying to forestall any further losses through massive and frequent water changes. So it's possible that something else is out of whack in your tank - something that's not being tested. pH is normally one parameter that I track, but am never really ever very concerned about in terms of absolute value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Ford February 2, 2018 Share February 2, 2018 Sorry to derail the thread.. Have you tried a poly pad to see if it will absorb the nickel? They say they absorb copper and other heavy metals. I have never used one myself. I've recently discovered high nickel content (20x max, 40x normal seawater) in my tank. Apparently, I have a rare-earth magnet deteriorating somewhere. That's my guess at least. Lost a few corals, too. That's what got me looking. I'm still not sure if nickel is harmful to corals. As a heavy metal, I'm guessing that it is for some, at least. Still haven't found the nickel source but have been trying to forestall any further losses through massive and frequent water changes. So it's possible that something else is out of whack in your tank - something that's not being tested. pH is normally one parameter that I track, but am never really ever very concerned about in terms of absolute value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami February 2, 2018 Share February 2, 2018 Sorry to derail the thread.. Have you tried a poly pad to see if it will absorb the nickel? They say they absorb copper and other heavy metals. I have never used one myself. Yes, but the intervention had no effect. I wondered, at first, if it was copper poisoning. My tests came up negative, but I put a polyfilter on anyway, just in case it was something that a polyfilter could pick up. The polyfilter remained unchanged after more than a week in place. Note also that none of the test data for polyfilters relate to nickel, though. Back to Jason't thread.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason the filter freak February 2, 2018 Author Share February 2, 2018 I've recently discovered high nickel content (20x max, 40x normal seawater) in my tank. Apparently, I have a rare-earth magnet deteriorating somewhere. That's my guess at least. Lost a few corals, too. That's what got me looking. I'm still not sure if nickel is harmful to corals. As a heavy metal, I'm guessing that it is for some, at least. Still haven't found the nickel source but have been trying to forestall any further losses through massive and frequent water changes. So it's possible that something else is out of whack in your tank - something that's not being tested. pH is normally one parameter that I track, but am never really ever very concerned about in terms of absolute value. 1. How did you test for that? 2. I'm 100% sure I have a degrading rare earth magnet inside of my biopellet reactor. I ignored it as I figured it would just be a cosmetic issue (maybe its why I've lost a few inverts too : ( . For mixing and aerating the water in a fresh air environment there was no appreciable difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami February 2, 2018 Share February 2, 2018 I had to send a water sample in for an ICP-OES (Inductively-coupled Plasma - Optical Emission Spectroscopy) test. I purchased ATI-Aquaristik tests from saltwateraquarium.com (one of our sponsors) and, about a week or so later had the test results back. I sent in a sample of my unfiltered well water, too, for comparison. (They test both one FW sample and your tank water for the price of one test.) That showed that I had crazy high levels of nickel and that it wasn't coming from my well. If your fresh air test gave no appreciable difference, then my first inclination is to suspect a bad test. You said in your first post that you had a calibrated pH probe. Are you confident that your calibration solutions are still good? The three most common solutions are pH 4.0, 7.0 and 10.0. However, while the 4.0 and 7.0 solutions have a decent shelf life, the 10.0 solution is the more likely of the three to degrade with time and exposure to air. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason the filter freak February 3, 2018 Author Share February 3, 2018 The calibration solutions were brand new from BRS as is the double junction probe. pH 4.0 isn't used is tank pH meters typically just Ca reactors as I understand it. I had new pinpoint solution from BRS that I opened just for calibrating this probe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami February 4, 2018 Share February 4, 2018 Sounds good. Low alk is the more likely issue. Do you vary your test time by chance? Do you see higher pH before the lights go out and lower just before they turn on? Less likely alternatives that come to mind include accumulating organic acids and accumulating nitrates. If a taped a white sheet of paper at one end appears yellow when viewed through the tank lengthwise, it could be accumulating organics. This yellowing is caused by gelbstoff (yellow material in German). Carbon is pretty effective at removing gelbstoff. Accumulating nitrates can cause lowered pH as its a sign of an incomplete nitrate cycle where the final step of converting nitrates to nitrogen is not happening fast enough. This causes a net loss of one unit of alkalinity, reducing buffering capacity. Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason the filter freak February 4, 2018 Author Share February 4, 2018 The pH is tracked by my apex. I don't usually use a test kit to back it up. I do check my Hanna Checkers against my test kit though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Origami February 4, 2018 Share February 4, 2018 What sort of diurnal swing do you see in pH? Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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