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closed loop plumbing


treesprite

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The used 120 I bought is drilled for a closed loop. I have wanted a closed loop tank for several years, so assuming that I can uncap the holes which were capped by previous owner, I need to ask some questions.

 

There are 6 holes in the tank, 5 of which are 1" bulkheads and one of which is 1.5". I don't know which hole(s)  go to the pump. The 1.5 is all the way in an upper corner,  so I'm assuming it's the hole for the sump. So which should be used to feed the pump? Will I need to use 2 plumbed together since they are all only 1"? I can use an over-the back return for sump, so not going to take up a hole for that.

 

Adding attachment pic.

post-1671-0-74614800-1434764914_thumb.jpg

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(edited)

Would like suggestions on how to do the pipes.. I am assuming I should use flex at the pump to reduce vibration. I plan to use valves everywhere.

 

This tank is going to take a lot of work. I have to clean it; remove caps and 1 bulkhead (pipe was cut so I can't attach new pipe); need to replace silicon; need to build a stand; need to figure out overflow because the center brace makes a C2C impossible. I haven't had a challenging aquarium project for a while, so it should be fun (in an aquarium geek sort of way).

Edited by treesprite
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I was going to use a pump I already have. I thought the intake was 1.5 but it's only 1". I'm assuming that would man that if I need to use 2 of the 1" holes, I will need to use a different pump. Which also brings me to the question of what size pump would be best as far as gph?

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(edited)

Could I use a single hole if I used 3/4" nozzles on 4 1" returns?

 

Keep in mind that I'm just throwing my thoughts around while having no CL experience.

Edited by treesprite
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One picture I saw used the lower holes for pump feeds and upper holes for returns, but it only had 2 lower holes and then the upper returns were only 3/4". Should I be using all three lower 1" holes to the pump, since the return holes are also 1"? Maybe that sounds more logical, I just like the idea of having lower returns.

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looks like one drain, 4 returns.

keep it simple- run it with a sump and an external pump that is split into 4 returns. hard pipe looks the best and is easy. use a check valve too!

I'd replace all bulkheads and cover them with silicone on the inside of the tank to ensure water tight seal.

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(edited)

That's basically what I am doing in the 75, but with returns over the top of the tank. There is so much water noise from using a big pump in an open sump, and the flow through the sump is too high for the skimmer*. I can deal with a pump noise, but the water noise is really annoying. Right now I can get away without use of powerheads, but going to a 120 I will not be able to do that without a closed loop. *(I just read a bunch of stuff about sump flow and skimmer, otherwise I'd probably not even be thinking about it).

 

Of course then I am back to the problem of the holes. Makes me think I need to make the center hole larger and add a second one so I can have 4 CL returns. I also think I should drill another hole for the sump, because only one is asking for trouble if a snail gets in there. How hard is it to drill a 1.5" hole around a 1" hole?

Edited by treesprite
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 My current tank does not have a CL, just a pump in the sump with returns over the top of the tank back. I would not use over-the-tank returns for a CL, though people do it all the time. Power outage won't cause a flood with a closed loop, but then neither will having a pump in a sump that has enough space for back-flow and has holes in the returns just below the water surface.

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I think I will practice on a small tank. I have a 16 bow which I drilled a few years ago with a center of tank hole and 2 upper holes. I don't know what I was thinking when I drilled that center hole, but it's in the right place for a pump feed. Pretty sure I have a small pump somewhere.

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  • 4 weeks later...
(edited)

I'm still not 100% sure if I should do the closed loop. I want to, but am starting to have second thoughts about it. 

 

If I do the closed loop and decide after the tank is running that I don;t want it, could I just cap off the holes from outside of the tank? Of course I will have valves, so I would be capping from the point after them and just have them sticking out of the back of the tank. Are there any details to consider if this is what I decide to do?

 

I really don't want to have to powerheads in the tank.

Edited by treesprite
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(edited)

I think its the center hole is the closed loop source and the one to the left and the one to the right are the returns for the closed loop.  The top 2 are the returns from the sump. And the 1.5 in hole is the return to the sump. pretty wild setup for sure but could be pretty rad!

 

Edit: Adding Picture

 

post-1671-0-74614800-14347649141_zpsxplh

Edited by sethsolomon
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Closed loop is pretty cool and can end up with a very clean look.  You'd have to have a pump for it other than your return pump because if it's going to be a closed loop it can't run through the sump, but you probably already know that.  If it runs through the sump, then you have the possibility of siphoning everything down to the lowest hole if a check valve fails.  Rob is right that you should get rid of current bulkheads and replace them while you have the chance too. 

 

I agree that I'd really like having no visible powerheads in my tank.  Maybe my next one will have a couple of those Tunze rocks that hide the powerheads.

 

What Seth says sounds right as far as which were intended to be drains, returns, and closed loop supplies and returns.  You should either do closed loop for the lower three or block them completely with bulkheads with PVC caps glued in the holes. 

 

Or you could always put a pipe off one of them with a ball valve and a long piece of hose so you'd have a really easy way to drain water out for water changes. 8)

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How often do people think bulkheads need to be replaced? I have the option of setting up a tank that would come drilled for a closed loop, but it's also been suggested to me that I cover the holes with glass panels instead of capping in case the bulkheads should ever leak. I'm, too, and wondering if I should use the existing closed loop design or seal it up.

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Ooh, glass panels is fancy.  I guess that is better, but bulkheads are designed to seal and you'd be trusting your ability to smoosh a good seal into the glass and silicone if you did it that way. It would probably work.  Personally I'd use a plugged bulkhead.

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The previous owner plugged the holes because he didn't want to do closed loop. I'm not sure if it would be easier to remove the plugs or the bulkheads. I've been in situations with bulkheads that were impossible to remove, so I really don't want to try removing the current ones unless

i have absolutely no other choice.

 

The stuff I was reading about CL has me confused with this tank's holes. Isn't the feed supposed to be larger than the returns. or else have more than one feed of the same size of the returns? Or perhaps is it just that the returns shouldn't be as much force as the feed, so the feed doesn't have to be bigger when there are only 2 returns for it? 

 

I guess the first thing I need to do is see if I can remove the plugs.

The second thing is drill another sump hole, because having only one is too risky and doesn't allow sufficient control. It would be great if I don't have to do any additional drilling for CL.

Then I have to make an overflow - not sure exactly what to do with this tank.  I guess that will be a different thread topic.

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